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Brandon Urban

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Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #50 on: April 26, 2012, 11:36:20 AM »
A few years ago, my buddy and I found a deal online for Swope Memorial Golf Course in KC, MO. We had never heard of the course, but knew the neighborhood to be, shall we say, not the best. We decided to do it anyway.
As we found out, Swope is a fantastic little Tilly design sitting up on the hills of Swope Park. It's a tight 6,200 yards with great multi tiered greens and rolling fairways along with beautiful views of downtown KC.
Anyone in KC should definitely check it out.
181 holes at Ballyneal on June, 19th, 2017. What a day and why I love golf - http://www.hundredholehike.com/blogs/181-little-help-my-friends

David Cronheim

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #51 on: April 26, 2012, 11:54:07 AM »
I'd throw Kebo Valley in Maine into the ring. It's a wonderful course outside of Bar Harbor with (honestly) lightning fast greens and spectacular views of Cadillac Mountain. The first 9 holes were built by Herbert Leeds in 1892. I expected it to be a cow pasture and it turned out to be one of the best "classic" golf course experiences I've ever had. I would go back in an instant.
Check out my golf law blog - Tee, Esq.

Doug Wright

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #52 on: April 26, 2012, 12:15:07 PM »
The Island, 1994. Just off plane first visit to Ireland. Knew nothing about the course, just showed up and had an amazing experience both with the course and the mambers.

Blueberry Hill, Warren Pa. A small course with some great topography and surprisingly good holes in the middle of nowhere western PA. A James Harrison/Fred Garbin design.

PS Are Unexpected Finds the same as Hidden Gems?
Twitter: @Deneuchre

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #53 on: April 26, 2012, 12:36:47 PM »


PS Are Unexpected Finds the same as Hidden Gems?

Doug:

That's a really good question, hinted at by Tom in his initial post. I think they can be, although Tom astutely notes that one of the misfortunes of being addicted to this site is that it's so rare to come across a truly hidden gem, as most of those have long been "discovered" here in on the board. My example (Shinnecock and NGLA) are about as far removed from the hidden gem type that most are referencing here (at least among GCA types), but it was "hidden" for me at the time, and really unexpected, because I didn't go out searching for them, and knew absolutely nothing about their role in the scheme of America golf architecture.

I hope to profile a true hidden gem here in Wisconsin in the coming months on the board with a picture thread -- one of the better courses that very few people know about, because its profile is so low.

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #54 on: April 26, 2012, 01:24:23 PM »
I hope to profile a true hidden gem here in Wisconsin in the coming months on the board with a picture thread -- one of the better courses that very few people know about, because its profile is so low.

You  tease!
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #55 on: April 26, 2012, 01:25:35 PM »
I hope to profile a true hidden gem here in Wisconsin in the coming months on the board with a picture thread -- one of the better courses that very few people know about, because its profile is so low.

You  tease!

I think I know what it is... :)
H.P.S.

David Federman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #56 on: April 26, 2012, 01:52:59 PM »
The toughest course I ever played is tucked away in Jaffrey, New Hampshire - Shattuck Golf Course - Brian Silva design. It will beat the crap out of you - but it is a great experience. A good hour and half drive from Boston area. Wouldn't want to play it every day - but a few times a year would be just right. It is hidden, but some may disagree at to whether it is a gem. I think it is a monster of a gem, if you get my meaning.

Will Lozier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #57 on: April 26, 2012, 02:32:45 PM »
I'd throw Kebo Valley in Maine into the ring. It's a wonderful course outside of Bar Harbor with (honestly) lightning fast greens and spectacular views of Cadillac Mountain. The first 9 holes were built by Herbert Leeds in 1892. I expected it to be a cow pasture and it turned out to be one of the best "classic" golf course experiences I've ever had. I would go back in an instant.

David,

Kebo is excellent - I must have played there 40 times during my summer in Bar Harbor when, in 1995, the twilight rate was $29 I think!  My favorites are #1 green, #3 & #4, #7-9, & #17 of course.  You'll need to visit Northeast Harbor next time you are on Mount Desert.  Then, go down Route 1 about 2 hours and play Wawenock - the 9-holer I mention on page 1 of this thread.

