News:

Welcome to the Golf Club Atlas Discussion Group!

Each user is approved by the Golf Club Atlas editorial staff. For any new inquiries, please contact us.

Pages: [1]   Go Down

Michael George

  • Karma: +0/-0
Langford Renovation
« on: January 31, 2012, 12:59:45 PM »

What some input from the group.  I have a good friend that is on the board of a local Langford country club(northeast Ohio).  It is not a long course so the idea of making it a difficult or championship golf course are not under consideration.  However, he would like to have someone look at their current master plan, of which he thinks negatively, and possibly develop a master plan that would make the course better and more fun to play.

Knowing my interest in gca, he asked me whom I would recommend.  Was wondering if there are any architects that are extremely versed on Langford designs and would be a nice fit.  Even though it is a nice club in northeast ohio, cost is an issue.
Logged
"First come my wife and children.  Next comes my profession--the law. Finally, and never as a life in itself, comes golf" - Bob Jones

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2012, 01:11:03 PM »
Michael,

I believe Tim Liddy renovated the original Langford 9 at Harrison Hills in addition to building the new 9.  Also not sure who was involved in the extensive tree removal program at Lawsonia or what additional work was done.
Logged
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

George Freeman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2012, 01:14:02 PM »
Michael -

Mike DeVries is well versed on Langford/Moreau.  He gave a group of us a tour of the L&M course up in Marquette, MI (the sister course to his Greywalls design) and passionately discussed how good a restoration of the course would turn out.  I also recall he was quite familiar w/ Lawsonia.

He would be a good place to start.  However, I'm not sure how often he checks this website, so the best way to contact him might be through his website.

Hope that helps!
Logged
Mayhugh is my hero!!

"I love creating great golf courses.  I love shaping earth...it's a canvas." - Donald J. Trump

Matthew Sander

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2012, 01:31:24 PM »
Michael (and Jud),

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't it Ron Forse that did the work at Lawsonia? You may want to follow up with Dan Moore regarding the details of what was done. I know many trees were removed, but I have no idea how much restoration work was done to the course and its features.

I'll put it this way though, if Ron Forse is at all responsible for the presentation of the course as it stands today, he should certainly be considered.
Logged

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2012, 01:33:53 PM »
I agree that Lawsonia is the poster child for what you're looking for.  If nothing else I'd suggest your buddy take the committee up to Green Lake to see and play the course and look at some before/after pictures of the tree removal...
« Last Edit: January 31, 2012, 01:35:29 PM by Jud Tigerman »
Logged
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2012, 01:49:52 PM »
Quote from: Matthew Sander on January 31, 2012, 01:31:24 PM
Michael (and Jud),

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't it Ron Forse that did the work at Lawsonia? You may want to follow up with Dan Moore regarding the details of what was done. I know many trees were removed, but I have no idea how much restoration work was done to the course and its features.

I'll put it this way though, if Ron Forse is at all responsible for the presentation of the course as it stands today, he should certainly be considered.

Matt,

You're correct. Ron Forse is responsible for the Lawsonia Links restoration.
Logged
H.P.S.

Chris_Blakely

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2012, 02:19:57 PM »
I am pretty sure I read somewhere that Ron Whitten uncovered a large set of langford blueprints in Chicago.  You may want to contact him to see if he has the original drawings on your course.

Chris
Logged

George Freeman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2012, 02:21:17 PM »
Quote from: P. Craig on January 31, 2012, 01:49:52 PM
Ron Forse is responsible for the Lawsonia Links restoration.

Another great option/resource.
Logged
Mayhugh is my hero!!

"I love creating great golf courses.  I love shaping earth...it's a canvas." - Donald J. Trump

Michael George

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2012, 02:32:43 PM »
Quote from: Chris_Blakely on January 31, 2012, 02:19:57 PM
I am pretty sure I read somewhere that Ron Whitten uncovered a large set of langford blueprints in Chicago.  You may want to contact him to see if he has the original drawings on your course.

