State of Scottish Golf

[Brian_Ewen]

I think as most members know, I am pretty pessimistic when it comes to the future of Scottish Golf, but even I was surprised this week at the entry level for this years Scottish Boys Matchplay, compared to past years.

Scottish boys' match-play championship entries since 2007
2007 Dunbar               Ballot 5.5     96 Reserves on Waiting list  
2008 Southerness       Ballot 5.4     54 Reserves  on Waiting list
2009 Royal Aberdeen Ballot 5.5     34 Reserves on Waiting list
2010 West Kilbride     Ballot 5.5     24 Reserves on Waiting list
2011 Dunbar               Ballot 5.5     26 Reserves on Waiting list
2012 Murcar Links      Ballot 5.8     14 Reserves on Waiting list
2013 Monifieth           No Ballot      Only 255 Entries -  No Reserves.

[Mark Chaplin]

A practise round plus potentially 4 or 5 nights away from home for a parent and boy. I'd say the entry is a reflection on the economy rather than golf.

[Mark Pearce]

Perhaps, also, those with handicaps of 6 or more have finally realised the futility of entering when they won't get a slot.  Is any information available as to the handicaps of those 255 boys?

[Brian_Ewen]

Not with handicaps Mark.

http://www.golfbox.dk/livescoring/participants.asp?tour={BC226CD8-A751-4AE4-B9DB-9392274D7F7F}&grp=1&clubOnly=1&color=1&lang=2057

We cant keep on blaming the economy IMO.

But I do come from the Aberdeen area which is in the middle of an economic boom just now, so ..... ?

[Mark Pearce]

Interesting list.  I see two lads I know from Elie (one playing from a different home club) but not a number of other lads who have handicaps of 5 or better, who I suspect are away on holiday, this being the middle of the Easter school holidays.  Might there be a reaction here to the miserable winter, as parents seek warmth?

[Brian_Ewen]

If I remember, last years event at Murcar also had some nasty weather.

The modern day Scottish Youths getting soft ?

[Dónal Ó Ceallaigh]

255 seems like a very big field. What is the limit; 256?

Why so many? It's great business for the hotels and B&Bs, but surely they could limit the field to 128. I don't think any Irish championship (Boys, Youths or Senior) has a field of 250+

[Tom Kelly]

255 seems like a very big field. What is the limit; 256?

Why so many? It's great business for the hotels and B&Bs, but surely they could limit the field to 128. I don't think any Irish championship (Boys, Youths or Senior) has a field of 250+

That was my first impression too. Mark's comment about 6+ handicaps not bothering entering probably rings fairly true too. I know I've been in a similar situation in the past and not bothered.

[Mark Bourgeois]

Declining birth rates? Brian how about rate stats to go along with the counting stats above? Not challenging your premise just looking for more info.

[Brian_Ewen]

Scottish Boys Championship 2013 - HD

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RSLY_gp5zQ

[Jon Wiggett]

Brian,

I think the biggest question on the state of Scottish golf must be why are so few of the juniors capable of carrying?

Jon

[David_Tepper]

Isn't the first weekend in April a little early in the year to be holding a national championship? I realize golf in Scotland is played year round, but I question holding an event so early in the golf "season." Have the players really had a chance to practice & play enough at that point in the year to be playing anywhere close to their best golf?

[Jon Wiggett]

David,

as the temperatures in early April regularly peaks above freezing it is classed as high summer here surely you know that

That's a good point though, does seem a little early.

Jon

[Kris Shreiner]

Motorized pull carts for the juniors...that's pathetic and as soft as it gets. The cart companies have weaseled their way in and the administrative bodies are complicit. Sad. They are being accepted elsewhere as well. Guess full cart use can't be far behind. The fitness component appears to be losing its place in the modern game. Let's see, this in an era of record obesity for most Western nations. Just wonderful.

Regrets,
Kris

[Rich Goodale]

Get rid of caddies and motorised pull carts for the non-juniors (including pros) and this problem will be solved.  Tiger will win at least 10 more majors if all players have to carry their own balls and implements.  Can you imagine Mickeleson or Westwood or Cabrera or Scott carrying, rather than employing a butler?

[Ally Mcintosh]

Get rid of caddies and motorised pull carts for the non-juniors (including pros) and this problem will be solved.  Tiger will win at least 10 more majors if all players have to carry their own balls and implements.  Can you imagine Mickeleson or Westwood or Cabrera or Scott carrying, rather than employing a butler?

I'm for this.

It'll be a form of self-handicapping as well: The pros will have to decide which implements they can do without if they don't want to carry around the portable camper-vans that are currently lugged around on their behalf.

[Rich Goodale]

Thanks, Ally.  You impove upon my argument.

[Jon Wiggett]

Rich,

I know for a fact that Mr. Westwood carries his own clubs during his recreational golf. Rich, the problem of juniors using trolleys has more to do with their clubs and the golfing authorities than the professional players.