Cheers

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #58 on: April 26, 2012, 08:24:41 PM »
On Tuesday I played an amazing course in Louisville, Kentucky.  Hurstbourne Country Club, Keith Foster re-do that is just awesome, bunkers looks great, routing is tremendous, and the greens are full of character.  Seek this course out if you are anywhere near Louisville.  Big Spring CC in Louisville is also worth the effort.

I think it's pretty good (much improved after Foster's work), but not what I would call amazing.  Good for Louisville, though.

Cannot think of any special course that I selected w/o knowing something about in advance, but I could name plenty I probably wouldn't have heard of without this site.  Simply seeing Kington once makes all time on GCA worth it.

Pat Craig,
You should have mentioned Town & Country.

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #59 on: April 27, 2012, 09:57:39 AM »
Pat Craig,
You should have mentioned Town & Country.

John,

I was thinking about mentioning it, even though I wasn't sure if it was an "unexpected find" or not as I had seen your pictures in Jason's thread from last summer and you and I had e-mailed about it prior to me playing the course.

It's interesting that when I spoke with a number of local golfers after moving to the area about their favorite golf courses I heard many of the usual suspects: Interlachen, Minikahda, Hazeltine, Somerset, & sometimes WBYC. I had heard from a couple friends who had said that Town & Country was a "great club with a goofy golf course."

However, what I saw there when I finally played the course wasn't "goofy" but more good old fashioned quirky.

A few neat features/facts about Town & Country:
*It's the 2nd oldest golf course still being played on its original site in the United States (the Club dates to 1888, the golf course was built in ~1892-1893). The only course older is Shinnecock Hills

*Is on a really neat property which sits on the eastern bluff above the Mississippi River and is bisected by a ravine

*Total golf course property is barely 90 acres, but the course is 6400 yards

*There is a great old fashioned driving range which is steps from the first tee and is used mainly to beat a few irons into a huge, steep, hill before teeing off.

*The greens are really severe at modern green speeds, and putting off greens is a common occurrence, even for great putters.

*At least 6 blind shots (and depending on positioning opportunities semi-blind shots)

*The first three holes go: ~325 yard par 4, ~125 yard par-3, ~165 yard par-3

*The final five holes go ~240 yard par-3, ~530 par-5, ~525 Par 5, ~560 par-5, ~170 par-3.

*There are a number of really unique and fun shots around the course, including a drop-2nd-shot on the par-4 9th which gives you a great view of the River, the Marshall St. bridge, and the Minneapolis skyline (~4 miles away). There is also a fun ~120 yard uphill par-3 2nd hole which yields just as many birdies as double bogeys. A "benched" green at the Par-4 10th. A blind downhill 3rd shot on the Par-5 15th hole. A drivable ~280 yard par-4 with a tiny green surrounded by deep bunkers. And a 2nd shot on a 460 yard Par-4 which must carry a 40ft high steep hill.

T&C is a really fun and unique golf course which doesn't get talked about much on a local level, and not at all on a national level, but is really interesting and worth checking out if in the area. I hope to get out a few times this summer to take pictures and next fall or winter post an extensive photo tour of the course.

Hopefully Mr. Mayhugh will chime in with his thoughts on the course as well as a "unexpected find" as he saw it before me while on a trip to the area last summer.
H.P.S.

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #60 on: April 27, 2012, 10:05:00 AM »
I had heard from a couple friends who had said that Town & Country was a "great club with a goofy golf course."

However, what I saw there when I finally played the course wasn't "goofy" but more good old fashioned quirky.

Maybe you need to find some more discriminating friends -- eh?

I don't think any of us Minnesota GCAers would have used the word "goofy."

---------------

I see someone mentioned Kebo Valley. That was one for me; it had slipped my wee mind!
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #61 on: April 27, 2012, 10:35:44 AM »
I hope to profile a true hidden gem here in Wisconsin in the coming months on the board with a picture thread -- one of the better courses that very few people know about, because its profile is so low.

You  tease!

I think I know what it is... :)

Life is short, gentlemen. Don't hold  your scoops for Sweeps Month!
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #62 on: April 27, 2012, 10:42:47 AM »
I hope to profile a true hidden gem here in Wisconsin in the coming months on the board with a picture thread -- one of the better courses that very few people know about, because its profile is so low.

