[Ben Jarvis]

Royal Melbourne is hosting the Australian Masters for the first time this November (14-17).

Lets hope the venue attracts more world class golfers to our shores.

http://www.pga.org.au/article-display/royal-melbourne-to-host-aus-masters-for-first-time/135568

[Mark_F]

Let's just hope it attracts all the Australian golfers first, Ben. 

[Mark Bourgeois]

What a disappointment! Anybody know if Geoff can be shipped in for this? That will help cushion the blow.

[Chris Kane]

The quality of the field is likely to be very poor, with the exception of three top 25 players on $300k+ for the week in appearance money. Why would it be any different to last year (a field equal to a second-tier Aussie Tour event plus Scott, Poulter and McDowell, with half the world top 100 tweeting about how superb the course looked on television)?

Professional golfers play for money, not to play great courses. $1 million and Royal Melbourne won't be able to compete with the $8 million European Tour event in Dubai. That leaves the Americans, who are even less inclined to travel!

[Sean Walsh]

I can't believe the Australian Golfing authorities in conjunction with Major Events Victoria can't negotiate some suitable outcome with The European Tour.  A Euro Tour event would attract a lot of eyeballs for less than 1/10th of the investment of the Melbourne GP. 

Get the Euro Tour Stamp and $5mill in prize money and it's well on the way to becoming a world class event.

[BHoover]

I can't believe the Australian Golfing authorities in conjunction with Major Events Victoria can't negotiate some suitable outcome with The European Tour.  A Euro Tour event would attract a lot of eyeballs for less than 1/10th of the investment of the Melbourne GP. 

Get the Euro Tour Stamp and $5mill in prize money and it's well on the way to becoming a world class event.

Totally agree. Considering the history of the event and the courses on which it is held, I would like to see it enjoy a prominent place on the annual golf calendar. In my opinion, I even think it should be a major. How about even making it one of the WGC events?

[Chris Kane]

I wish you were right Sean.

The Masters was a European Tour event for a few years in the mid 2000's at Huntingdale, and had a funereal atmosphere by the end.
The Heineken Classic , on the face of it a very successful European Tour event at RMHC from 2002-05, lost money every year and was wound up.
The Perth International, our current European Tour event, is quite a good tournament but hardly a world-class tournament.

When the world's top 50 players can play for a $5 million + purse most weeks, and guaranteed big money during the silly season, increasing the purse with taxpayer dollars won't have much impact. The problem is that if you put up $5 million, it takes that again and possibly more in appearance money to get a decent field. Good luck selling that concept to Neil Mitchell!

[Mark_F]

A Euro Tour event would attract a lot of eyeballs for less than 1/10th of the investment of the Melbourne GP. 

On what basis are you proffering that sort of nonsense Sean?  Golf is a minority sport no matter who plays.  Formula One most definitely is not.

[Sean Walsh]

Chris,

The Euro Tour is in a unique position right now to truly challenge the PGA Tour and be considered its equal.  If only they'd realise it.  The PGA Tour having decided to become a law unto itself has strengthened the Euro's bargaining position.  This is In conjunction with the quality of players in the ROW being as good or better than the USA's deep talent pool for the first time in at least 60 years and The US economy having trouble getting into second gear.  They just need to grasp the nettle.

What do we pay for the Grand Prix?  50mil+ for the rights, plus construction/set up every year, plus extra police and security costs.  If it's not well north of 65mill I'd be suprised. 6.5mill used well and with the Euro Tour would substantially increase sponsorship.  As for losses that's all down to what the govt is prepared to accept for the promotion of the state for tourism purposes. They lose plenty on the GP (of which I was once an ardent supporter), the last two contracts have increased the cost of doing business with F1 beyond breaking point.

Mark,

Oh i see this is a demarcation dispute. I'm encroaching on your near monopolisation of the ability to proffer nonsense, for that I apologise. In future if you find such little value in my posts feel free to ignore them.   





   

[Mark_F]

Oh i see this is a demarcation dispute. I'm encroaching on your near monopolisation of the ability to proffer nonsense, for that I apologise. In future if you find such little value in my posts feel free to ignore them.   

Nice to see nothing has changed Sean, you're still a miserable prick. 

As for proffering nonsense, it's impossible to go past this gem:

The Euro Tour is in a unique position right now to truly challenge the PGA Tour and be considered its equal.  This is In conjunction with the quality of players in the ROW being as good or better than the USA's deep talent pool for the first time in at least 60 years and The US economy having trouble getting into second gear. 

Truly classic stuff. 

When has the US economy made it out of second gear the last forty years?

How many Euro events do the better players enter when you take out the WGCs and the Majors?   Where do McIlroy, Westwood, Els, McDowell, Donald and Poulter live and predominantly play?

How many Euro events have disappeared from Spain, Germany and the UK the past few years?  How many are they playing instead in those golfing meccas Delhi, Russia, Morocco and Malaysia, where rabid crowds are ten deep along the fairways?

You could have a twenty million dollar golf event here and it would still have negligible impact beyond a few bored and pussy whipped husbands lazily scratching their balls in front of the telly for a few minutes on the Sunday whilst their wives blow the Hire a Hubby handyman in the laundry. The Grand Prix has quite probably outlived its usefulness, but to suggest anyone outside a few bored country coppers would tune in is sheer lunacy.

