Commonground = FUN

[Geoffrey_Walsh]

Played Commonground for the second time today.   For me, it provides the perfect balance of difficulty, design variety, and pure fun.  Tom and team, job well done!

[Tom_Doak]

Geoffrey:

Thanks.  We are interested to see how it is received in the U.S. Amateur qualifying rounds, two weeks from Monday now.

Mostly though, we're proud of what they are doing out there, with their junior programs and caddie programs and all the rest.  Aurora can use all the community programs it can get right now.

[Jim Colton]

Agreed. I played Common for the first time on Monday and it is a blast. I wish it was in Chicago. Can we sign a petition to get Some government funds for The Renaissance gang to recycle municipal courses in major metro areas? The game would be much better off in the long run.

[David_Elvins]

Is there any indication yet as to the financial success of the redesign?

[Lynn_Shackelford]

I played it this summer.  It is a good golf course, but if the wind doesn't blow, even at 7,800 yards the amateurs might take it low.

I thought there were two to 3 options on the tee ball on most par 4s and par 5s.  It is wide open and with the altitude those young college players won't have hold back on their tee shots.  If the wind comes up it will be a proper test.

[Ross Harmon]

Is there any indication yet as to the financial success of the redesign?

I don't know anything "official", but I live nearby and am there about 2-3x a month. It's always busy and the rates are fairly high. They don't overdue it on maintenance and have a simple clubhouse, so I'm guessing the overall numbers are fine to probably great.

[Howard Riefs]

I don't know anything "official", but I live nearby and am there about 2-3x a month. It's always busy and the rates are fairly high. They don't overdue it on maintenance and have a simple clubhouse, so I'm guessing the overall numbers are fine to probably great.

CG is $50/round (or $30 for twilight). That seems like a bargain for a quality course like CG.

http://www.commongroundgc.com/rates.aspx

Perhaps it's all relative.

[Tom_Doak]

Is there any indication yet as to the financial success of the redesign?

David:

The owners are the Colorado Golf Association, which is a non-profit group, so the goal is to keep the price reasonable and to help support their various outreach programs.  They seem to be doing very well on both counts.


Lynn:

I'm sure some of the amateurs will go low there; I've played with a couple of guys who shot 67 and 68, and neither of them will qualify for the Amateur.  But, there are some tough hole locations to be found if they want to use them, and I'm guessing they will.

[Ross Harmon]

CG is $50/round (or $30 for twilight). That seems like a bargain for a quality course like CG.

http://www.commongroundgc.com/rates.aspx

Perhaps it's all relative.

I agree Howard, it is a bargain. For those "cart riders" the fee is $65, which is probably 3/4s of the golfers there. My comment about fairly high was more that it is priced higher than almost any of the other public courses (City Park, Park Hill, Kennedy, Aurora Hills) surrounding it.

[Geoffrey_Walsh]

Lynn:

I'm sure some of the amateurs will go low there; I've played with a couple of guys who shot 67 and 68, and neither of them will qualify for the Amateur.  But, there are some tough hole locations to be found if they want to use them, and I'm guessing they will.

Tom beat me to the punch.  IMHO, the pin positions are the primary defense for the golf course.  Because its only going to be used
for one qualifying round, they could really select a challenging set without worrying about spreading them out over multiple rounds.  However, it wouldn't surprise me to see a low round there (61-63) by someone in the field.

My main concern was conditioning.  The course/practice areas were in good shape for regular play but certainly not ready for a US Am.  Does anyone know when they are shutting it down?  My hope is that they err on having more prep time... I really would like the course to have a great debut.

[Brian Colbert]

Tom,

Which par 5(s) will they convert into a par 4 for the championship? I am excited to see this place. What would you guess the scoring difference will be between the qualifying round at Cherry Hills and the round at CommonGround?

[Tom_Doak]

Tom,

Which par 5(s) will they convert into a par 4 for the championship? I am excited to see this place. What would you guess the scoring difference will be between the qualifying round at Cherry Hills and the round at CommonGround?

Brian:

My associate Eric Iverson built 3-4 new tees last year for the qualifier, which I have yet to see.  There are four par-5's on the course, and three of them [#7, #11 and #18] are easily reachable for this field.  I would guess they'll call #7 and maybe #11 two-shotters, although they might have built another tee on #11 to keep it a par-5.

Bear in mind that Common Ground was not built for this event -- the CGA wanted it to host all levels of state events, but no one ever thought of it for the Amateur qualifier until the professional at Cherry Hills [who had played in the Renaissance Cup there] suggested it to Mike Davis.

The difference between the course ratings for the two courses is less than two shots, but I would guess that players will be much more aggressive at Common Ground -- which will work out for some, and not so much for others.  The bad rounds at Cherry Hills will certainly be worse for the guys who are spraying it off the tee, because there are a lot more trees and hazards in play.

I am curious how the players will prepare for the event.  Do you imagine playing one or more practice rounds at Common Ground?  Will you have a caddie scout it out in advance so that you know which hole locations are foolish to attack?  I would think the players who play Common Ground on Monday will be at a bit of a disadvantage, thinking they have to go low there without an idea of what score would be good enough to advance.

[Brian Colbert]

Tom,

According to the USGA Amateur website, CG will be set up at a 36-34 = 70. Since for daily fee play it is a 36-35 = 71, do you think that means 11 is the one they will make into a par 4?

As far as preparation for the event, I will play one practice round at CG and one at Cherry Hills. That is what the USGA allows for. Unfortunately I am playing this Amateur on a budget as I am currently not working (I have a job, it just doesn't start until September) so I will most likely carry my own bag during the tournament. Usually after one practice round at a course I know fairly well which holes to attack and which ones to stay away from, particularly if they have the pin positions dotted on the greens.

[Geoffrey_Walsh]

Unfortunately I am playing this Amateur on a budget as I am currently not working (I have a job, it just doesn't start until September) so I will most likely carry my own bag during the tournament. Usually after one practice round at a course I know fairly well which holes to attack and which ones to stay away from, particularly if they have the pin positions dotted on the greens.

I don't know if it would be of interest to Brian, but there has to be a few GCA'ers in Denver who know CH & CG and would love to carry the bag (pro bono) of one of our own for the national championship!  What an awesome experience, to be there inside the ropes.  Maybe we should get one of those GCA bags for the looper to carry... How cool would that be, especially if he made a run!

[Brian Colbert]

Unfortunately I am playing this Amateur on a budget as I am currently not working (I have a job, it just doesn't start until September) so I will most likely carry my own bag during the tournament. Usually after one practice round at a course I know fairly well which holes to attack and which ones to stay away from, particularly if they have the pin positions dotted on the greens.

I don't know if it would be of interest to Brian, but there has to be a few GCA'ers in Denver who know CH & CG and would love to carry the bag (pro bono) of one of our own for the national championship!  What an awesome experience, to be there inside the ropes.  Maybe we should get one of those GCA bags for the looper to carry... How cool would that be, especially if he made a run!

If this really is of interest to anyone, I invite you to DM me.

[Doug Wright]

#11 must be the hole that will play as a par 4--there isn't a new tee further back for that hole and it's very short for a par 5 for these guys.

I'd expect the scoring average to be 3-4 strokes lower at CommonGround than at Cherry Hills and I'd expect there to be a 63 or two out there--there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. I hear the rough at Cherry Hills is getting very long and it will create havoc for some (maybe many).

FYi CommonGround became the second US Amateur qualifying course a year or more ago after Colorado Golf Club ran into financial difficulty and spooked the USGA.

PS Brian I sent you a message about caddying help. Send me a message and let's talk.