Lawsonia conditions - WOW

[Will Peterson]

A couple of years ago, I posited that Lawsonia would be more fun if the greens were faster.  At the time, I had played the course about a dozen times, and each time found that the greens were just too slow to take advantage of their wonderful design.  They always seemed to be running under 8, and I felt that if they could get up to a 9-9.5 the course would be so much more fun.  The entire course was always in nice shape, but seemed to lush and soft for the design.

[url]http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,43942.0/topicseen.html[url]

I played the Links again last Sunday, and am happy to report that the conditions were perfect.  The course was firm and bouncy, the greens firm and running about 9-9.5, the fairways perfect with a mix of green and brown, and the surrounds were burned out and rock hard.  I found the course much more fun and also much more difficult.  The difficulty issue was a funny one.  As a low handicap, I found it more challenging, but my partners seemed to have more success.  One plays to 10 and shot 79 while the other, a 36+, played one of her best rounds ever with a 103.

After we finished, I spoke with an assistant pro at the course.  I asked what people thought about the conditions.  He said that most hate them.  He said he gets 4-5 complaints a day.  Many say that because the rough is brown, they should get a discount.  He actually thanked me for coming in to compliment the conditions, because he thinks they are great as well, but only hears negative feedback.  He told me that they have a new super, and that this is the way he feels the course should be presented.  I had thought that the conditions may have been due to the hot, dry summer in Wisconsin, but upon hearing this it sounds like they are no accident.  

If you haven’t been to Lawsonia in a few years and were disappointed in the conditions, it is time to go back.  You won’t be let down.  

Here are a few photos I snapped.  They aren’t the best and were taken with my phone, but do give you an idea of the conditions.



#2

#6

#7

#10 looking from back of 18

#11

#12

#15

#16

#18

[Phil McDade]

Will:

Glad to hear about Lawsonia, which parallel other reports I've heard this year.

However, one quibble -- we've had a record drought this year in Wisconsin, and I'd imagine that has something to do with the fast and firm conditions there. But, good of the superintendent to stick to his guns -- it's meant to be played that way.

[Nigel Islam]

When I played there last month it it played perfect. A little wind, hard, greens were quick but not stupid fast. Hats off to the superintendent. Now if I could just have hit the green at 7..............................

[PCCraig]

Great to hear. Thanks for the report. The course looks awesome in your photos.

[Will Peterson]

I have heard about the severity of the drought this year from my parents who live in Madison.  I imagine some of the dryness could be attributed to it, especially in the fesue and perimeter areas.  Most of the fesue was short and thin and in some areas non-existant.  I did ask about the drought, and the assistant showed me a photo in the grill taken a year or two ago.  It was an aerial shot with green stips of fairway and brown rough.  It looks like they are committed to firm and dry.  When I mentioned all the times that I played it soft, he told me that they started with firmer and dryer conditions about three years ago.  It really sounds like the staff loves the conditions. 

[Dan Kelly]

Many say that because the rough is brown, they should get a discount.  

These people should be rounded up and shipped to a penal colony.

[Andy Stamm]

I've played there a few times each year for the past 3 years. The conditions have been excellent each time, nice and dry and firm. The greens have been plenty fast for there slope, but not crazy. With the exception of a few trees on 2 holes (and I know they're clearing on 1 hole, although I was surprised they didn't clear more), the presentation has (for me) been just about perfect. It was not quite as dry as it looks in your photos though. I wish I could get there now to experience that, it looks wonderful.

[Adam Clayman]

The complaining consumer is an idiot.

I would expect Wild Horse to start to drop off the top 100 list soon for the reason that they have listened to the complainers.

I just heard from Edward who played Lawsonia the other day and reiterated the sentiments describe above. The ball was bouncing out of the rough and with the proper shot shape would trickle it's way back to fairway. He even said he was using the brown bonus purposely and with great effect.

[Dan Moore]

I played 45 holes at Lawsonia Saturday on a perfect Fall day.  While the fairways were firm and fast and greens were as good as I can ever remember i have to disagree with Will about the overall condition of the rough.  While the vasy majority of the rough wss simply baked and dormant and played fine as Will noted, I'm afarid the course has suffered a fair amount of drought related damage to many of the rough areas  around the greens and tees.  Unfortunately there is a lot of dead grass and dirt around the tees and greens where the carts run and this made for some very difficult greenside recovery shots from grassless hardpan,not an easy task to the elevated greens at Lawsonia.  The faces of many bunkers were also sparsely grassed which may or may not be a long term concern, I'm not sure.  The was also a fair amount of turf damage to the back of many tees and certain areas in the fairways.  The fescue areas were also clearly stressed.  I think most of this will quickly recover with a normal spring but they will most definitely need to invest in some grass seed to get things back where they should be next year.

As Will noted these issues had little real impact on playability and in fact given the firmness and speed of the greens Lawsonia was as fun to play as I can ever remember.  Balls were rolling out all over those fantastic greens and they had a couple of really tough pin placements such as front left on 8 that resulted in some interesting golf.  Not often that a ball almost stopped 10 feet from the pin rolls 30 yards down a hill off a false front.  The greens were simply awesome and that alone should encourage folks to get up the before the season ends.  And if you need any convincing Fall rates started Monday so its only $25 to walk anytime 7 days a week. 

I have some additional information on tree removal and future plans so will post more with photos when I get some time this weekend.

