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Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #25 on: September 19, 2012, 01:38:02 AM »
I know of a few people that have played the Old Course and left unimpressed. I can see how that happens, particularly if they were expecting to be wowed. I think these people appreciate the golf courses that are "aesthetically pleasing" and either don't know or care for the details of what makes great golf holes and golf courses. 
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Ben Jarvis

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Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #26 on: September 19, 2012, 01:46:14 AM »
HOLE 8 (Short), Par-3: 175 yards






HOLE 9 (End), Par-4: 352 yards






« Last Edit: September 19, 2012, 10:28:54 PM by Ben Jarvis »
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Kalen Braley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #27 on: September 19, 2012, 01:38:57 PM »
I've seen lots of pics of TOC before...but I must say these are the best. Perhaps the shots were taken low to the ground so the rolls and humps really pop out more. It looks like an absolute blast to play...a true ground game delight.

P.S. Is it just me or does it look more brown/golden than normal?

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2012, 10:31:24 PM »
HOLE 10 (Bobby Jones), Par-4: 386 yards





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Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #29 on: September 20, 2012, 06:52:30 PM »
HOLE 11 (High In), Par-3: 174 yards


















« Last Edit: September 20, 2012, 06:56:02 PM by Ben Jarvis »
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Tom Culley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #30 on: September 20, 2012, 07:38:51 PM »
Ben,

Did you get out of the bunker on 11 first time?
"Play the ball as it lies, play the course as you find it, and if you cannot do either, do what is fair. But to do what is fair, you need to know the Rules of Golf."

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #31 on: September 20, 2012, 07:56:39 PM »
Ben,

Did you get out of the bunker on 11 first time?

Tom - I didn't! The only bunker found for the round and I was severely punished. Made the mistake of trying to advance the ball towards the pin, rather than take my medicine. That was one steep face!!
Twitter: @BennyJarvis
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Mac Plumart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #32 on: September 20, 2012, 08:54:03 PM »
Ben,

Did you get out of the bunker on 11 first time?

Tom - I didn't! The only bunker found for the round and I was severely punished. Made the mistake of trying to advance the ball towards the pin, rather than take my medicine. That was one steep face!!

Another wonderful aspect of The Old Course.  The bunkers are actually hazardous to your score.
Sportsman/Adventure loving golfer.

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #33 on: September 23, 2012, 08:14:16 PM »
HOLE 12 (Heathery In), Par-4: 348 yards











« Last Edit: September 24, 2012, 02:26:16 AM by Ben Jarvis »
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Mac Plumart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #34 on: September 23, 2012, 08:35:48 PM »
I think 12 gets lost in the shuffle at The Old Course.  People talk about 17, 14, 16...but 12 is a truly great golf hole.  IMO.
Sportsman/Adventure loving golfer.

Tom Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #35 on: September 24, 2012, 12:48:15 PM »
The most bizarre golf hole I have ever seen, yet possibly my favourite.

During the Friday of the 2010 Open I sat by the green and watched about a dozen or so groups of world class golfers play through. The wind wasn't particularly strong and the pin was in a tough but not ridiculous position on the back shelf. I saw players hit anything from what must have been a mid iron to a driver off the tee and only one player in the entire time managed to make a birdie, with a fair amount of 5's thrown in and a couple of doubles. All on a driveable par 4 measuring less than 350 yards.

The run of holes 11, 12, 13 & 14 is probably my favorite in golf.....actually make that the whole back nine.

Dave McCollum

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #36 on: September 24, 2012, 02:01:01 PM »
I laughed when I read Mac’s depiction of the average American golfer’s view of TOC.  That was exactly my experience when I mentioned I had just played it to a friend.  He had grown up playing typical American courses here in Idaho.  Decent player, avid golfer.  Many years ago his job sent him to Europe where he played TOC with some clients.  Rather like Scott Hoch and Sam Snead, he said something like “have you ever seen such a mess?”  I laughed, slapped him on the back, and asked “too cheap to hire a caddie?”  Bingo!

One of my first thoughts after playing TOC was that “ignorance was bliss” to some extent.  Not knowing what perils are out there your first time around and just hitting it where your caddie tells you to hit it makes it easier to enjoy yourself and, ironically, score decently.  To this day, after my one play, I still believe it would take me a dozen rounds, under a variety of conditions, to understand how to play it reasonably well.
 
I’ve said this on here before:  we did what someone suggested and walked the course on Sunday before our Monday round.  When we got out to the 14th tee, we sat on bench for about ten minutes and tried to figure out how to play that hole into about a 25 mph head wind.  We left with no real answers.  The next day, with the wind reversed 180 degrees (downwind) and about the same velocity, it was an easy two shots to the green on the par 5, even for a hack like me.  Fascinating.   Perhaps to a lesser degree, the same applies to the entire course.

