North Shore CC (Raynor/Doak) in Glen Head, NY again...

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Although I am mentioned in Jay Flemma's new article as a golf architecture historian, I was acting as Phil Young's agent and consigliore when I visited the NY Historical Society. I fully expected to find documentation in the minutes of the Harmonie Club that Tillinghast was indeed the architect of record. When I called Phil after discovering that Raynor was actually hired by the club, he was just as shocked as I was.
In any event, Jay's article goes beyond the attribution mystery with a fine description of Tom Doak's work and comments from the long time caddiemaster and superintendent. The fact that Jay also mentioned me, as other golf writers did not except for the WSJ's John Paul Newport has no bearing for me to recommend his fine article. Here's the link:

http://jayflemma.thegolfspace.com/?p=4751

[Keith OHalloran]

Was Tom Doak the architect that tipped off George Bahto? I have the Confidential Guide that has a copyright date of 1996 and Tom Doak says he thinks that Charles Banks designed the course. Not sure why he cited Banks, but interesting that he did not say Tillie.

[Joe Bausch]

Here is a photo tour I did of North Shore from last fall:

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,49913.0.html

And here is another thread I did on North Shore concerning a long article in 1917:

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,44329.0.html

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Phil Young just wrote this to me:

All I did was proivde a bit of direction. I was able to locate the original Board of Director's minutes from the first few years of the Club's existence in the Harmonie Club's archives which are held at the NY Historical Society. Steve is the one who made the discovery and should get all of the credit as I was not in a position to go and look through them at that time yet he travelled from Phuiladelphia to do so. That sets him apart and is a tribute to his passionate curiosity for trying to understand who actually designed the course.
 
What this "puzzle of attribution" which a number of us were interested in solving allowed was for a discussion to take place that encouraged some to explore here-to-for unexpected avenues of directions to search for the answer which would lead to the exposing of the information upon which Steve took the initiative to search and make the actual discovery. Being Tenzig Norgay to Steve's Hillary is still a wonderful privilege.. It is HIllary who made it to the top first and Steve who visited the NY Historical Society. The honor of discovery is his and should be rememberred as such.

[Tom_Doak]

Was Tom Doak the architect that tipped off George Bahto? I have the Confidential Guide that has a copyright date of 1996 and Tom Doak says he thinks that Charles Banks designed the course. Not sure why he cited Banks, but interesting that he did not say Tillie.

Keith:

I never spoke to George about it back then.  But, I did know enough of the Macdonald style to recognize that some of the holes at North Shore [especially the 9th and 10th] looked a lot like the Macdonald/Raynor/Banks style.  I just guessed Banks ("maybe") because I thought if it was Macdonald or Raynor it would already have been documented, and because nothing there reminded me of Tillinghast's work.

I would not have the patience (as Steve does) to go through records at the NY Historical Society, even if I had the time.  But I was pretty good at guessing the correct answers on tests, even as a kid.

[Steve_ Shaffer]

@Keith & Tom

In George Bahto's initial post on the 40 page thread that started the "mystery" of North Shore, he refers to "one of Doak's henchmen" as the one who tipped him off about North Shore:

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,42325.0.html

[Tom_Doak]

@Keith & Tom

In George Bahto's initial post on the 40 page thread that started the "mystery" of North Shore, he refers to "one of Doak's henchmen" as the one who tipped him off about North Shore:

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,42325.0.html

He must have meant Bruce Hepner.  But Bruce and I were there at the same time; the club asked us to interview for consulting work back when we were working at Sands Point.

[George_Bahto]

It was Bruce.

additionally: I was working at Sand's Point Men's Club and got a call from the (then) super at North Shore Rich Taconelli who said the members wanted to level the  Double Plateau green in the beginning of the back nine. He asked if i would stop by to help dissuade them .... their complaint was they couldn't stop the ball when landing on the back plateau ....... (not exactly what your supposed to do, fly the back plateau)

I had been there on my initial look at the greens about 3 months earlier