New Confidential Guide

[Adam_Messix]

Three unwritten and two that were written but have changed dramatically since...

Bidermann
McArthur
Mountain Lake
Yeamans Hall
Wolf Point

All are at least a 7 in my book, I'm curious if Tom would agree with me. 

[Dan_Callahan]

One that's already been mentioned: Yale

Also, Kittansett.

With tree clearing, both courses are significantly different (and better) than they were 10 years ago.

[M. Shea Sweeney]

Portsalon-
The version that I have the opportunity to read from time to time said something along the lines that there wasn't much of a course there.

I second JWarne on Goat Hill, Shelter Island. He introduced it to me. It gets better by the play, and the brilliance of it's architecture is more apparent each time. I will stop there for risk of being fired.

Eastward Ho

[jeffwarne]

Portsalon-
The version that I have the opportunity to read from time to time said something along the lines that there wasn't much of a course there.

I second JWarne on Goat Hill, Shelter Island. Let it be known he introduced it to me. It gets better by the play, and the brilliance of it's architecture is more apparent each time. I will stop there for risk of being fired.

Eastward Ho

Spoken like the reigning Goat Open Champion
Can't get fired till you're rehired........

Portsalon and Dunanaghy (their new website is pure GCA porn-click on Gallery)
Positive reviews,coupled with a revitalized St. Patrick's, could ruin the area

[Craig Van Egmond]

In Oklahoma..

    Karsten Creek.
    Oak Tree National.
    The Territory Golf and Country Club
    The Patriot Golf Club

You could see 3 out of 4 in 1 day easy... fly into Tulsa and see The Patriot.. drive through Stillwater and check out Karsten Creek on your way to Edmond to see Oak Tree National.  And then fly out of OKC.

[Michael George]

In Ohio, you have to see Brookside CC (Canton).  The renovation was outstanding and I think it will rate very high by you.

I am not sure I can offer a whole lot more than what you already know otherwise.  Obviously, Oakmont post tree clearing is a must that has not been mentioned.   

[Tom_Doak]

In Ohio, you have to see Brookside CC (Canton).  The renovation was outstanding and I think it will rate very high by you.

I am not sure I can offer a whole lot more than what you already know otherwise.  Obviously, Oakmont post tree clearing is a must that has not been mentioned.   

Honestly, I am not sure what more I would get from seeing Oakmont without trees.  The holes are still the same, and the trees really never entered my thought process in evaluating the course before.  I'm sure it looks different and feels different, but really, it is not that much different, is it?

[Tom_Doak]

Really, I should know to be more careful what I wish for.  Already there have been 72 courses mentioned that were not in the previous edition ... of which I have seen 28 to date.  Only a few of the others are on my short list of places to see, but keep them coming ... I will try to see what I can.

One thing I am NOT likely to prioritize is getting back to every course I've ever seen to evaluate recent restorations.  There is just not enough time for that.  I am sure many of those courses are better than they were 25 years ago; indeed, most courses are, even if they haven't undergone a significant renovation.  But most restorations are tweaks ... they seldom uncover a great hole that had been so covered up that I didn't notice it "before".  I've done a fair number of restorations myself, but not many of them would be likely to result in a higher Doak scale rating -- Yeamans Hall for sure, because it was so degraded prior to our work.  At most, others would push a course that might have been between a 6 and a 7 over the top.

[Sean_A]

I come up with two in Michigan which are not onerous for you to visit.  First, Grosse Ile, second U of M (a second look because I think you are miles out with a 3 rating).

I can also think of two in England.  One was previously mentioned, Huntercombe.  The other is Beau Desert. 

I would add Kington to make the maxed out five number, but I am not sure professional archies can see this place for what it is.  Then again, you got Pennard where other pro archies and critics have missed the boat, so I will roll the dice with Kington. 

Ciao

[David_Elvins]

Healesville.  (RACV CC)

Royal Queensland

Pasatiempo

[Jud_T]

Oops, forgot one.  Knollwood Club- newly renovated (Foster) Colt/Allison in Lake Forest, IL.  

[Ian Andrew]

My suggestions:

Glen Falls CC, Upper NY State - Ross

and since it was a flavour - St. Geoege's post restoration

But you can ask Brian about both.

[Tom_Doak]

My suggestions:

Glen Falls CC, Upper NY State - Ross

and since it was a flavour - St. Geoege's post restoration

But you can ask Brian about both.

