Cabot Links, Plus? [or, Highland Links, Plus? per Mr. FM]

[Carl Johnson]

Inspired by http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,51835.0.html and the reference to CL needing 200 rounds per day, what other area golf courses would be worth including in a golf holiday to Cape Breton Island (or greater Nova Scotia)?  Highland Links, of course, but what other courses of note close by?

[David_Tepper]

Carl J. -

I am guessing Cabot Links combined with Highland Links will be worth a trip all by themselves. There is plenty of golf in Nova Scotia, but most if it is towards the south end of the province.

http://www.golfnovascotia.com/

Listing of Cape Breton courses: http://www.golfnovascotia.com/cape-breton-island/cape-breton-island-golf.html

DT

[Mark Saltzman]

Carl,

I don't think there's much else really nearby.  Bell Bay in Baddeck, NS (about 90 minutes from Highlands Links) is always rated in ScoreGolf's top-100 courses in Canada.  No idea if it's any good, though.

[Dan Herrmann]

Cheticamp has Le Portage.  It's a very interesting golf course (in a good way).

Set against the mountains on one side and the sea in the distance on the other, it's small town golf at its best.   The world needs more Le Portage type courses.



Plus - it has a hockey rink and a Acadian cultural museum out in front.

[Carl Johnson]

Cheticamp has Le Portage.  It's a very interesting golf course (in a good way).

Set against the mountains on one side and the sea in the distance on the other, it's small town golf at its best.   The world needs more Le Portage type courses.



Plus - it has a hockey rink and a Acadian cultural museum out in front.

I was hoping someone would comment on this course.  I've actually visited the "clubhouse" and looked out over 1 and 18, but that's it.  I was taking in a summer musical show staged in the hockey rink -- something to do with local history.  The course looked like it had possibilities.

[Ronald Montesano]

Remember that you'll have two Cabot Links courses plus Highland plus whatever else there is. By decade's end you'll probably have 5-6 options on CBI

[Robert Thompson]

I played Portage last year -- and was pleasantly surprised. No it isn't Cabot or Highlands, and its conditions won't rival Bell Bay, but it was fun, walkable and has some interesting land and holes. It is unpretentious -- it is simply a good $50 golf course that nicely splits the drive around the top of the Cabot Trail. Heck, Chetticamp even has a Tim Hortons, and you don't see too many of those in that part of Cape Breton!

Depending on where you're coming in -- Sydney or Halifax -- will largely depend on what you play. Either way you'll have to drive by Bell Bay, and I'd say while it isn't the most inspired layout, it is an enjoyable round. It'll be interesting to see how it changes since Ted Stonehouse, director of operations for the past decade+, left this year.

The other course on the island that gets discussed is The Lakes (an awful name, I know). It opened in the past few years and is routed next to a ski hill not far from Sydney. I found the strategies a little weak, but it has some great views of, not surprisingly, the lake. Lots of elevation change and not really walkable, though I'm told some will walk it.

I'd pass on Dundee. If I had 10 rounds, I'd do four each at Highlands and Cabot and one at Portage and Bell Bay just to break up drives.

[Carl Johnson]

Thanks for the responses.  One of the reasons I posted this question had not so much to do with a trip of my own, but as a inquiry about whether Cabot Links could make a go of it without other courses in the area suitable to attract golf holiday visitors.  About five summers ago my wife and I visited Nova Scotia, and particularly Cape Breton Island, for about 10 days (no golf, but scenery, music, the outdoors, food, history, entertainment and so on).  Although beautiful and interesting to visit  (with a welcoming local population), tourism generally seemed to be struggling on CBI.  In addition, CBI was not particularly easy for us to get to from the southeastern US.  Canadians (and others) may see it differently, but my sense from our visit was a significant number of golfers who might play Cabot Links would be looking to make a larger golf trip out of it, and my questions are (1) whether I'm right in that assumption and (2)whether a group of area courses exists that would make a trip to Cabot, plus some of the others, enticing.

