Should Bandon Allow Limited Cart Play?

[Terry Lavin]

I recently returned from my fifth trip to Bandon, the Holy Grail of golf in the US, in my not so humble opinion.  The walking-only requirement is a major influence on the overall ethos of the resort and is probably its single-most distinguishing feature.  But that requirement is also a limiting factor, business wise.  There are a lot of players who will never go to Bandon because of the absence of carts.  There are many players who limit the amount of rounds played once there because of a lack of desire to walk a second 18.  I've been wondering if there is a common ground that could allow limited cart play.  I've been told that the fescue grass could tolerate no more than 25% of rounds to be played with carts.  The options could include:  Rotating the one course per day that allows carts; Allowing carts after a certain time of the day, for "replay" rounds only;  Allowing only a certain number of carts to be reserved per day.  I'm sure that there are other variations on this theme that could be considered.

From a business standpoint, there is no question that the baby boomer golfers are aging and are less able to contemplate walking only.  The next generation of golfers is not nearly as populous, for many reasons that need not be discussed here.  As a businessman, I would think that Mike Keiser has to figure out a way to either grow the game for younger players (and joined others who have failed in that quest) or figure out a way to adapt to his aging demographic.

What do you think?  Would it kill the vibe?  Would limited cart play not really affect the overall enjoyment of the resort?  Would it be nothing short of great if you could take a cart in the afternoon, after playing 18?

[Mac Plumart]

Terry...

I hear you, but I vote "no".

I say this even though I could barely walk after my second round at Bandon Dunes Resort and I had 3 days left of nothing but walking golf.  I'd rather limp around that place and struggle to keep my balance and make a turn then see carts racing all over that perfect golf landscape.

But that is just my opinion.

[William_G]

no

additionally, carts are not compatible with healthy fescue

and golf as it was meant to be is a walking game

[George Freeman]

Terry - in your opinion, does the course need another "arrow in the quiver" to attract more golfers?  From my one experience at the resort and everything I've heard and read, the resort is damn near close to capacity year round.  If that is the case, what would be their incentive to add carts?  

I guess one could argue you can always squeeze more profit out of any endeavor, but at what expense?  So far, Mike Keiser appears unwilling to sacrifice the culture of the resort in an effort to drum up more profit.  And I for one am very happy that's his stance.

[Sean Leary]

All good ideas. My biggest fear would be a possible change in the clientele. For the most part only serious golfers go to Bandon now. With more corporate and non serious golfer visitors, it might affect the vibe a bit.

[Will MacEwen]

All good ideas. My biggest fear would be a possible change in the clientele. For the most part only serious golfers go to Bandon now. With more corporate and non serious golfer visitors, it might affect the vibe a bit.

Agreed.  That is also one reason why I like the resort in the winter months - you have to be pretty stout (and maybe cheap) to embrace 3-4 walking days in potentially miserable weather.

[Rich Goodale]

I think that Bandon should (and I think it is inevitable):

1.  Expand their caddie programe to include "bag carriers" (hopefully recruited from the local school age population);

2.  Allow limited cart play (ideally one person carts) to over-65s or spring chickens with a valid medical certificate

This is the way that course/club policy is going in Scotland (where golf not only is what it "used to be," it still is!).

[Stephen Davis]

No, however, I am glad that they allow cart use for those who cannot walk for health and medical reasons. I took my dad, who is diabetic and has a bad knee, to Chambers Bay and that nearly killed him. If we ever go to Bandon, he will be bringing a doctor's note.

[Stephen Davis]

All good ideas. My biggest fear would be a possible change in the clientele. For the most part only serious golfers go to Bandon now. With more corporate and non serious golfer visitors, it might affect the vibe a bit.

Agreed.  That is also one reason why I like the resort in the winter months - you have to be pretty stout (and maybe cheap) to embrace 3-4 walking days in potentially miserable weather.

I think you just described me perfectly.

[Garland Bayley]

In the back of my mind, I seem to recall that the 27 holes Gil is supposed to do off property are to allow carts. That would give the option of walking 18, then riding 18 at the other location or vice versa, if my memory serves me right.

[John Kavanaugh]

no

additionally, carts are not compatible with healthy fescue

and golf as it was meant to be is a walking game

Both Sand Hills and Dismal River have proved those statements untrue.

[jeffwarne]

I recently returned from my fifth trip to Bandon, the Holy Grail of golf in the US. 
 But that requirement is also a limiting factor, business wise. 
There are a lot of players who will never go to Bandon because of the absence of carts. 