Michael Goldstein

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #37 on: September 24, 2012, 10:22:02 PM »
What would be the reaction from the DG to any proposed changes to holes around the turn on TOC?
@Pure_Golf

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #38 on: September 25, 2012, 02:24:35 AM »
I think 12 gets lost in the shuffle at The Old Course.  People talk about 17, 14, 16...but 12 is a truly great golf hole.  IMO.

Possibly the most strategic hole on the course?

When played into a steady wind, which it was when I played, it felt like it was a little "hit and hope" when trying to avoid the minefield of bunkers off the tee. Strategically though, there are three routes from the tee - left, right or over.

I'd be interested to hear what strategy others have gone with on the 12th tee..
Twitter: @BennyJarvis
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Tom Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #39 on: September 25, 2012, 07:15:05 AM »
Ben,

The day I sat and watched the pros play from what I can remember there seemed to be 3 general approaches.

1.Playing left of middle with a mid to long iron with the intention of finishing in the gap past Stroke bunker, leaving a fuller approach to help hold the back shelf.
2. Hitting a resuce/wood over the next bunkers but short of the greenside central bunker often leaving a tricky chip up the ridge, though it seems a very sensible play with a pin on the lower section of the green.
3. Hit driver taking on the front bunker in hope of hitting the green.

There was a fourth option that only Rickie Fowler took but it seemed to work…..Hit it in the grandstand behind 6, take a free drop in the rough behind the gorse hack it onto the green and two putt for par!

Again from what I can remember I’d say there was a fairly even spread between 2 and 3 with only a few doing 1.  It seems you can play right with an iron/rescue as well, which I saw quite a few amateurs do during my time up there but it seemed harder to hold the fairway from what I could tell, though you were less likely to end in a bunker. When I played I went for the green.

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #40 on: September 25, 2012, 07:12:04 PM »
Ben,

The day I sat and watched the pros play from what I can remember there seemed to be 3 general approaches.

1.Playing left of middle with a mid to long iron with the intention of finishing in the gap past Stroke bunker, leaving a fuller approach to help hold the back shelf.
2. Hitting a resuce/wood over the next bunkers but short of the greenside central bunker often leaving a tricky chip up the ridge, though it seems a very sensible play with a pin on the lower section of the green.
3. Hit driver taking on the front bunker in hope of hitting the green.

There was a fourth option that only Rickie Fowler took but it seemed to work…..Hit it in the grandstand behind 6, take a free drop in the rough behind the gorse hack it onto the green and two putt for par!

Again from what I can remember I’d say there was a fairly even spread between 2 and 3 with only a few doing 1.  It seems you can play right with an iron/rescue as well, which I saw quite a few amateurs do during my time up there but it seemed harder to hold the fairway from what I could tell, though you were less likely to end in a bunker. When I played I went for the green.


Thanks for your insights Tom. I'm surprised there weren't more laying up to the right side. I suppose the pin placement will very much dictate which side it's best to come in from.
Twitter: @BennyJarvis
Instagram: @bennyj08

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #41 on: September 25, 2012, 07:17:45 PM »
HOLE 13 (Hole O’Cross In), Par-4: 465 yards











Twitter: @BennyJarvis
Instagram: @bennyj08

Gary Slatter

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2012, 07:21:06 PM »
I think 12 gets lost in the shuffle at The Old Course.  People talk about 17, 14, 16...but 12 is a truly great golf hole.  IMO.
I love the 12th - never seems to play the same, full of surprises.  At first you think it's got the wrong HDCP!
Gary Slatter
gary.slatter@raffles.com

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #43 on: September 25, 2012, 07:31:17 PM »
Ben,

The day I sat and watched the pros play from what I can remember there seemed to be 3 general approaches.

1.Playing left of middle with a mid to long iron with the intention of finishing in the gap past Stroke bunker, leaving a fuller approach to help hold the back shelf.
2. Hitting a resuce/wood over the next bunkers but short of the greenside central bunker often leaving a tricky chip up the ridge, though it seems a very sensible play with a pin on the lower section of the green.
3. Hit driver taking on the front bunker in hope of hitting the green.

There was a fourth option that only Rickie Fowler took but it seemed to work…..Hit it in the grandstand behind 6, take a free drop in the rough behind the gorse hack it onto the green and two putt for par!

Again from what I can remember I’d say there was a fairly even spread between 2 and 3 with only a few doing 1.  It seems you can play right with an iron/rescue as well, which I saw quite a few amateurs do during my time up there but it seemed harder to hold the fairway from what I could tell, though you were less likely to end in a bunker. When I played I went for the green.