You  tease!

I think I know what it is... :)

Life is short, gentlemen. Don't hold  your scoops for Sweeps Month!

For what it's worth. I was totally wrong, I have no idea where Phil's photo tour will be from!
H.P.S.

Brad Tufts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #63 on: April 27, 2012, 11:25:57 AM »
I'd throw Kebo Valley in Maine into the ring. It's a wonderful course outside of Bar Harbor with (honestly) lightning fast greens and spectacular views of Cadillac Mountain. The first 9 holes were built by Herbert Leeds in 1892. I expected it to be a cow pasture and it turned out to be one of the best "classic" golf course experiences I've ever had. I would go back in an instant.

David,

Kebo is excellent - I must have played there 40 times during my summer in Bar Harbor when, in 1995, the twilight rate was $29 I think!  My favorites are #1 green, #3 & #4, #7-9, & #17 of course.  You'll need to visit Northeast Harbor next time you are on Mount Desert.  Then, go down Route 1 about 2 hours and play Wawenock - the 9-holer I mention on page 1 of this thread.

Cheers


I actually took a trip a few years ago with my brother that encompassed Kebo, Northeast Harbor, Wawenock, Castine, and Samoset.  You can guess which one was underwhelming...the first four are all great fun.  Samoset is great for the views and the ocean whores...but as a golf course it's only so-so.
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

Jason Topp

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #64 on: April 27, 2012, 11:30:36 AM »
I had heard from a couple friends who had said that Town & Country was a "great club with a goofy golf course."

However, what I saw there when I finally played the course wasn't "goofy" but more good old fashioned quirky.

Maybe you need to find some more discriminating friends -- eh?

I don't think any of us Minnesota GCAers would have used the word "goofy."

---------------

I see someone mentioned Kebo Valley. That was one for me; it had slipped my wee mind!

I would go with goofy.  I am a big fan of the course however.  I like goofy.

David Royer

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #65 on: April 27, 2012, 11:54:11 AM »
This past winter I was visiting my father-in-law in Lakeland Florida and played at Cleveland Heights Golf Club.  It is owned by the City of Lakeland.  It was built around 1927 funded by an industrialist from Cleveland, Ohio.  It was designed by William Flynn.  I stumbled across the orginal routing by the men's restroom.  16 of the orginal holes are left although they have expanded to a total of 27 holes. When I was playing the course the first couple of times I was struct by how traditional the course played as opposed to many coursesother Florida courses.  It proved to be a nice little find. 

John Mayhugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #66 on: April 27, 2012, 12:28:32 PM »
Pat,
Unexpected in the sense that you might have thought quirky or goofy from what you had heard (and it is), but also a really good golf course if people can get past some of the unusual sequencing.

On the same trip, I also played a couple of other courses that might not be on everyone's radar.  Jason Topp's club, Oak Ridge, has some really nice land movement and a great collection of greens that provide a lesson on angles.  I had read up on it through Jason's home course profile, so I sort of knew what to expect.
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/in-my-opinion/oak-ridge-country-club/

The other, Big Fish, is a remote Dye/Liddy collaboration. The first 9 are on pretty much nothing land, while the second 9 have more interesting terrain with holes surrounded by trees.  Common thread - FUN. 

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #67 on: April 27, 2012, 12:29:15 PM »
I hope to profile a true hidden gem here in Wisconsin in the coming months on the board with a picture thread -- one of the better courses that very few people know about, because its profile is so low.

You  tease!

I think I know what it is... :)

Life is short, gentlemen. Don't hold  your scoops for Sweeps Month!

Dan:

I won't have "access" until next month, thus the delay.

Hope it's worth it. :D

Dan Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #68 on: April 27, 2012, 12:45:20 PM »
I won't have "access" until next month, thus the delay.

Hope it's worth it. :D

I have no doubt that it will be.