Ally, when you are carrying for two (player/caddy) you need a certain amount of storage but the main reason for such big bags is the size of the adverts you can get on them. I guess you never watch golf on TV then

Jon

[Paul Gray]

Rich,

I know for a fact that Mr. Westwood carries his own clubs during his recreational golf. Rich, the problem of juniors using trolleys has more to do with their clubs and the golfing authorities than the professional players.

Ally, when you are carrying for two (player/caddy) you need a certain amount of storage but the main reason for such big bags is the size of the adverts you can get on them. I guess you never watch golf on TV then

Jon

I've started a campaign of abuse towards the seventeen year old (who might well be reading this) in our pro shop that regularly plays with full tour bag and electric trolley. I'm playing with him tomorrow and expect to see him carrying! 

[Carl Johnson]

Motorized pull carts for the juniors...that's pathetic and as soft as it gets. The cart companies have weaseled their way in and the administrative bodies are complicit. Sad. They are being accepted elsewhere as well. Guess full cart use can't be far behind. The fitness component appears to be losing its place in the modern game. Let's see, this in an era of record obesity for most Western nations. Just wonderful.

Regrets,
Kris

Walking vs. ridding a cart/buggy, I can see.  But what's the "fitness" difference between taking a caddy, which many on this site regard as the peak of the true golf experience, and using a motorized (or not) "pull cart".  (Not to say, Kris, that you believe it's all right for juniors to use caddies - don't know about that.)  Moreover, what about the player (of any age) who does substantial aerobic excercise, works out his muscles, and is fit by any stretch, yet prefers to play golf with a motorized trolley?  Isn't that just a caddy without a brain (no humor intended).  From my point of view, golf is not particularly a fitness sport.  It's not quite as "soft" as bowling, shooting or billiards, but walking a golf course, even carrying your own bag, while better than sitting on the couch, is not going to make you really fit.

[Jon Wiggett]

Rich,

I know for a fact that Mr. Westwood carries his own clubs during his recreational golf. Rich, the problem of juniors using trolleys has more to do with their clubs and the golfing authorities than the professional players.

Ally, when you are carrying for two (player/caddy) you need a certain amount of storage but the main reason for such big bags is the size of the adverts you can get on them. I guess you never watch golf on TV then

Jon

I've started a campaign of abuse towards the seventeen year old (who might well be reading this) in our pro shop that regularly plays with full tour bag and electric trolley. I'm playing with him tomorrow and expect to see him carrying! 

Good on you Paul. I suppose you have told him he has to carry?

Jon

[David_Tepper]

Some of the comments on this thread have truly surprised me. Instead of showing some respect and admiration for the 2 young men who survived 7 rounds of match play in 5 days to reach the 36-hole final (one for the 2nd year in a row), this thread has elicited several snide, Colonel Blimp-ish comments about the size of their golf bags and the fact that they use motorized trolleys. If that is the kind of reaction such accomplished young golfers can expect to receive from their golfing elders (who really should know better), no wonder so many young people are turned off by the game.

The two finalist were playing 36-holes for a national championship, their 8th & 9th rounds of competitive golf in a 6-day period. If one of their buddies had caddied for each of them in the finals or if their fathers had pushed their clubs along on a trolley, would that have been "pathetic and soft?"

I seriously doubt the finalists at either the US AM or the Junior Am carried their own bags. I know the finalists at the US Junior Girls did not. Why should anyone expect these young men to do otherwise?
 

 

[Jon Wiggett]

David,

I do not find 7 rounds in 5 days to be such a stain for players that age. I often used to play 54 holes a day during the school holidays.

I truly believe that a trolley, motorised or not is only there to be used if you are physically not able to get round without one. It maybe old fashioned but I do not believe juniors or under 25s (was the rule at my first club) should be allowed to use a trolley unless they physically need one.

Having watched the footage the standard of play was high, oh to be still able to hole putts like that but the sight of the trolleys just took the edge of it for me. My prejudice I know.

Jon

[Rich Goodale]

Rich,

I know for a fact that Mr. Westwood carries his own clubs during his recreational golf. Rich, the problem of juniors using trolleys has more to do with their clubs and the golfing authorities than the professional players.

Ally, when you are carrying for two (player/caddy) you need a certain amount of storage but the main reason for such big bags is the size of the adverts you can get on them. I guess you never watch golf on TV then

Jon

Jon

I do not doubt that Mr. Westwood carries when on holiday.  I do doubt, however, that he could carry 4 consecutive stressful rounds at Augusta without having some sort of medical/golfing event.

Rich

PS--drove by your place on Friday on my way to Lochinver and Kylesku.  I'll drop by next time I'm in the area, now that I know where your place is.

rfg

[Jon Wiggett]

Rich,

I recon Mr. Westwood probably would manage the four rounds just fine though I bet he would opt for a smaller and much lighter bag

Look forward to seeing you when you are in the area just let me know a day or so in advance so I can make time to show you around.

Jon