Night Lights at Bandon

[Mark Smolens]

There used to be an 18-hole executive course next to the hotel at Arlington Park racetrack. The inner 9 was lighted. I recall being out there with some fraternity brothers one evening and hitting my five wood on a par-3 that ran towards the hotel. It hit about 8 floors up and bounced back onto the green -- leaving six or seven guys on the ground laughing. I believe alcohol may have been involved    There also used to be a lighted course, or at least partially lighted course, in Tempe, AZ. Depth perception and shadows were indeed a problem, especially when the light was coming over your shoulder from behind.

A lighted putting ground strikes me as a pretty cool way to spend a few hours with a cocktail after walking 36 holes at Bandon, but I don't think lights would fit into the scheme at the Preserve (at least based upon the photos that I've seen).

[David Ober]

Geoff, is it harder to judge distance control under artificial light? Without ever playing night golf, I would imagine shadows could cause problems especially on the greens. Rather than having one shadow, there'd potentially be several with lights shining from different angles.

Given the heat and humidity as you stated, is night golf popular there?

I can tell you that it is for me for sure. Once dusk sets in, I have horrible, horrible time with "in-between" shots of 20 - 60 yards.

[Garland Bayley]

They have plenty of marshals that can drive down the last few holes handing out vouchers for the next morning. And marshals that can check the vouchers the next morning. During the winter months, they could extend tee times later and charge full fare, as the people that won't get done know they can finish up in the morning. If they have a late tee time. it probably means the made the tee time recently and they aren't getting started much earlier the next morning.

Perhaps feasible...though if you're going to charge players full fare, then you'll have to provide full service which means the marshals drive the players (in...gasp...carts) off the course in the evening and back out in the morning. Could take quite a few marshals. I'm not walking in from 12 green on Trails and back out to 13 tee the next morning.

And I'm still not sure it's possible given that the earliest hours are usually reserved so that the maitenance crews can get their work done.

Give me a break. This is Bandon. No one is carting anyone anywhere. If you accept a late tee time that means you are on 12 green when marshals say it's time to get you backside off the course, then you walk. Otherwise don't make the tee time.
 

[Rick Shefchik]

We were just discussing today whether to put lights on the new putting green.  The answer is maybe, but probably not immediately.

A putting green like the one at the lodge at Pebble Beach is perfect for lights -- surrounded by hotels and shops, it already has almost a theater-like setting. But I don't think the effect would be the same at Bandon. There, I kind of like the idea of golfers trying to find their strokes in the fading twilight, or even in the moonlight.

[David Ober]

We were just discussing today whether to put lights on the new putting green.  The answer is maybe, but probably not immediately.

A putting green like the one at the lodge at Pebble Beach is perfect for lights -- surrounded by hotels and shops, it already has almost a theater-like setting. But I don't think the effect would be the same at Bandon. There, I kind of like the idea of golfers trying to find their strokes in the fading twilight, or even in the moonlight.

All (virtually all?) golf courses should have a night-lighted putting green, IMHO. There is nothing like a "post-cocktail putting contest" for some $$$ to test the putting stroke and build camaraderie with buddies.

[JLahrman]

They have plenty of marshals that can drive down the last few holes handing out vouchers for the next morning. And marshals that can check the vouchers the next morning. During the winter months, they could extend tee times later and charge full fare, as the people that won't get done know they can finish up in the morning. If they have a late tee time. it probably means the made the tee time recently and they aren't getting started much earlier the next morning.

Perhaps feasible...though if you're going to charge players full fare, then you'll have to provide full service which means the marshals drive the players (in...gasp...carts) off the course in the evening and back out in the morning. Could take quite a few marshals. I'm not walking in from 12 green on Trails and back out to 13 tee the next morning.

And I'm still not sure it's possible given that the earliest hours are usually reserved so that the maitenance crews can get their work done.

Give me a break. This is Bandon. No one is carting anyone anywhere. If you accept a late tee time that means you are on 12 green when marshals say it's time to get you backside off the course, then you walk. Otherwise don't make the tee time.
 