Terry,
interesting observations.
my take
Your "fifth" trip to Bandon-kind've says it all
"a limiting factor business wise"-they're not building new courses every year because business is hurting
"lot of players who will never go to Bandon because of absence of carts"-that's a good thing

That said, Bandon does allow carts for physical disabilities which is a good thing.

[Garland Bayley]

no

additionally, carts are not compatible with healthy fescue

and golf as it was meant to be is a walking game

Both Sand Hills and Dismal River have proved those statements untrue.

In what possible way could Sand Hills and Dismal River prove that golf "as it was meant to be" is not a walking game?

For that matter, are the courses at Sand Hills and Dismal River booked full everyday so they might even have a chance of proving whether carts would be compatible with healthy fescue at Bandon? Apples to oranges my friend!

[Steve Salmen]

To answer you question Terry, it may not kill the vibe but it would hurt it badly.  I don't see a problem with walking only.  If Mr. Keiser is willing to risk losing money, that's his business.  I respect him for his conviction.  If you want to take a cart, just go to Pebble Beach or pretty much every other golf resort in the country.  You can even drive it on a cart path.  

The ironic thing is that the Bandon resort is the only place where not only are you allowed to take the pull cart over the green, you're encouraged to do so to speed up play.

At Royal Dornoch, I think anyone can take a cart.  The catch is that there are only three of them.

The other option is to rent the cart for $100 or so per round.

[John Kavanaugh]

Garland,

Sand Hills is all that golf was ever meant to be with the exception of being cheap.  It is a very busy very cart ball facility.  The fairways are a perfect as any in the world.

[Cory Lewis]

Bandon crossings allows carts. I would bet a good deal of there business is 2nd rounds from bandon for guys that can't walk 36

[Pete Lavallee]

 It is a very busy very cart ball facility.  The fairways are a perfect as any in the world.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Sand Hills fairways composed of rye grass?

[Garland Bayley]

"The fairways were seeded with a blend of four fine-blade fescues, which makes for a stunning contrast against the bunkers and the native tan andbrowngrasses blowing in the breeze."

From Ran's review of Sand Hills

[William_G]

John,

I am surprised at how people have ranked Sand Hills with it being a cart course.

Folks I've spoken with about say it is walkable, but that people drive to get around faster.

How many rounds do they have played there?

I'd have to say that there will never be carts at Bandon. The green fee could always be dropped if the tee sheet was emptying.

Thanks

[John Kavanaugh]

Sand Hills is very walkable, perfect in every way.  Their demographic likes to ride.  Me included.

[Garland Bayley]

...Their demographic likes to ride.  Me included.

John,

You need to shape up. Do it for your health. Do it for your wife.

[Steve_Roths]

I think Mike K. is taking the baby boomers into consideration.  The plan for Bandon 6 is to be another Par 3 course out near Bandon Trails' 3rd hole.

So, just guessing, the game plan would be for the boomers to walk 18 in the AM, lunch, and then the Par 3 courses in the afternoon.

[John Kavanaugh]

...Their demographic likes to ride.  Me included.

John,

You need to shape up. Do it for your health. Do it for your wife.

To say I ride because I am fat is as ignorant as saying walkers carry because they are cheap.

[Mike Wagner]

No carts at Bandon.....EVER!  None.....ever. 

Ever think the resort makes MORE money by not allowing carts.  It's certainly possible.  Quite frankly, it's non-factor - it won't happen. 

[SL_Solow]

Terry's initial post presumes that the decisions at Bandon are driven to maximize profits.  While I know that Mike Keiser has a healthy respect for the bottom line, my experience is that with respect to his golfing endeavors, he balances that objective with an even greater respect for his vision of the game and its architecture.  Accordingly, his view of what "should " be done will be guided by what he believes is the best way to play and what is best for the courses.  so long as he is in charge, I doubt that there will be a significant expansion of the use of carts.  What happens thereafter is anyone's guess.

As to preferences for walking versus riding, I much prefer walking.  I am no fan of cart paths or their impact on architecture or the appreciation of architecture.  But I see no reason to impose my views or prefernces on others in their recreational pursuits so long as they don't disturb me.  While I think it is a better game walking and I am generally unhappy if I am required to take a cart, I would not stand in the way of those who want to enjoy the game a different way so long as they respect the course and the game.