[PCCraig]

I have some additional information on tree removal and future plans so will post more with photos when I get some time this weekend.

Please do, thanks for the report Dan.

[Jay Flemma]

Love Lawsonia - everything a great public course should be.

[William_G]

Love Lawsonia - everything a great public course should be.

yes!!

[John Kavanaugh]

Love Lawsonia - everything a great public course should be.

yes!!

No, not quite cause you can not grow the game without selling beer.

[RJ_Daley]

I thought they have been selling beer for a number of years now.  I can't specifically remember.  I thought we all had drinks at our gathering and evening meal-presentation when we had the L&M tour there.  I could be wrong.  There is brat slippage at the turn, and I think you can wash it down with beer.  Now that I think about it, I never drink beer during a round and just get gatoraid at the turn,... Is my memory getting that bad? 

[Mark Pearce]

There was beer (of extremely dubious quality, particularly given the State but beer nonetheless) on sale when the Midwest Mashie was there last year.

[John Kavanaugh]

I don't doubt that they sell beer.  I'm sorry but the whole place annoys me with their attitude.  This is from their stay and play link: Alcohol is only permitted at the rental. No carry on beverages allowed on the courses. The Green Lake Conference Center does not permit alcoholic beverages on grounds.

http://www.lawsonia.com/rates/stayandplay/

There are more ways to be exclusionary besides high fees.

[Phil McDade]

I don't doubt that they sell beer.  I'm sorry but the whole place annoys me with their attitude.  This is from their stay and play link: Alcohol is only permitted at the rental. No carry on beverages allowed on the courses. The Green Lake Conference Center does not permit alcoholic beverages on grounds.

http://www.lawsonia.com/rates/stayandplay/

There are more ways to be exclusionary besides high fees.

John:

I'm pretty sure it's easier to sneak alcohol into the accommodations at Lawsonia than my son's (state university) dorm, which is saying something. It's been known to have been done by certain GCA posters.

[Dan Moore]

The course is part of the Green Lake Conference Center which operates as a Baptist religious retreat.  They seek to maintain a serene family atmosphere and that is the reason they have a no alchohol policy on the grounds and in the rental properties.  We often camped and stayed there in the cabins when my kids were growing up and appreciated the fact that the no booze policy kept nightime rowdiness in check because you had to be discreet about your drinking.  There are plenty of nearby alternatives so no one should have felt constrained by the policy.  

I'm sure it was financially motivated but they do now offer alchohol in the clubhouse, had a beverage cart with beer on the course and you could get a beer at the brat slippage shack when making the turn on the links course.  

[RJ_Daley]

But, the question is, do they now sell beer in the grill room and on the golf course?  I suppose I could call and see what the current status is.  But, if they don't, that is understandable in that it is a Baptist Assembly property, and aren't they completely within their beliefs and rights to decide what they want to do relative to their mores on alcohol?  I'm just thankful that they have kept the cost to play very reasonable.  I'm sure their managers know how much cult following they get, and yet they have been most reasonable in their fee approach, perhaps due to their overall view of what the 'retreat' sort of experience offers in a peaceful and spiritual or contemplative sort of manner.  It is a place of great peace and joy, open to all who desire to experience their offering, golf, grounds, and whatever formal programs they offer their followers within the Baptist retreat experience.  I don't know much about those programs on their religious offerings, but have appreciated the peaceful and beautiful grounds for over 50 years now.  And, I have never missed beer to any great extent, particularly in the old days of the white lapstrake clubhouse with the slamming wood spring tension screen door.  In fact, it is a nostalgic memory.  

There is now a wood fired pizza palace in the previous pub that was operated for a while by the departed DOG of Lawsonia.  One will not die of the tirst, when visiting Green Lake.  

[John Kavanaugh]

Let's just not call it a perfect public course when they make people of other faiths uncomfortable.  Maybe I shouldn't have played there Ash Wednesday.

[Phil McDade]

John:

This nearby place in downtown Green Lake serves a couple of the fine Wisconsin-based micro-brewery beers, plus PBR and Old Style for Chicago day-trippers.

http://www.gooseblind.com/index.php/Regular-Menu/

[Mark Pearce]

Let's just not call it a perfect public course when they make people of other faiths uncomfortable.  Maybe I shouldn't have played there Ash Wednesday.

I'm puzzled.  Which other faiths do they make feel uncomfortable and how?

[Paul OConnor]

..., that is understandable in that it is a Baptist Assembly property, and aren't they completely within their beliefs and rights to decide what they want to do relative to their mores on alcohol?  I'm just thankful that they have kept the cost to play very reasonable.

Are the "reasonable costs" due to Lawsonia being a not-for-profit enterprise, or from subsidies from the rest of the Assembly activities?  

[Paul OConnor]

From their website...

"Lawsonia, valued at $11 million, was purchased for $300,000 in December, 1943."

I guess that their mortgage is paid off on that one by now. 

and...

"From June until October 1944, the U.S. Government rented William Carey Barn by the front gates and some cottages as a temporary camp for German prisoners of war."

And helped the new owners pay the $300k.   

[Dan Moore]

The regular season rates ($90) on weekends are competitive for a course of that quality despite its fairly remote location.  

The $25 is a Fall special and reflects the fact the area is a summer resort destination.

John, I don't think you discriminated against because of your faith, it was because you are a golfer who likes to drink.