[Mark Saltzman]

Carl,

I've wanted to make the trip to go play Highlands Links for a long time.  It's reasonably priced, public (i.e. no access issues) and it's supposed to be one of the best golf courses in Canada.  But, there were no other courses in the area I am particularly interested in seeing.  I'm sure Bell Bay or Portage are fine, but I'm not travelling half-way across the country to see them, especially when there are so many other exceptional options around.  I've looked at ways to pair HL up with a trip to PEI or down to Halifax, but there's just no easy way to do it.

But, now that Cabot Links is opening, there is plenty of incentive to make the trip.  If Cabot Links is able to crack the world top-100 [I'm a person that thinks ratings do matter], then there are two public world top-100s reasonably close to each-other on the east coast.  Plenty of incentive for most people to make that trip.  A day at each (or two days at each) would make one heckuva trip. 

Good enough for me.  I'm planning on going in August. 

[Tom Dunne]

Just go, people. I'm not 100% prepared to evaluate Cabot as I only played the 10-hole loop last summer and they've been shuffling holes around in the routing, but what I saw showed plenty of promise. Highlands Links, however, should be near the top of anyone's bucket list. It's one of the greatest adventures in golf and some of the most creative, witty design you'll ever want to see. 

I passed on Le Portage and Bell Bay--hoofed a couple of holes of each without clubs, though. If I went back for another week, I'd pass on them again. I think those that are trying to find an East Lothian-esque golf cluster here are missing the point. Cape Breton is one of the most beautiful places in the world. Relax, enjoy the island and play Cabot and Highlands several times each--both will likely reward closer inspection.

[Guy Nicholson]

I'd echo what Tom and Robert have to say. If you do nothing but play these two courses as many times as possible and make the drive between Ingonish and Inverness, you've got the makings of a great week.

[Carl Nichols]

Remember that you'll have two Cabot Links courses plus Highland plus whatever else there is. By decade's end you'll probably have 5-6 options on CBI

Isn't that the open issue from Ginella's interview of Mike Kaiser, i.e., that they are waiting to see how things go with the first course--and whether they can get 200 rounds/day in July and August--before building the second course? 

[Carl Johnson]

Remember that you'll have two Cabot Links courses plus Highland plus whatever else there is. By decade's end you'll probably have 5-6 options on CBI

Isn't that the open issue from Ginella's interview of Mike Kaiser, i.e., that they are waiting to see how things go with the first course--and whether they can get 200 rounds/day in July and August--before building the second course? 

That would be my concern, too.  Is there a critical mass of courses to make Cabot's initial foray successful?  Or, is the assumption that there needs to be a critical mass valid?

[David_Tepper]

There was no critical mass when Bandon Dunes opened. It created a critical mass of its own.

[Tom_Doak]

Cabot Links is much more comparable to Barnbougle than to Bandon [or East Lothian].  The area is a regular vacation spot for many people, but the questions are, how many of them will bring their golf clubs along, and will they love it enough to make multiple trips each year, or to play multiple rounds when they get there?  That's what it will take for the place to be a real success.

"Critical mass" is more important when a course is trying to compete against other great destinations in the world.  That may be the long-term goal for Cabot, but they have to get over the hump regionally, first.

 

[Greg Tallman]

I wonder how Keiser and Ben are using Bandon in terms of cross marketing. The Bandon faithful are a rather adventurous group and I woudl be shcoked if they were not pushing Cabot to the guests at Bandon... and being successful.

[Tom_Doak]

I wonder how Keiser and Ben are using Bandon in terms of cross marketing. The Bandon faithful are a rather adventurous group and I woudl be shcoked if they were not pushing Cabot to the guests at Bandon... and being successful.

That could be a case of "taking money out of your left pocket and putting it in the right pocket."

I would guess that they'll concentrate their marketing efforts on the east coast [Boston, NY, maybe Philadelphia, and of course Toronto and Montreal] where guys have traveled to Bandon once or twice, but aren't likely to go every year.

