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Mac Plumart

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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2012, 10:40:01 AM »
We need more kids' courses.  After seeing the success of the one we built at Common Ground, we are trying to convince other future clients to build something similar.  [We had one as part of our proposal for Rio, too.]

Carl Johnson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #2 on: March 11, 2012, 10:46:46 AM »
Seems like a worthy idea to give a try.  The "new golfer" issue is more complicated, but such courses could be a piece of the action.  Again, looks like it's worth a shot.

David Harshbarger

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2012, 11:14:04 AM »
A win/win/win.

GCAs get some work and entree into clubs.

Clubs get insight into services and facilities that support growth.

The industry grows the game.

Anyone on the board participating?

Dave
The trouble with modern equipment and distance—and I don't see anyone pointing this out—is that it robs from the player's experience. - Mickey Wright

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2012, 01:43:49 PM »
I have advocated here in that past that we need a program like the old Tilly one to remove another common obstacle to beginners and high handicappers from golf courses. Apparently we learned from the earlier program that "top shot bunkers" were a bad thing, as you don't see new courses getting build with those anymore.

What does this new program need to do? Get rid of the unnecessary, artificial ponds! ;D One such "top shot pond" delayed Kalen's demise at Wine Valley, and shall forever live infamy for that.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Morgan Clawson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2012, 02:15:49 PM »
Golden Valley Country Club just outside Minneapolis was designed by Tillie and has a 4 or so hole kids course. It's right by the range and serves double duty as a short game practice area. I have no idea if Tillie included it in his plans or if it was added later.

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2012, 02:23:33 PM »
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +3/-1
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2012, 03:20:00 PM »
David,
Along with Tom's Common Ground:

http://www.asgca.org/images/stories/news-releases/bunnyslopes_bydesign.pdf


Funny how the ASGCA jumped on this three years after we built the kids' course at Common Ground ... and right after they had their annual meeting in town!

But I didn't realize they were commissioning Adam Lawrence to write stories on stuff.

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2012, 03:22:56 PM »
My recollection of Macan's biography states he created at least two, if not more, pitch and putt courses in Vancouver city parks.

Dan Hixson (Wine Valley, Bandon Crossings) got his start helping Bunny Mason build a childrens/practice course at Columbia Edgewater in Portland.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2012, 03:30:02 PM »
Funny how the ASGCA jumped on this three years after we built the kids' course at Common Ground ... and right after they had their annual meeting in town!

But I didn't realize they were commissioning Adam Lawrence to write stories on stuff.

It's not his lone effort.
http://asgca.org/images/stories/news-releases/By_Design_Fall_2010_-_Golf_architects_spread_their_wings.pdf
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2012, 03:33:15 PM »
Golden Valley Country Club just outside Minneapolis was designed by Tillie and has a 4 or so hole kids course. It's right by the range and serves double duty as a short game practice area. I have no idea if Tillie included it in his plans or if it was added later.

I haven't been there yet but I've heard John Fought built a really neat 6 hole par-3 course (which I think includes a mini-redan) at Wayzata CC when their range was rebuilt a few years back.

There were a couple fun par-3 courses back in Chicago that I played quite a bit when picking up the game. Winnetka GC has a pretty fun little par-3 course that wasn't much more than $5 to play (probably much more now). And then there was Anetsberger (http://www.sportsmansgolf.com/anetsberger) in Northbrook which I think was a homemade course used by Company employees after work. Juniors could play it for a few $ placed into an honesty box during the day.
H.P.S.

Matthew Sander

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2012, 04:01:55 PM »
I've mentioned this facility before. They have a great program and here is a link to their (excellent) website:

http://www.cantignygolf.com/youthlinks/

Jim Sherma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2012, 09:16:39 PM »
Spring Creek in Hershey is a wonderful little track. Milton Hershey had it built as the "Juvenile" course. It was originally deigned by Maurice McCarthy as was the original HCC as well as Hershey Parkview (NLE). It's a public part of Hershey CC and was redone 6 years ago and is a great little track. I can walk in in an hour and play it before going into the office regularly.

Ben Sims

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2012, 09:47:07 PM »
I think it's fantastic!! 

Just as long as the PGA and ASGCA don't represent themselves as the experts on designing kids courses because they released an initiative. 

Tim Nugent

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2012, 10:07:20 PM »

There were a couple fun par-3 courses back in Chicago that I played quite a bit when picking up the game. Winnetka GC has a pretty fun little par-3 course that wasn't much more than $5 to play (probably much more now). And then there was Anetsberger (http://www.sportsmansgolf.com/anetsberger) in Northbrook which I think was a homemade course used by Company employees after work. Juniors could play it for a few $ placed into an honesty box during the day.

Anetsberger was bought by the Northbrook Park District and was a total redo.

This is nothing new. Heck, a feew years back, I converted a range and some unused tennis courts into a 9-hole par 3 short course at Tuscumbia (I even through in a Barritz) and a 6-hole par 3 short course at Green Bay Country Club both in Wisconsin (where we also did a practice green and 18-hole bentgrass putting course modeled after Pinehurst #2).
Both projects had to be done in-house due to the cost/benefit analysis.
Coasting is a downhill process

Matthew Petersen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #15 on: March 12, 2012, 01:41:19 PM »
There's a wonderful Phoenix municipal facility called Aguila with a nice 9-hole par 3 course on site. It was excellent when my wife was learning the game.