I was responding to your idea that you could allow players to make later tee times, charge full fare, and let them finish in the morning. If you're going to charge full fare with the plan that players go back out the next morning to finish, then players should be carted in and out.

[Carl Nichols]

We were just discussing today whether to put lights on the new putting green.  The answer is maybe, but probably not immediately.

A putting green like the one at the lodge at Pebble Beach is perfect for lights -- surrounded by hotels and shops, it already has almost a theater-like setting. But I don't think the effect would be the same at Bandon. There, I kind of like the idea of golfers trying to find their strokes in the fading twilight, or even in the moonlight.

All (virtually all?) golf courses should have a night-lighted putting green, IMHO. There is nothing like a "post-cocktail putting contest" for some $$$ to test the putting stroke and build camaraderie with buddies.

Agreed.  I don't know if it's always set up this way or if they did it just for this wedding, but last year I went to a wedding at Corde Valle and we had a very long "post-rehearsal-dinner putting contest" under lights on the putting green just off the pro shop.  Tons of fun. 

[Garland Bayley]

They have plenty of marshals that can drive down the last few holes handing out vouchers for the next morning. And marshals that can check the vouchers the next morning. During the winter months, they could extend tee times later and charge full fare, as the people that won't get done know they can finish up in the morning. If they have a late tee time. it probably means the made the tee time recently and they aren't getting started much earlier the next morning.

Perhaps feasible...though if you're going to charge players full fare, then you'll have to provide full service which means the marshals drive the players (in...gasp...carts) off the course in the evening and back out in the morning. Could take quite a few marshals. I'm not walking in from 12 green on Trails and back out to 13 tee the next morning.

And I'm still not sure it's possible given that the earliest hours are usually reserved so that the maitenance crews can get their work done.

Give me a break. This is Bandon. No one is carting anyone anywhere. If you accept a late tee time that means you are on 12 green when marshals say it's time to get you backside off the course, then you walk. Otherwise don't make the tee time.
 

I was responding to your idea that you could allow players to make later tee times, charge full fare, and let them finish in the morning. If you're going to charge full fare with the plan that players go back out the next morning to finish, then players should be carted in and out.

I know what your were responding to. Right now the charge full fare, course backs up, and darkness falls on you on the 16th hole or so. Walk in, no chance to finish. What's wrong with letting these people walk back out and finish in the morning? They may even sell a few more full fare tee times on nice days in the winter if people know they won't be paying full fare for a partial round. Of course most days in the winter they probably don't have a problem of having people left on the course.

[JLahrman]

I know what your were responding to. Right now the charge full fare, course backs up, and darkness falls on you on the 16th hole or so. Walk in, no chance to finish. What's wrong with letting these people walk back out and finish in the morning? They may even sell a few more full fare tee times on nice days in the winter if people know they won't be paying full fare for a partial round. Of course most days in the winter they probably don't have a problem of having people left on the course.

If the course backs up and it's too dark to play the last two holes, that's one thing. That's the risk you take when you make a late tee time.

However, if the resort's plan is to book tee times at a start time when the plan - even if play moves at a proper pace - is that the players will have to go back out on the course the next day, AND charge regular rates for those rounds, then you have to help the players on and off the course. Some of the holes that the players would likely end on are a very far distance from the clubhouse. On Trails, if you have to end your round on 13, 14, 15, you've probably got a good 2-mile hike each way.

[Garland Bayley]

Actually, a little over a mile from 14 green.
If you don't want to hike it, don't make the tee time.
If riding carts is your thing, don't go to Bandon.

[Pete_Pittock]

Please say no.  Angel Park in Vegas has a lighted short course and putting green. I believe the new putting course at Sagebrush will be lit.

[JLahrman]

Actually, a little over a mile from 14 green.
If you don't want to hike it, don't make the tee time.
If riding carts is your thing, don't go to Bandon.

Well we'd have to let Bandon make the call.

But I would say "if you don't want to accomdate getting people on and off the course, then don't accept tee times that allow only 3 hours of daylight".

If they drive people from 13 green to 14 tee on Trails, then they'd probably drive people in and out on the course if they were to implement the plan you're describing.

I'm a pretty hard core walker, but not in this scenario.