Ian:

I've already heard about Glens Falls and several other upstate NY courses.  In fact, there are now a couple of greens at Medinah inspired by Glens Falls, which not many analysts would ever pick up on.

But, I can't figure out why my associates have more time to see courses than I do!

[Robert Emmons]

Huntington Country Club...RHE

[Garland Bayley]

Juniper and Tetherow in the Bend/Redmond area of Oregon.

[KBanks]

Mount Bruno
Indian Creek
Farmington
Lookout Mountain

Ken

[Jason Thurman]

Erin Hillls and Prairie Club - Dunes. Mostly, I'm just interested in hearing the thoughts of ANYONE who's played one of those two. Commenting on Erin Hills might not be realistic, but I'm confident it would be very interesting.

[Tim_Weiman]

Tom,

For entertainment value I'd include Doonbeg and Old Head. Also hard for me not to nominate Whistling Straits and Friars Head.

Among your projects and leaving the Bandon complex aside I would include Common Ground and, my favorite, St Andrews Beach.

[Jason Topp]

Based on memory of what is in the CG, here is a Twin Cities list:

Old:
Oak Ridge CC
Town & Country

New:
Spring Hill (a polarizing Fazio)
Windsong Farm
Stoneridge

I will take a look at the book and edit at some point.

[Tim Leahy]

Olympic Club was rated too low and has been changed for the Open, and Cal Club in SF which has been really changed.
Aslo Yoche De He outside of Sacramento which was opened after the book and Del Paso CC in Sacramento which was redesigned after the book and will  hold a Senior Open soon.

[Greg Taylor]

Tobacco Road and Beau Desert.

Or ideally rate everywhere I have played as a 9 or 10, and everything else as a 3 maximum...!

Greg

[Sven Nilsen]

Wine Valley
Chambers Bay
We-Ko-Pa Saguaro/Talking Stick North/Vista Verde/Blackstone
Links of North Dakota
Wild Horse
Rochelle Ranch
Lakota Canyon
Diamante
Lost Farm/Barnbougle Dunes
Rustic Canyon
Rich Harvest/Black Sheep

[Joe Bausch]

Huntington Country Club...RHE

My bad for not mentioning that one in my earlier nominations RHE.

[PCCraig]

Based on memory of what is in the CG, here is a Twin Cities list:

Old:
Oak Ridge CC
Town & Country

New:
Spring Hill (a polarizing Fazio)
Windsong Farm
Stoneridge

I will take a look at the book and edit at some point.

Tom,

I, like Jason, don't have my Confidential Guide handy right now but I would also like to see an expansion of the book's Minnesota listings. I'm not sure Interlachen CC has been changed enough (outside of some tree removal, bunker renovation, and a few tees) to warrant a new trip...but I think Minikahda has in the huge amount of work done. Jason's list above is certainly a good start...Oak Ridge has a very very good stretch of holes from #11-#17... Town & Country Club (my home course) is super quirky, old (1888), unique, fun but almost completely under the radar... In addition to Jason's list, I would of been really interested to hear what you thought of Keller GC in St. Paul mostly because it was a pretty neat golf course with features not seen on Public golf courses anymore but Richard Mandell is renovating the course right now. I also think Minneapolis Golf Club (Park/Ross/Prichard) would be worth checking out as would North Oaks (Stanly Thomson/Tom Leahman) and Edina CC (in the original, but it's been extensively redone by Leahman).

Generally speaking, I think the Twin Cities area would be worth a visit for your updated Guide. There is a bunch of stuff in Chicago that's been redone over the years since you visited but probably isn't worth your time to see. However, one neat course you should make an effort to do see when in town working at Medinah next year is Glen View Club in Golf, IL...it's not a "9" but it has some great holes. I can't remember if you listed Old Elm but if you haven't that's another one you should make a serious effort to see. As much of a fan I am of Shepherd's Crook (Jud's recommendation) I would never tell you to take a few hours to see it if you haven't seen Glen View or Old Elm first. I still think of the Confidential Guide as a Guide to someone unfamiliar with an area...so I would rather you include the most worthy courses first...a Spring Valley or Shepherd's Crook would be something of a "deep cut" to me.

[Sven Nilsen]

Pat:

Old Elm was a 5 deemed "too squatty to present a strong challenge."

I think Spring Valley would be a tremendous add to the book, just to see what Tom would make of the "old house with the dust covers still on."  It would be a good compare to what he wrote about Culver.