Long lineup of emoticons omitted.
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

David Cronheim

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #69 on: April 27, 2012, 03:39:39 PM »
I'd throw Kebo Valley in Maine into the ring. It's a wonderful course outside of Bar Harbor with (honestly) lightning fast greens and spectacular views of Cadillac Mountain. The first 9 holes were built by Herbert Leeds in 1892. I expected it to be a cow pasture and it turned out to be one of the best "classic" golf course experiences I've ever had. I would go back in an instant.

David,

Kebo is excellent - I must have played there 40 times during my summer in Bar Harbor when, in 1995, the twilight rate was $29 I think!  My favorites are #1 green, #3 & #4, #7-9, & #17 of course.  You'll need to visit Northeast Harbor next time you are on Mount Desert.  Then, go down Route 1 about 2 hours and play Wawenock - the 9-holer I mention on page 1 of this thread.

Cheers


I concur completely. I thought about playing Northeast Harbor golf club, but couldn't sneak it in before the wedding I was attending. I also was really intrigued by the Causeway Club (http://www.thecausewayclub.org/course). Ever play it? It looked really quite beautiful.
Check out my golf law blog - Tee, Esq.

Bill Gayne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #70 on: April 27, 2012, 06:51:51 PM »
I wasn't expecting much out of May River and hadn't heard a lot about it before going. It was much more than I expected.

Ronald Montesano

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #71 on: April 27, 2012, 10:42:36 PM »
Loved Kebo...played it with wife...one of two rounds she's played.

Blueberry Hill is pretty cool, too.
Coming in 2024
~Elmira Country Club
~Soaring Eagles
~Bonavista
~Indian Hills
~Maybe some more!!

Dan Herrmann

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #72 on: April 28, 2012, 02:37:43 PM »
Elkhorn Golf Course in Oregon.  The golf isn't world class, but the experience is.  Playing in the Cascade Mountains, the smell of fir, and the beauty of it all.   A true gem.

Dave McCollum

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #73 on: April 28, 2012, 04:07:46 PM »
I live in Idaho.  Outside of the few rated courses in the north, golf in the whole state is unknown.  Most of it for a reason.  For example, here’s the top five public from Golf Mag:
 
1. Coeur d'Alene Resort, Coeur d'Alene
2. Osprey Meadows at Tamarack, Donnelly
3. Circling Raven, Worley
4. Sun Valley, Sun Valley
5. Whitetail, McCall

All mountain tracks.  Everyone knows about Sun Valley, the ski resort.  Not many know about the golf courses, some fine mountain tracts, especially the Trail Creek course.  TC was designed by Billy Bell in the 30’s and re-done by RTJ II in the 80’s.  For pure quirk, play the new White Clouds nine also at the resort.  Totally bizarre resort course.  Very difficult and weird the first time around.  My first time, I played with 3 other guys, all of us in the 10—18 cap range.  Our scores for nine holes were 50, 51, 56, and 65.  The next time was much easier and more fun.  You can’t walk it unless you are a Sherpa.  When I got in the cart that had just come off a round at White Clouds, the score card was empty except for the comment written on it:  “F**K THIS PLACE.”  Very polorizing course.  I think it's fun at match play, but beware the resort guest looking for a relaxing round of golf. 

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Unexpected Finds
« Reply #74 on: April 28, 2012, 11:40:08 PM »
This is  the first I read this thread.  Upon reading the accounts of Keller in St Paul-White Bear Lake area, I started looking at it on Google earth and comparing Richard Mandell's site reno plan.  Note to self and anyone in TC interested: I MUST play that course before the remodel!!!  And, of course I can see that the remodeled plan depicts some very neat changes.  I have to see what the heck is the deal with that 4th hole with a tree that seems that it must be cleared -par 3.  Talk about quirk! 

The unexpected find that comes to mind for me is Quic Qui Oc in Elkhart Lake WI.  The front 9 is what I believe is an intact and pure Tom Bendelow with some neat old classic courses on the kind of scale that seems to be Tom Bendelow's stock in trade of a modest community course, lay of the land and crafty routing among some glacier morraine and dumlin or eskars features.  The second 9 from late 30s is of questionable architect design, but does a very good job of staying in old classic character of the era, with hints of Langford and Morreau.  The third 9 was designed-buillt in mid 90s by Bob Lohmann, and while not in same character, is an OK sort of loop.  But that original 9 is a museum piece. 
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.