[RDecker]

My course tried one of those glow ball tourneys last summer and let me tell you one thing, in low light conditions the divots that are made are noticeably bigger and deeper.  The lack of light severely hampers depth perception and I've heard of players in these glow ball outings seriously hurting their wrists.  Besides it's kind of nice for the course to get a little break every night.

[Nate Oxman]

Archie,

When I saw this post I thought of the Country Club of Salem and then when I did some research and found the info. on golfcourseranking.com that I posted before mentioning that the course was lit for night play, I figured that was the right course. This gentleman told me about the lights at CC of Salem probably about decade ago, which makes sense since the course was still open then. It closed in 2005.

I've never heard of Tall Pines, but I guess it's possible both the gentleman who told me about CC of Salem and the info. on golfcourseranking.com are incorrect and we're actually talking about Tall Pines.

Did anyone ever play Country Club of Salem?

[Pete Lavallee]

Played a course in San Diego that was "night golf" all lit up when I was a kid in the 70's, pretty fun

but at Bandon, definitely not "golf as it was meant to be"

We had two night lighted courses in San Diego, River Valley was a 9 hole executive course in Hoel Circle, next to the old Stardust CC. They built 3 extra holes hoping to develope the property on 3 exixsting holes. That never panned out, so you had a 12 hole course! That closed when the San Diego Trolley cut through the old Stardust and it was cahnged into Ted Robinson's River Walk. We still have Mission Bay which has 18 holes, 14 par 3's with 4 300 yard holes; so you let the "Big Dog Eat"!

[Carl Nichols]

If the course backs up and it's too dark to play the last two holes, that's one thing. That's the risk you take when you make a late tee time.

Agreed -- especially when it's pretty obviously to get the benefit of the reply rate.  Should someone be allowed to tee off at 6pm on June 21 for the replay rate and finish his round the next morning? 

[Garland Bayley]

If the course backs up and it's too dark to play the last two holes, that's one thing. That's the risk you take when you make a late tee time.

Agreed -- especially when it's pretty obviously to get the benefit of the reply rate.  Should someone be allowed to tee off at 6pm on June 21 for the replay rate and finish his round the next morning? 

Carl,

This discussion is about players paying the full rate. I have no problem with players taking advantage of the replay rate, and not being able to finish. In particular the discussion is about the winter, when the tee times available are vastly compressed by the shortness of available daylight.

[Carl Nichols]

If the course backs up and it's too dark to play the last two holes, that's one thing. That's the risk you take when you make a late tee time.

Agreed -- especially when it's pretty obviously to get the benefit of the reply rate.  Should someone be allowed to tee off at 6pm on June 21 for the replay rate and finish his round the next morning? 

Carl,

This discussion is about players paying the full rate. I have no problem with players taking advantage of the replay rate, and not being able to finish. In particular the discussion is about the winter, when the tee times available are vastly compressed by the shortness of available daylight.

Does this really happen? 

[archie_struthers]

 


Nate , pdon't recall the CC of Salem , could it be Sakima CC today?  

Did a little research , its not Sakima , and has been sold. Looks like it fell into,disrepair around 2008-9.  Surprised I never heard tell of the course. Yet it appears to be right on the  banks of the Delaware, nine holes , regulation length. Hard to imagine lights in this locale Nate, but one never knows.

[Garland Bayley]

If the course backs up and it's too dark to play the last two holes, that's one thing. That's the risk you take when you make a late tee time.

Agreed -- especially when it's pretty obviously to get the benefit of the reply rate.  Should someone be allowed to tee off at 6pm on June 21 for the replay rate and finish his round the next morning? 

Carl,

This discussion is about players paying the full rate. I have no problem with players taking advantage of the replay rate, and not being able to finish. In particular the discussion is about the winter, when the tee times available are vastly compressed by the shortness of available daylight.

Does this really happen? 

Are you asking if players paying full fare get left on the course at dark in the winter? My experience is being able to just barely finish after a five hour and 10 minute round, with groups still on the course behind us. I believe they don't expect over five hour rounds so they didn't intend to have nonfinishers, but it happens.