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Tom MacWood

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Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« on: June 03, 2012, 10:39:39 AM »
After Vardon and Ray made their famous tour of America in 1913, Harry Vardon said three best courses he saw were CC of Detroit, Toronto and Mayfield. Did Ted Ray ever say what courses he thought were the best?
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Dónal Ó Ceallaigh

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #1 on: June 03, 2012, 01:10:47 PM »
Ray did write a book titled "Inland Golf" and was published in the 1920s I believe. Perhaps he commented on US courses in the book, as many authors in those days usually devoted a chapter to US golf.

I've seen the book on Ebay a few times, but the title never really inspired me to make a purchase.
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Jeff_Mingay

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2012, 03:45:58 PM »
Tom,

If I'm not mistaken, that would be the CC Detroit course that NLE... the one that played partly along the shore of Lake St. Clair prior to construction of the new CCD, by Colt & Alison, at the club's current site?

I'm fortunate to be playing Toronto tomorrow. What'd Vardon shoot, I'll see if I can beat that score ;)
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Brian Ross

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2012, 05:03:34 PM »
Jeff,

I just toured Toronto on Tuesday morning with the Super, Al Schwemler.  I had a great time.  The course is in terrific shape right now.  Unfortunately, a prior commitment to visit St. George's that afternoon precluded me from being able to tee it up. :-\

Enjoy your time, it's an impressive course on a great piece of land!  I hope you will check back in with your thoughts after your round.
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Tom MacWood

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2012, 06:02:10 PM »
Yes, it was the old CC of Detroit course that is NLE. That course hosted the 1915 US Am.
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Jim_Kennedy

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2012, 06:39:39 PM »
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 06:42:58 PM by Jim_Kennedy »
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"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Tom_Doak

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2012, 06:43:41 PM »
Quote from: Jim_Kennedy on June 03, 2012, 06:39:39 PM
Here are some newspaper photos of the course from 1915. Is this the 'new' course?

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8146/7330919960_0fb6a9a7e7_c.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7233/7330919970_0cfb3dd277_c.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7237/7330920034_fbb3879a7b_c.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7225/7330937604_75da8e5be3_b.jpg
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8142/7330920058_c9bd933922_z.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7242/7330920076_bc2d710008_c.jpg

Jim:

That must be the old course.  I don't recognize the drawings of holes 11, 12 and 13 at all, and we just did extensive work there a year or two ago.

My understanding was that a handful of the holes on the current course [including the first two or three, and some of the short third nine] were part of Colt's original 18, but I'd have to get the club's history book to see if they depicted it on paper.  And I'm about 8000 miles away from the office this week, so it will have to wait a little while.
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Jim_Kennedy

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #7 on: June 03, 2012, 06:45:13 PM »
Quote from: Tom_Doak on June 03, 2012, 06:43:41 PM
.....I'm about 8000 miles away from the office this week, so it will have to wait a little while.

That's not a good excuse.  ;D

Edit: This was the course that held the US Amateur on August 28th, 1915, and a paragraph in one of the articles said that the club had done a lot of work on the course so it would live up to the reputation given it in 1913 by Harry Vardon, when he called it the finest links in the USA.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 06:56:41 PM by Jim_Kennedy »
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"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Tom MacWood

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2012, 06:59:37 PM »
I just reread Vardon's 1914 article about American golf, and he said CC of Detroit was the best, followed by Mayfield, Toronto and Myopia, in that order. He also said the best greens he ran across were at Victoria, Shaughnessy Heights, Waverly and Seattle, interestingly all in the Pacific NW. He said the grass strain was unique.
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Bill_McBride

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2012, 09:59:49 PM »
Quote from: Tom MacWood on June 03, 2012, 06:59:37 PM
I just reread Vardon's 1914 article about American golf, and he said CC of Detroit was the best, followed by Mayfield, Toronto and Myopia, in that order. He also said the best greens he ran across were at Victoria, Shaughnessy Heights, Waverly and Seattle, interestingly all in the Pacific NW. He said the grass strain was unique.

He liked poa annua!

I'm playing Victoria soon, and after seeing the photos on their website (a composite of Pebble and Cypress along the ocean), have to say I'm most excited!
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Rich Goodale

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Re: Vardon & Ray in America 1913
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2012, 06:44:11 AM »
If it was the 1911-1912  "new" version of CC of D, Archie Simpson was seriously involved in the "laying out" of the course.
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