[Brett_Morrissy]

I do not know anyone that has been to the Melb Grand Prix for at least 5 years, and am tired of hearing ho wone bloke gets a large slab of cash from the govt to put this event on - plenty would go to a golf event that had $20-30m spent on it, without a kingpin pocketing our cash.

...and surely this kind of large golf event appeals to at least the same tv audience? But I also think there is a much bigger issue here waiting to be developed, that is a lot more kids would take up golf if the top 64 players were here on the sandbelt every year. how many kids are out there trying to become F1 drivers? - ok lets forget Frankston/Geelong streets on a Sat night.

It is a joke how much money the Vic govt spends/loses on this event. The bang for the tax payer's buck would be far greater with a major golf event, and the money spread around far shallower pockets that what I imagine is gettting paid to a core group of F1 corporates.

I also wonder about the visitors - what the difference would be between how and what they spend their money outside of the actual event - crazy motor sports fans vs. avid golf fans.

You could still finish the Sunday night with a KISS concert, right Fergie???

[Chris Kane]

Brett, I admire your passion but this is Alice in Wonderland stuff.

Putting together a field featuring the majority of the world's top 64, let alone all of them, would cost squillions (Tiger and Rory would be $5 million or more between them). It simply won't happen - spending $3 million on a perceived elite game to bring Tiger in 2009 and 2010 caused enough controversy. Imagine the reaction to spending 5-10 times that!

And how is a relatively small number of millionaire golf professionals pocketing our cash any different to Bernie Ecclestone?

Sean, in his usual tactful manner, Mark is dead right about the European Tour.

[Matthew Mollica]

Sean & Brett, as much as I'd love to agree with you and see your plans realised, I feel Mark's view, while not conveyed as subtly as it could have been, is pretty much spot on. And IMHO, the GP attracts a far bigger global audience than golf ever would.

MM

[Sean Walsh]

Matthew,

Undoubtedly the GP attracts a greater global audience than any golf tournament in Australia ever would, but when your paying through the nose for those eyeballs it starts to be less efficient.  I would be interested in the figures that show (or estimate) how many extra overseas visitors the GP brings in. 

On a visitor per viewer basis I would be absolutely certain more golfers watching would travel.  For three reasons.  One: a significant proportion of golfers have the disposable income to travel (it is the bane of golf in many countries that it is an expensive sport to get into) Two: The course they're playing on is a bigger lure than a racetrack you can't experience yourself (along with the quality of product that surrounds the course hosting the event) Three: Golfers from large parts of the Northern hemisphere get to extend their golfing season by visiting Australia.

Chris,

It would take significant change on the part of the Euro Tour to make this a reality, however the risk v reward for that tour makes sense.  Especially at a time when the Goliath that is the PGA Tour has chosen to fight the governing bodies.  If the governing bodies chose to fight back and did this by using the leverage provided by the Majors they own then the Euro Tour would be mad not to shift further to the "World" Tour they've started to become.  During the time that the mature markets in Europe can't afford to support events it makes sense to flush out the schedule in areas less affected by the GFC.  An event in Australia should be part of that equation.  There is little reason A World Tour can't be to the PGA Tour as F1 is to Indycar and if it is ever to happen the time is now by forging alliances with the enemies Finchem is making.

US Economy
83-86 Avg 4.8% growth
97-00 Avg 4.5% growth

08-11 Avg 0.2% growth

As for crowds a few thousand turned up to see the Vic Open recently.  Plenty turned up to see Tiger go around the Heath.  There's a market there you just have to tap it.

[Chris Kane]

An event in Australia should be part of that equation. 

The Perth International is a European Tour event.

[Thomas Dai]

I'm not sure the comparison of pro golf with the Grand Prix/motor racing is necessarily the most appropriate.

My comparison would be with how the worlds best tennis players all seem to go Aus for the Aussie Tennis Open. What is the incentive to tennis players that doesn't apply to pro golfers?

Just curious.

All the best.

[David_Elvins]

I'm not sure the comparison of pro golf with the Grand Prix/motor racing is necessarily the most appropriate.

My comparison would be with how the worlds best tennis players all seem to go Aus for the Aussie Tennis Open. What is the incentive to tennis players that doesn't apply to pro golfers?

Just curious.

All the best.

The biggest reason would be money. The AustralianOpen tennis has over $30mil in prize money with 2.5 mil going to the men's singles winner.   With far far less prize money in tennis than golf, the world's best players are not going to knock back such a rich tournament. 

[Tom Kelly]

Are the time difference and distance between Australia, Europe and the US still a major/the overriding factor in the ability of Melbourne to hold a top level tour event?