[Frank M]

I think this thread should be renamed to "Highlands Links, Plus?"

Highlands Links is IMO worth the trip alone.

[Carl Johnson]

I think this thread should be renamed to "Highlands Links, Plus?"

Highlands Links is IMO worth the trip alone.

Willing to oblige, but the question has to do with economics -- Cabot new and new dollars, vs. the established position of Highland Links, and its financial situation -- to compare.  Highland, a great established course vs. the situation of Cabot, a new and hoped-to-be recognized as a great course.

[Greg Beaulieu]

I think this thread should be renamed to "Highlands Links, Plus?"

Highlands Links is IMO worth the trip alone.

Willing to oblige, but the question has to do with economics -- Cabot new and new dollars, vs. the established position of Highland Links, and its financial situation -- to compare.  Highland, a great established course vs. the situation of Cabot, a new and hoped-to-be recognized as a great course.

I think Cabot has little risk of not being recognized as a great course. The question of economics is certainly valid, and the two operations could not be more different in that regard. Cabot is owned by a guy that needs to make a return on his investment, while Highland is government owned and operated, and doesn't have to meet those same types of economic targets. I would expect that the experiences are very different. Highland is a fabulous course, and delivers an OK experience in the lodge. Cabot's course is equally great IMO, but totally different in style, and I expect the experience off the course will be superior. I just spent some time looking at the wine and whisky list on the Cabot website, and it is astounding that some of the selections they have are available anywhere in the province, much less a small town like Inverness. In part, it is trying to attract a market that has not generally come to Nova Scotia previously, more like the Bandon experience where groups fly in and are not particularly concerned about what the cost may be, while still being able to offer the experience to others for a reasonable price. Good for them, and I hope they do it.

[Ronald Montesano]

Since no east coast golfers go to Bandon ... what's that? They do? Oh.

Golfers from all over the world want to play Cabot and they go there in droves. The people of the community will hopefully embrace golfers as folks in Bandon have and a mini-recovery for Inverness will take place. I will Frank The Tank down main street if the second course is not built. I'm that confident in the man and I'm that confident in the music and culture and weather of the maritime islands. I have a lifelong friend who goes to CBI every summer and loves the joint, and he's not a golfer.

[Frank M]

Carl, I didn't mean to actually make you change your subject.I just wanted to point out there has been reason to go to CBI for a long time now, and that Cabot isn't the only reason. Even if Cabot were not around, it would still be more than worth it IMO.

[Carl Johnson]

Carl,

I didn't mean to actually make you change your subject.

I just wanted to point out there has been reason to go to CBI for a long time now and that Cabot isn't the only reason. In fact, even if Cabot were not in existence, it would still be more than worth it IMO.

I've been to CBI (but not for golf) myself, and appreciate its virtues.  I've seen some of the Highlands course--what you can see from the road and the lodge area.

I really don't look at the addition of Highlands in the title of my post as a change in subject, but an interesting comparative exercise on the business aspect of these two courses.  Obviously, Highland Links is established and successful on its own, while, notwithstanding that Cabot promises to be a great course, its starting point is different and it presents different business challenges.  What I was trying to do was get a discussion going about Cabot's business prospects as a new venture . . . and how important the existence of other nearby golf courses would be to its success.  Although Highland Links has been successful pretty much by itself, I can see Cabot actually helping Highland's business, too.

I'd be interested on others' perspectives on this.

[Carl Nichols]

I live on the East Coast, and there was little chance I would've traveled to CBI just to play Highland Links -- not because I wouldn't have wanted to, but because it's a long trip for a single course (and I visited CBI a long time ago for non-golf reasons), and there are so many other places in the world that are/were therefore ahead of it on my list. With a second course (ie, the first course at Cabot) I'm much, much more likely to go.  

[Scott Warren]

To which airports in Nova Scotia can you fly directly on a commercial airline from the US?