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Bob_Huntley

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Wind at St. Andrews Today
« on: December 28, 2011, 11:19:30 PM »
I spoke to the Ford, the major domo at the R&A this morning and he reported that gusts of 80mph were being recorded all over Fife.

No one was out on the links.

Bob

Mark_F

Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2011, 01:40:39 AM »
I spoke to the Ford, the major domo at the R&A this morning and he reported that gusts of 80mph were being recorded all over Fife.

No one was out on the links. 

Was Alex Salmond giving a press conference in town, Bob?

George Freeman

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2011, 10:08:34 AM »
Wow.  That would be considered a category 1 hurricane!

I know I've told this story before on GCA.com, but this thread warrants another account.  I planned a quick there-and-back trip to St. Andrews while visiting a friend in London in February 2008.  I lugged my clubs all the way from the States for that single round.  I had one day to play the course, so I would have played in almost any weather condition.

After arriving in the city the previous evening in a pretty solid rain (I still managed to walk the course before sunset), I was pleased to wake up with the sun shining through my window.  However, the second I stepped outside, I knew I was in for a wild ride. 

Per the starter, the wind was blowing 45 mph steady and gusting into the mid 60s.  I walked over to the tee sheet board and noticed 3-4 morning foursomes crossed out (with "R&A" and "New Club" next to the names).  Needless to say, the course was almost completely empty.  I dropped three balls on the flat putting green and watch in amazement as all three were blown right off the green.

The day started off with my playing partner's drive on #1, a ball that I believe would have probably travelled around 200 yards in no wind, get caught in a gust, balloon, and come flying back at us bouncing out of bounds behind the tee box.  I had to make sure to set my travel bag down parallel to the wind otherwise it would get blown down the fairway.  One was forced to tee their ball at a 45 degree angle into the wind, as this was the only way to keep the ball on the tee.

I had never seen anything like it before and haven’t since.  I didn’t keep score but had a blast bunting it around that day.  What I do remember was hitting the best 5-iron of my life on the Road Hole, against a crossing wind, and watched as it landed short of the green, rolled up the slope, and stopped about 15 feet from the hole.

It was a great day.  And now I can tell people I played the Old Course when even the locals stayed indoors!
Mayhugh is my hero!!

"I love creating great golf courses.  I love shaping earth...it's a canvas." - Donald J. Trump

BCrosby

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2011, 10:37:45 AM »
80 mph winds are doing damage to buildings, I'd think.

At what wind speed can you no longer keep a ball on a tee? 

Niall C

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2011, 10:42:12 AM »
Bob

I don't rightly know the answer to that but in distant days gone past I've played a round where we each took turns holding our playing partners ball on the tee similar to the kicker in american football.

Niall

Dan Kelly

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2011, 10:45:39 AM »
Bob

I don't rightly know the answer to that but in distant days gone past I've played a round where we each took turns holding our playing partners ball on the tee similar to the kicker in american football.

Niall

I'm picturing Lucy Van Pelt and Charlie Brown.

(Thanks for repeating your story, George. I hadn't read it, previously.)
"There's no money in doing less." -- Joe Hancock, 11/25/2010
"Rankings are silly and subjective..." -- Tom Doak, 3/12/2016

BCrosby

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2011, 10:53:59 AM »
Bob

I don't rightly know the answer to that but in distant days gone past I've played a round where we each took turns holding our playing partners ball on the tee similar to the kicker in american football.

Niall

That sounds very, very dangerous. How many needed to have an orthopedist reset bones in their hands?

Bob

JMEvensky

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2011, 11:26:41 AM »
Bob

I don't rightly know the answer to that but in distant days gone past I've played a round where we each took turns holding our playing partners ball on the tee similar to the kicker in american football.

Niall

How much alcohol was involved?

Mike Benham

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2011, 11:32:40 AM »

80 mph winds are doing damage to buildings, I'd think.



Scotland ain't Florida, or Kansas, those stone walls are made of, well, stone ...
"... and I liked the guy ..."

Niall C

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2011, 11:32:58 AM »
No alcohol, just stupidity. and a huge amount of trust in being able to pull your hand away at the last second.

Just noted I've broken most of Ran's newly posted commandments. I think they will be like the diet, starting in January !

Niall

Mark Chaplin

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2011, 02:53:30 PM »
This is where wind speeds get confused, a hurricane is steady winds over 73mph, they will no doubt be gusting 90-100mph. Gusting in the 80's will be a force 9 strong gale or 10 storm. This is slightly stronger than the forecast today.

When we tried to play at Western Gailes and it was blowing steady 50-60mph and strongest gust was 88mph surprisingly the balls did not fall off the tees even though golf bags were being blown around.
Cave Nil Vino

Scott Macpherson

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2011, 05:10:51 PM »
Bob,

They must be getting soft in St Andrews.  It was pretty windy in Edinburgh too, but it didn't stop me getting in 9 holes on the Mussleburgh old links.... with my hickory's!!!! (no lost balls, but only 2 pars)

We did have to stop after 4 holes for lunch and a rest at Mrs Foreman's though.

Back home now, warm and safe.  :)

Bob_Huntley

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2011, 05:52:23 PM »
Scott,

I heard Tay Bridge had the highest reading of the day at 92mph.

How did you manage to stand and hit the ball?