I am purely speculating and I would be very interested to see the actual statistics but I would hazard a guess that the majority of the worldwide TV audience for any major golf event still comes from the US and Europe. With the really awkward time difference to Europe and not ideal difference to the US meaning the golf is being played either in the middle of the night or early morning for European and US audiences are there any large enough sponsors/TV broadcasters out there willing to stump up the money to attract the worlds top players with this diminished audience? Without the US as a bog standard Europen tour event the viewing figures would be tiny. Even as a WGC event I reckon it would be hard to find the money. Is the Australasian and Asian market big enough to sustain an event of the magnitude you all want? Living in the UK I tried to watch the Presidents Cup last year especially to see Royal Melbourne but kept falling asleep, most of my friends who usually watch golf didn't even bother trying. As for highlights or recording it, golf when you know the result is pretty boring.

Regarding distance, not many players will want to have the days travel there and back with other events to consider before and after if the money isn't there.

In relation to attracting tourists, during my time in Aus the majority of the tourists I saw/met were European with a few Americans, if you're targeting these markets golf tournaments shown at 2am in the morning aren't going do much in my opinion.

This is where the Grand Prix and Tennis wins, they are both more 'global' than golf, are shorter events where the timing can be moved back or forward a few hours to help TV audiences across the world and both work better as short highlight shows.

[Sean Walsh]

An event in Australia should be part of that equation. 

The Perth International is a European Tour event.

Chris,

Yes and for the reasons you've already stated it's not a world class event.  The Euro Tour needs to do away with the piecemeal approach they have taken to expanding across the globe and commit to an F1 style truly World format.  25-30 events with prize money to compete with the PGA Tour and if the governing bodies stay at odds with the PGA Tour leverage the Majors to ensure the best golfers not born in America are more likely to play it than the PGA.  Not likely to happen unless Finchem completely burns his bridges and the R&A/USGA play hardball.

Tom,

11 hour time difference in Nov. No reason the last 3 hours of the weekend rounds couldn't attract a decent audience. Would equate to 0500-0800 timeslot in UK.  The GP is run at around the same time for that reason.  As for the players it would be a matter of grouping 2-3 tournaments in similar time zones to reduce the strain on the body clock.

[Mark Chaplin]

Sean - you'd be counting in thousands not hundreds of thousands or millions who'd get up at 5am to watch a golf tournament when there are options every week from the various golf tours. I doubt more than 5% of golf fans would watch because of a specific venue either.

[Chris Kane]

The biggest reason would be money. The AustralianOpen tennis has over $30mil in prize money with 2.5 mil going to the men's singles winner.   With far far less prize money in tennis than golf, the world's best players are not going to knock back such a rich tournament. 

They all turn up because the Australian Open is a grand slam (obviously the prize money reflects that status). Tennis is also a world tour where traveling all over the world is the rule rather than the exception.

[Josh Tarble]

It may not be the cup of tea for many on here, but F1 can't really be compared to many sporting events anywhere.  Not only do they draw ~50,000 people locally, but they AVERAGE 100 million viewers around the world.  It is really an incredible sports property.  Highly expensive but comparing it to golf/tennis is absurd. 

[Dominic Meese]

I think the Sunday attendances at the Melbourne GP are closer to 100,000. Not sure about the other four days.  I wouldn't imagine you'd get anywhere near that on the final day of a euro golfing event.

As Chris said, you'd have to end up spending a similar amount as the GP in order to attract the majority of the worlds top 64 players to travel across the world to Australia.

With crowds nowhere near the size of the GP, worldwide viewing audiences nowhere near as large as F1 and therefore a lack of incentive for lucrative sponsorships and less tourism generated from the event, I just can't see it working.

I wish it could work though!

[Mark_F]

You could still finish the Sunday night with a KISS concert, right Fergie???

Brett,

You would need to get the Pussycat Dolls singing naked to get anyone interested in hanging around after a golf tournament.

I also wonder about the visitors - what the difference would be between how and what they spend their money outside of the actual event - crazy motor sports fans vs. avid golf fans.

There is a significant division between the passion of the two sets of fans.  Formal One merchandising is a massive business. Fans spend a fortune  on ridiculously priced items.  There is no way known there are golf fans anywhere that are going to spend that kind of money on merchandising, save for the odd Podiatrist in the Cypress Point Pro shop.

How many people attend two or three days of the Australian Masters?  Not many would be my guess, but a significant number of Grand Prix attendees are there all three days.  I doubt there would be much difference no matter who was playing  a golf event here. 

Golf fans just don't have that passion. 

There is also the matter of corporate support.  I worked at the Grand Prix yesterday and today, and the amount of money the corporate sponsors are splashing out is staggering.  It is a world class event with world wide exposure to a passionate audience. There is simply no way they would spend a fraction of that for a golf event.

The Grand Prix may make Bernie Ecclestone richer every minute, but it is a great event, with a lot to see and do there besides watch a car scream around the circuit with an ear shattering blast. 

The Australian Masters, on the other hand, is run by a bunch of corporatist buffoons who don't give a rat's arse about making the tournament interesting. That's why it is dying.

[Matthew Mollica]

I have just finished seeing a petrol head patient who spent four days at the Grand Prix.
He went to Adelaide for the V8s last week. He suggested in excess of 260,000 attended the event over the four days, with 90,000+ there for the actual race on Sunday. One would reasonably expect the Formula One event to rival if not exceed this.

Golf in Australia could never generate such numbers...

MM

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