[Adam Clayman]

Reading this article...
http://www.waaytv.com/news/content/didyouknow/story/Did-You-Know-20-Years-of-Golf/vxJIeLcA1ki0Ie28QWfTAg.cspx

...I recall one of the reasons to build in Alabama, from back in those days.

Can anyone guess why AL. was such a golf friendly state?

[Pete Balzer]

David Bronner

http://www.rtjgolf.com/history/

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Adam I think alabama being a nice place is not an always or even is today. David Bronner did change the face of the state with his golf trail. And golf has given the game and the people in general a much better reputation in areas outside the south. I learned a lot talking to him over a few years a long time ago and tried to do the same things in Louisiana unsuccessfully. He warned me our monies were in too many hands. The keys to his success was drive vision effective politics and mostly control of enough money. The enough money part was everything to him and me too as I learned the retirement system game.

[Steve Lang]

  Hmmmm, either its the good BBQ or , errr, Hogzilla, or,, errr,,, maybe cause Jerry Pate played at Bama???


.. like much of the south, get more than 10 miles from the gulf coast, and its pretty much mis-understood, a southern fly-over state.

[Adam Clayman]

Well, Since Seve responded, I thought someone might hit on what I was driving at.

Environmental restrictions!

Back in the 90's they were a very golf course development friendly state.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

And the trail comes back to David Bronner.

[Jeff Shelman]

As someone from a cold state who has been down to the RTJ Golf Trail twice on guys trips and played a couple of the other courses while in the area for work, I'll give my perspective.

I think it has worked as a golf destination for groups (4, 8, 12 or more) for the following reasons.

1. The golf in Feb-April is pretty cheap and there are good packages. Greens fees and carts aren't that expensive. Hotels are way cheaper than other places in the country.
2. 36-hole days are pretty much encouraged. You play one course in the morning and the other in the afternoon.
3. The other trail sites can be included in your package. Both times I went with groups, we based ourselves in Auburn (an easy drive from ATL) and went to another site for one day.
4. By late March the weather is pretty decent.
5. The courses, for guys who like golf, but aren't GCA nerds, are considered good. The conditioning is generally pretty decent.

It's probably not a complete list, but those are the high points.

[Michael Whitaker]

"And, if you're a golfer to celebrate 20 years.... 20 dollar green fees on the 20th of each month for the entire year."

Nice!

[Jud_T]

Isn't there better golf for similar prices in Myrtle Beach?

[Jeff Shelman]

Jud,

I don't have a ton of Myrtle Beach expertise, so prices may be similar. But I do think Myrtle is tougher to get to than some parts of the trail.

From the moment you pick up your rental car at ATL, you can be on the tee in Auburn in 2 hours.

To me, Myrtle is tougher than that.

[A.G._Crockett]

Isn't there better golf for similar prices in Myrtle Beach?

Depends on what you mean by similar prices.  Myrtle has pretty large swings depending on the time of year, and the peak rates for the very best courses at Myrtle would be far above the Trail.  But there is nothing on the RTJ Trail that comes close to Caledonia, True Blue, The Dunes, and a number of others at Myrtle.

For sheer dollar value for good golf, both are great options, though.

[Ed Homsey]

Back when I was even more naive about golf course design than I am now--early to mid '90s, I had a couple of great golf trips to Myrtle and played several courses there.  My favorites were Tidewater and Heather Glen.  Later, I visited the Trail on two occasions.  On first trip, we played the courses at Silver Lakes, Hampton Cove, Oxmoor Valley, Cambrian Ridge, and Grand National.  Returned a few years later to Grand National and then played the judge at Capitol Hill.  I'd go back to Alabama in a New York minute.  For me, the golf was just as good, if not better, than Myrtle, and the prices were very reasonable.  Recall paying a little over a hundred bucks to play Tidewater after Nov 15th.  Never came close to that in Alabama. I'm pretty sure there are courses in Myrtle that are superior to those I played, but, I was turned off by the overall Myrtle Beach scene, and the general topography of that area. 