Chris


The club does not have sink stoppers so I would be nervous to introduce him to my friend.
Logged
"First come my wife and children.  Next comes my profession--the law. Finally, and never as a life in itself, comes golf" - Bob Jones

Chris_Blakely

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2012, 02:49:35 PM »
Logged

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2012, 02:52:50 PM »
and Dan Moore's excellent Lawsonia tour, including some old photos:

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,37022.0.html
Logged
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Chris_Blakely

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2012, 03:02:08 PM »
Logged

SL_Solow

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2012, 03:08:11 PM »
I would contact Dan.  He has done some excellent research.  As to Ron Forse, Dan put together an outing at Ozaukee a few years ago and Ron spoke.  He is very knowledgeable about L & M both in regards to their history and to their construction methods.  I suspect the latter would be very useful if a restoration type project is being considered.
Logged

Sven Nilsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2012, 03:11:57 PM »
Ron Prichard did some recent work at Skokie, which is a mix of Bendelow, Ross and L&M.  I don't know the details of the intent of his project, whether it was meant to recapture work down before L&M or to try to get the course back to their design.  There are probably a few folks on this board that have a bit more information.  
Logged
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

mark chalfant

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2012, 03:41:57 PM »
I have been fortunate to play and study Langfords highly artistic and compelling  courses for 20 years. Ron Forse, Ian Andrew, and Mark Chalfant are especially well suited to guide you through this process. 
Logged

Michael George

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2012, 03:51:30 PM »

I have convinced my friend that Langford was a great architect whose work should be restored.  However, I called this a renovation because there will likely be new concepts integrated into the course to increase enjoyment and "fun shots".  In my amateur opinion, I don't think a full restoration would work.  However, I could be wrong - just see my past posts.  ::)

Thanks for everyone's input. 
Logged
"First come my wife and children.  Next comes my profession--the law. Finally, and never as a life in itself, comes golf" - Bob Jones

Chris_Blakely

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2012, 04:49:29 PM »
Quote from: Michael George on January 31, 2012, 03:51:30 PM

I have convinced my friend that Langford was a great architect whose work should be restored.  However, I called this a renovation because there will likely be new concepts integrated into the course to increase enjoyment and "fun shots".  In my amateur opinion, I don't think a full restoration would work.  However, I could be wrong - just see my past posts.  ::)

Thanks for everyone's input. 

Well, if the course is in NE Ohio, it can only be one of two courses as Langford only did two there that I know of and both of those were done quite early in his career.  At this stage in his design career, some of the Langford elements that many on this site have come to love and enjoy were not as pronounced on these early designs.  Thus, I am not sure a full restoration is something you would want to do - maybe a hybridized one that incorporated some of the elements he used later on in his career.

Thanks,

Chris
Logged

Phil McDade

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2012, 05:01:54 PM »
Quote from: SL_Solow on January 31, 2012, 03:08:11 PM
I would contact Dan.  He has done some excellent research.  As to Ron Forse, Dan put together an outing at Ozaukee a few years ago and Ron spoke.  He is very knowledgeable about L & M both in regards to their history and to their construction methods.  I suspect the latter would be very useful if a restoration type project is being considered.

I'm a bit late to this thread, but would second Shel's comments; Forse has invested a lot of time researching Langford's designs and his construction methods w/ Moreau -- he's done some sympathetic work at Ozaukee and oversaw the Lawsonia work. I'd be surprised if there's an architect out there with a better understanding and on-the-ground experience of/with Langford courses than Forse -- his presentation at Ozaukee was pretty fascinating.
Logged

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2012, 08:16:20 PM »
I'd encourage the club or member you know to extend an invitation to Dan and also to Mike McQuire to take a drive down there to OH to play the course and give you their impressions.  Mike as also done a lot of work at his club, West Bend, regarding planning on the committee to recapture some L&M intent, as the other thread going on right now about WB looking to redo their bunkering along original design intent.  Both those gents are competent players and have a keen eye for the L&M style.  Of course, Ron Forse and Jim Nagle lead the L&M reno archie contingent.  I'd also be interested to hear what support and enthusiasm the super has for the project.  It really helps to have the super as a key person with sympathetic ideas towards the value of restoring as much as possible of the stuff worth restoring.
Logged
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

mark chalfant

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Langford Renovation
« Reply #19 on: February 01, 2012, 01:19:52 PM »
In addition to Ian Andrew and Tim Liddy, Jim Urbina would be an excellent choice.  He does a great job with meticulous research re courses authentic origins. Jim is very attuned to golden Age nuance and  how subtle tendencies vary from one architect to another. Also Jim has worked with the Dye family, and this ilneage has a strong connection to Langford himself. In addtion Jim has great dedication to putting  in long hours on the site of the golf course.Layouts that are both elegant  and fun are the result   
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back