Thanks for your insights Tom. I'm surprised there weren't more laying up to the right side. I suppose the pin placement will very much dictate which side it's best to come in from.

I have played 12 twice with a very good St Andrews caddy named Bruce Sorley.  I am not long enough to carry the hidden bunkers, so Bruce suggests a drive into the rough toward the Eden course.  The rough is skimpy over there, and the angle into the length of the green is pretty good.  If the pin is on the back shelf it's hard to hit from any angle.  

Tom Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012
« Reply #44 on: September 26, 2012, 08:33:32 AM »
Ben,

The day I sat and watched the pros play from what I can remember there seemed to be 3 general approaches.

1.Playing left of middle with a mid to long iron with the intention of finishing in the gap past Stroke bunker, leaving a fuller approach to help hold the back shelf.
2. Hitting a resuce/wood over the next bunkers but short of the greenside central bunker often leaving a tricky chip up the ridge, though it seems a very sensible play with a pin on the lower section of the green.
3. Hit driver taking on the front bunker in hope of hitting the green.

There was a fourth option that only Rickie Fowler took but it seemed to work…..Hit it in the grandstand behind 6, take a free drop in the rough behind the gorse hack it onto the green and two putt for par!

Again from what I can remember I’d say there was a fairly even spread between 2 and 3 with only a few doing 1.  It seems you can play right with an iron/rescue as well, which I saw quite a few amateurs do during my time up there but it seemed harder to hold the fairway from what I could tell, though you were less likely to end in a bunker. When I played I went for the green.


Thanks for your insights Tom. I'm surprised there weren't more laying up to the right side. I suppose the pin placement will very much dictate which side it's best to come in from.

I have played 12 twice with a very good St Andrews caddy named Bruce Sorley.  I am not long enough to carry the hidden bunkers, so Bruce suggests a drive into the rough toward the Eden course.  The rough is skimpy over there, and the angle into the length of the green is pretty good.  If the pin is on the back shelf it's hard to hit from any angle.  

I think alot of amateurs do the same as its a sensible play, is there anywhere else in the world where a caddie tells you to hit it in the rough?!
« Last Edit: September 28, 2012, 11:46:10 AM by Tom Kelly »

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012 (HOLE 14 POSTED)
« Reply #45 on: September 26, 2012, 06:55:50 PM »
HOLE 14 (Long), Par-5: 618 yards













« Last Edit: September 28, 2012, 01:04:35 AM by Ben Jarvis »
Twitter: @BennyJarvis
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John Cornish

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012 (HOLE 13 POSTED)
« Reply #46 on: September 26, 2012, 08:53:48 PM »
Ben, the back tee on 14 was a struggle for shorter hitters in the Open in 2005 with OOB on the right and the nasty Beardies bunkers on the left. It makes for an interesting decision for the second shot. You can either play safe down the fairway, pulling up short of the drop-off to Hell Bunker but leaving a tricky approach over the crown on the front right of the green. Alternatively, you can play your second out onto the 5th fairway on line with the stand of gorse, which then opens up a better angle up the flatter rise to the green.

Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012 (HOLE 14 POSTED)
« Reply #47 on: September 28, 2012, 12:43:59 AM »
Ben, the back tee on 14 was a struggle for shorter hitters in the Open in 2005 with OOB on the right and the nasty Beardies bunkers on the left. It makes for an interesting decision for the second shot. You can either play safe down the fairway, pulling up short of the drop-off to Hell Bunker but leaving a tricky approach over the crown on the front right of the green. Alternatively, you can play your second out onto the 5th fairway on line with the stand of gorse, which then opens up a better angle up the flatter rise to the green.

John

14 is a wonderful par-5, with multiple options, which are evident as a result of your drive.

I found the right rough. Whilst just off the fairway, it was thick, and I wasn't able to advance the ball past Hell Bunker. As shown in the picture above, the pin position meant that nasty little knob came into play for the 3rd shot.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2012, 01:04:14 AM by Ben Jarvis »
Twitter: @BennyJarvis
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Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012 (HOLE 15 POSTED)
« Reply #48 on: September 28, 2012, 12:49:37 AM »
HOLE 15 (Cartgate In), Par-4: 455 yards












« Last Edit: September 28, 2012, 01:03:47 AM by Ben Jarvis »
Twitter: @BennyJarvis
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Ben Jarvis

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: TOC: Photo Tour - June 2012 (HOLE 16 POSTED)
« Reply #49 on: September 29, 2012, 08:19:23 PM »
HOLE 16 (Corner of the Dyke), Par-4: 423 yards











Twitter: @BennyJarvis
Instagram: @bennyj08