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #16 on: March 12, 2012, 02:31:05 PM »
Pat,

My son played some junior tourneys at Winnetka.  Didn't Langford do the par 3 there as well as the regulation 18?
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Richard Choi

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #17 on: March 12, 2012, 02:37:38 PM »
It is almost impossible to get enough golf rounds for my 10 year old daughter unless I join a club (and a family friendly one at that), or spend a small fortune.

So, my daughter plays mostly tennis where there are a slew of jr programs and after-school options to choose from. Good luck to golf in the long run...

Steve Strasheim

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2012, 03:10:31 PM »
I'm all for more junior/starter courses.

Would like to see these courses combined with a "learning center" where experieinced golfers will also enjoy going to hit balls, work on short game, hit simulators in the winter, etc.


Mark Johnson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #19 on: April 13, 2012, 09:37:46 AM »
 
Golden Valley Country Club just outside Minneapolis was designed by Tillie and has a 4 or so hole kids course. It's right by the range and serves double duty as a short game practice area. I have no idea if Tillie included it in his plans or if it was added later.

I haven't been there yet but I've heard John Fought built a really neat 6 hole par-3 course (which I think includes a mini-redan) at Wayzata CC when their range was rebuilt a few years back.

There were a couple fun par-3 courses back in Chicago that I played quite a bit when picking up the game. Winnetka GC has a pretty fun little par-3 course that wasn't much more than $5 to play (probably much more now). And then there was Anetsberger (http://www.sportsmansgolf.com/anetsberger) in Northbrook which I think was a homemade course used by Company employees after work. Juniors could play it for a few $ placed into an honesty box during the day.


Medina in Wayzata have a 9 hole short course as well which is quite nice...  it almost swayed me to join there (even though I would likely get kicked off GCA since I know this board's feeling about the regulation course.)

Tim Gavrich

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #20 on: April 13, 2012, 09:55:50 AM »
It is almost impossible to get enough golf rounds for my 10 year old daughter unless I join a club (and a family friendly one at that), or spend a small fortune.

So, my daughter plays mostly tennis where there are a slew of jr programs and after-school options to choose from. Good luck to golf in the long run...

It is absolutely insane to me that other areas' courses don't have "Kids Play Free" deep discounts or freebies, at least during the summer in the afternoons.  A large number of the Myrtle Beach area's courses let kids play for nothing after noon with a paying adult.  My dad took advantage of this great policy repeatedly in the summers when I was growing up.  It's a no-brainer.
Senior Writer, GolfPass

Howard Riefs

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #21 on: April 13, 2012, 10:29:59 AM »
Pat,

My son played some junior tourneys at Winnetka.  Didn't Langford do the par 3 there as well as the regulation 18?


Yes, Langford designed both courses.

http://www.winpark.org/golf-club/general-info/wgc_history.aspx
"Golf combines two favorite American pastimes: Taking long walks and hitting things with a stick."  ~P.J. O'Rourke

Peter Pallotta

Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #22 on: April 13, 2012, 10:32:48 AM »
As Richard and Tim allude to:

I love spending as much time as I can with my five year old. Late on Sundays we try to get out about an hour before the sun goes down for a very fast 6-9 holes at the local course.  They let me take out a cart and Beniamino rides shotgun (and, when we're out of sight, he sometimes steers.)  He'll finish off the short putts for me, chip on when I got it close enough, have a couple of drives off the tee, and mostly runs around and chases the geese and looks for fish and frogs in the ponds.  As the years go on, and if he still wants to come out and play, I know one thing for sure: I'd join any course that also had a child's/beginner's course, 6-9 holes, and where they dedicated one staff person/ass't pro just to guide children along. I'd play 9 holes on the big course, and he could play 9 on the short course, and then we'd have lunch or dinner together.  And when he weas ready/old enough, we'd play the big course together.  I imagine I'm in the same boat as a lot of golfers these days, i.e. if a course wants me to come out and play golf more than once or twice a month, they'll have to make room (and welcome) my son.

Peter

Mike_Young

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2012, 09:57:44 PM »
David,
Along with Tom's Common Ground:

http://www.asgca.org/images/stories/news-releases/bunnyslopes_bydesign.pdf


Funny how the ASGCA jumped on this three years after we built the kids' course at Common Ground ... and right after they had their annual meeting in town!

But I didn't realize they were commissioning Adam Lawrence to write stories on stuff.

Tom,
I think Adam even owns their magazine or something like that....
Ben,
The goal is to get the foot in the door and form a relationship with a club....it's all about trade restriction in a subtle way....
"just standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona"

Matthew Rose

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: I just saw this. Thoughts?
« Reply #24 on: April 14, 2012, 10:56:14 PM »
Have to mention the Jim Ager Memorial Junior in Lincoln, Nebraska, where my older brother and I played as kids.

Designed purely for junior players. Nice little self-contained par-three course in the middle of town near the zoo. Not remarkable architecturally but usually in decent shape and was an easy walk. We were good friends with the head pro at Pioneers Golf Course in Lincoln who also ran the Junior for a time in the early 80s.




American-Australian. Trackman Course Guy. Fatalistic sports fan. Drummer. Bass player. Father. Cat lover.