Bob

Marty Bonnar

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #13 on: December 29, 2011, 05:59:29 PM »
Bob,
a mere zephyr. We had over 100mph on the Tay Bridge last month!
Been bloody windy in Scotland for weeks now - although one major benefit being there's no snow! Compared to last year which was positively arctic, xmas day was about 14 degs (highish 50s for you furriners)
v best
and thinking of you in Cal,
MB.
The White River runs dark through the heart of the Town,
Washed the people coal-black from the hole in the ground.

Jim McCann

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #14 on: December 29, 2011, 06:16:42 PM »
I played in a four ball today on the Jubilee and I don't remember any of our group remarking that the wind was THAT wild
(even though one golf bag was blown over on the tee near the end of our round). Maybe it really got up after we left the
course just before 3.00pm?  

I really enjoyed reacquainting myself with the Jubilee, six years after last playing it. The 15th is a fantastic hole, one of the
best short par fours in Scottish golf.

Here's a snap from the 18th (with the Hamilton Hall scaffolding and crane in the background during the current Kohler refit)
and you'll notice the flag pole's not exactly bent over with the force of the wind:  

« Last Edit: December 29, 2011, 06:42:05 PM by Jim McCann »

Scott Macpherson

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2011, 03:41:08 AM »


I really enjoyed reacquainting myself with the Jubilee, six years after last playing it. The 15th is a fantastic hole, one of the
best short par fours in Scottish golf.
 


Jim,

You have made a very bold statement about the 15th hole on the Jubilee. I am really interested in why you think the hole is so great? And perhaps you can compare it to 3 other 'great short par 4's in Scottish golf'?

scott




Bob- The wind was gusty more than anything. So the golf was testing, and high shots were difficult to control, but my hickory driver hits them low, so I was ok. Forget the umbrella though.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2011, 03:42:49 AM by Scott Macpherson »

Mark Pearce

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #16 on: December 30, 2011, 03:45:47 AM »
I don't know about North of the border but down here, just south of the border, the winds yesterday weren't as strong as Wednesday.  In fact I think the strongest winds were overnight on Wednesday when it sounded like a gale was blowing.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Ross Tuddenham

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #17 on: December 30, 2011, 06:19:39 AM »
Scott Macpherson

Count me as a big fan of the 15th on the Jubilee. 

I actually think, and this may be because I have not played enough courses, it uses a feature which is very much underused; a deep hollow used as a sort of “forced” carry.  Another similar example of this feature would be the hollow in from of the 8th on TOC. 

There is also the tee shot which from memory you have to go at the left hand side of the fairway to avoid a blind or partially obstructed view of the green. If you do try and go left there is a little bunker to flirt with.

At only about 350 in total I am sure downwind it would even be possible to reach the hollow in front of the green.  This I am unsure of as I have only played the hole with the wind strongly into my face.

The deep swale seems to offer up a hazard which is less penal than forcing a carry over water while offering variety over bunkers.  The recovery will also be unique and interesting given the rarity of the feature.  The chip/pitch back up to the green may be both blind and on and uneven stance.  I just like the fact you have to cross a feature where failure results in an interesting/challenging shot rather than doom associated with water or even a deep bunker. 

David_Tepper

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2011, 12:32:39 PM »
More gale force winds forecast for northern Scotland:

http://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/2575792/

Jim McCann

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2011, 12:33:24 PM »
Scott Macpherson,

Ross Tuddenham does a good job of describing the qualities of the 15th on the Jubilee.

He could also have mentioned the fact that the fairway a) drops away 10-12 feet on the left side into rough and gorse
and b) narrows to around ten yards before the big swale in front of the green.

One of my opponents found the little pot bunker on the left of the fairway, just before it falls away to the left.

Check the four photos below, taken as I walked to the green (the long shadow in the second image is from the big dune
ridge that runs along the right side of the fairway) as pictures are often able to show what words would like to convey. 

I described the hole as one of the best short par fours in the country (only to be written by a man who has played ALL
the top tracks in the country, of course ;)) but then Scotland is blessed with MANY great short two-shotters.

Off the top of my head:

Royal Aberdeen 10th
Loch Lomond 14th
North Berwick 13th
Machrie 17th
Skibo Castle 7th and 8th
Elie 5th, 6th, 10th and 18th (a particular favourite course of mine).

BTW, what’s the latest on your project at Carnwath?







« Last Edit: December 30, 2011, 12:50:50 PM by Jim McCann »

Adam Clayman

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #20 on: December 30, 2011, 01:09:33 PM »
Bob, & Bob,  We played yesterday in a steady 30+ gale, but when it got to be about 60, we had to head for the house. So, it looks like we were all a little blessed yesterday. It did depend on what time you went out. Heck, the morn was fairly calm.


I doubt there's an accurate number on when a ball won't stay on a tee. It depends on the tee. One can always angle the, tee to help keep a ball on it. Into a gale, I will often go sans tee, and be happy hitting it somewhere forward.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Scott Macpherson

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Re: Wind at St. Andrews Today
« Reply #21 on: December 30, 2011, 04:50:59 PM »
Jim and Ross,

Thanks for your thoughts on the 15th. It sounds like we could have a discussion on this hole and perhaps it should be on a thread of it's own.

Jim, re Carnwath, lots to do, but hoping to make progress in Q1 of 2012 with the planning application.Am happy to keep you updated. Meantime, I'm off to NZ tomorrow to carry on at Royal Wellington. (Will post some photos on that soon)

scott

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