I do recall having to do a lot of explaining to my New York friends when I told them we were planning a golf trip to Alabama.  But, at this point, I would recommend it.  I've played several courses that are more highly regarded in the Pinehurst area, but I can't say that I enjoyed them any more (except the historic significance), and they were much more expensive.

Had a great conversation with Roger Rulewich about the RTJ Trail several years ago.   I have a feeling that it was a unique situation that would be very difficult, if not impossible, to duplicate. 

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Ed that is correct. Alabama had a rare combination of political and economic control in ones mans hands who wanted it to happen. He made it happen by smart use of power, politics and vision.

[Melvyn Morrow]

Alabama in the 1880's - a little bit of Scotland owned by Old Tom's son-in-law James Hunter, a rather good golfer.
http://blog.al.com/living-press-register/2009/09/roads_less_traveled_how_a_monr.html

[Jeff Shelman]

The other factor that I forgot to mention is that for guys in this part of the world who go to Alabama, it's about getting out and playing for the first time in several months.

Because you know you don't have your "A" game, I don't think guys care quite as much about the courses being special.

They're in good shape, they are reasonable in terms of cost and they are at least average in terms of interest (and some are above average).

[Ed Homsey]

I forgot to mention a factor that was very appealing to me back when I played the Trail, i.e. if you carried your bag, you could walk.  During my first trip there, I walked every round I played.  Have to admit that on a couple of occasions at Oxmoor Valley and Cambrian Ridge, I hopped on the back of the cart of my playing partners for the long trek from green to tee over hill and dale.  I also liked the multiple tees on each hole.  You could pick your poison.  And, the great practice facilities at each site enabled one to shake a bit of the rust from a game that had been dormant for a month or so.

I found that most of the courses I played, particularly those at Oxmoor Valley, Cambrian Ridge, and Grand National, captured my attention and interest throughout the round.  I was impressed by the use of the very interesting and challenging terrain, and the many green sites that seemed perfectly sited and constructed.  Though it has been nearly 20 years since I first played there, there are holes, and shots, that are still vivid in my memory.  Incredibly interesting and dramatic holes that brought one's pulse rate up several notches, and required careful consideration in the "risk-reward" decision making process.  Some nice memories.

[Jeffrey Conners]

Love that you can walk these courses.  How is the pace of play on the RTJ Trail?  I am considering playing some of the courses there with my son next month.

[Ed Homsey]

When I was there last, about 10 years ago, and played the two Grand National courses (my favorites) and the Judge course Capitol Hill, the pace of play was very good.  At that point, I was beyond my walking years, so we were riding a cart.  I think they do a good job of monitoring pace of play., using GPS and on-course rangers.

Enjoy!

[Bill_McBride]

I forgot to mention a factor that was very appealing to me back when I played the Trail, i.e. if you carried your bag, you could walk.  During my first trip there, I walked every round I played.  Have to admit that on a couple of occasions at Oxmoor Valley and Cambrian Ridge, I hopped on the back of the cart of my playing partners for the long trek from green to tee over hill and dale.  I also liked the multiple tees on each hole.  You could pick your poison.  And, the great practice facilities at each site enabled one to shake a bit of the rust from a game that had been dormant for a month or

Ed, you walked the courses at Grand National?       If those 7,000 SF courses (few walk backs) require less than a 7 mile hike, I would be surprised.  The treks across the bridges feel like a mile each.

[Ed Homsey]

You're absolutely right, Bill.  They were long slogs.  But, my wife and I were hardcore walkers (in addition to being runners.).  I recall the starter on the Ridge 9 at Osmoor Valley warning us, as we were about to set off on a very, very hot day.  "If I see you coming down the 9th hole on your knees, I will not come out to get you!".  Except for some some long hikes from green to tee, such as the long bridge between 17 and 18 on the Links, as I recall, the Links and Lakes courses at Grand National were great walks.  Have to say that I don't recall seeing any other walkers during those rounds.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Yes I do not consider that a walking course. You have my admiration.

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