Chambers Bay - Project Updates

[Zac Keener]

GCA board,

I would like to fill those who are interested in about the progress of the changes out at the Bay. As we look towards 2015, a little fine tuning was needed to host our nations championship. (I apologize in advance for the subpar picture quality as my Blackberry is now considered antiquated equipment)

Hole 1:

Softening of the right approach slope as well as a general softening of the green complex.


Green from the backside




#1 green is currently in grow-in. We are playing to an alternate green that resides low left of the original green. #1 green could open up as early as the first few weeks of next month as we would like to minimize the number of actual greens out of play to one at a time. As soon as #1 green opens we will start construction on #13 green (will update on gca as construction begins).


Following the routing of the course, the next project is the reconstruction of #3 tee. The championship teeing ground prior to renovation required players to hit over the public trail. However, the trail will be a main thoroughfare for foot traffic come open time and the crowd control of stopping traffic while shots are being played made this an easy decision to move the tee. The new tee box will sit on the old routing of the soundview trail (currently being paved around the new tee box; see pic 2).

View of the back of #3 tee from #2 fairway


Shot from the current tee looking back. It will "step" its way back for multiple tee options


Shot from #3 green looking back


Jumping to hole #18. This hole has seen the most dramatic changes (so far). The waste area off the tee shot has been expanded on the right. It now takes a tee shot of 270yd from the sand tees to take the very aggressive right rough, line. Conservative lines with the driver or even fairway wood is the only good option off the tee.
 

Looking back towards the tee


The fairway bunker that was added for the U.S. Am has been expanded by 15-20yds into the fairway. My helpful starter, Jim, is standing at the line of the originally constructed bunker.




Without a doubt the biggest change and could be, when all changes are said and done, arguably the most dramatic; the addition of a "pot" bunker on the left-center of the fairway. Placed at around 120yds, this makes the once easy layup much more demanding of a precise shot.


This bunker could make a name for itself in the bunker world someday. It measures over ten feet deep with a dramatic presence as you approach it for the first time.


I am as curious as the rest as to maintaining the grass walls.


Again, my lovely assistant Jim demonstrating the depth of the bunker.



I will continue to update the progress of changes out at the Bay. Future changes include (by routing order); #7 green/approach, #8 approach, new low tee ground #9, #10 bunker edging (in process now), #13 green, #17 lower teeing ground expansion. I hope you enjoy and I will gladly try to answer any further questions.

Cheers,

Zac Keener

[Michael Essig]

The pot bunker on 18 looks excruciatingly difficult!!!!! I wouldn't want to be in that bunker!!! Although that is the one links element that was missing from the course before. I love it!!!!

[Michael Essig]

Do you have pictures of the bunker edging on 10? I'm wondering what is wrong with the bunker. But to add to your thread, and for any reader that may have thought that some of the changes were due to design flaws, I know that the USGA wants to change the course to be more difficult and provide for the course to be set up in different ways: easier in places when it gets really fast, and crowd movement.  As I understand it, the only hole that really needed fixing was 1. The changes at 3 are for flow. The changes at 7 and 8  are to make the course easier when it gets fast. 9 is for variety of set up. I don't know what the change on 10 is for. The change on 13 is to make it more receptive of the long shots because a slope on the left front of the green got too firm and rejected approach shots.  The change on 17 is for variety of set up. And the changes on 18 are to make the hole play harder.

[Sean Leary]

Thanks for the update Zac.

Are there any other bunkers on the course that look like the the pot bunker on 18? Of course it is just in pics but it looks out of character a bit, but I will reserve judgement til I see it myself.

I have been secretly hoping that the tees on 3 would be lowered so that the shot might play uphill. Oh well.

Really looking forward to seeing all of the changes...

[Michael Essig]

From my recollection... there isn't a bunker like that pot bunker... The closest resembling bunker on the course is the green side bunker on 5, but even that isn't that similar to it.

The addition of the new tee box on 9 will make it play uphill... But the modification on 3 isn't changing the elevation.

[Sean Leary]

From my recollection... there isn't a bunker like that pot bunker... The closest resembling bunker on the course is the green side bunker on 5, but even that isn't that similar to it.

The addition of the new tee box on 9 will make it play uphill... But the modification on 3 isn't changing the elevation.

Michael,

Looks like the back tees on 3 are raised up, no?

[Joel_Stewart]

Is the RTJ2 organization involved in this and who is doing the construction?

[Michael Essig]

The back tees are elevated, before the hole dips down and rises back up at the green. The elevations on the tee and on the green are fairly equal, but it might be slightly down... if it does go down it is not significant. I can't find a picture of the hole eye-level, but in this picture it looks only slightly down, but too hard to tell by the picture. I can tell you though, having played the course a few times, that the hole plays fairly level.


I have no idea who is running the operation.

[Zac Keener]

Michael: In regards to the bunker changes on #10, maybe "changes" isn't the correct verbiage, more like editing. They are scaping the hillsides leading into the bunkers to provide more of a blown out look. The turf crew is doing a very good with this project. I will run out and grab some picture when they are done. This would be one of the few non USGA changes; not in play just aesthetic.

Sean: out of character to the course? Kind of. There are no other bunkers of this magnitude out there. One could argue that the greenside bunker on #5 or #17 are vaguely similar or the fairway bunker of #14 but none are nearly on the same scale or as penal. That said the bunker is interesting enough to stand on its own. It is something unique.

Joel: Yes, the changes are suggested by the USGA and then RTJ team visits and draws up a few options and then they go back and forth until the agree (for the most part). Pierce County is involved in the discussion as well (from what i understand more of a buffer or mediator between the two).

#3 pro tee (Am tee, pre-reconstruction) made the green close to level if not slightly downhill as it sat perched on a mound across the trail. The new tee looks about the same height. Without looking over the drawings I would say they're about the same.

Overall, the changes have made the course much more fair considering the firmness the USGA demands for the open. From the golf shop one could view, when all is said and done the course will be easier however, a brief rerun of day 1 and 2 of the U.S. Am make these changes necessary.

[Jeff_Mingay]

This makes me think of Erin Hills - another relatively new golf course where significant redesign work "was required" in advance of hosting a USGA event... curious.

[Michael Wharton-Palmer]

Looks marvelous...interesrting to see how the playrs from this side of the pond will feel about about playing another"links"style for a major...

[Sean Leary]

This makes me think of Erin Hills - another relatively new golf course where significant redesign work "was required" in advance of hosting a USGA event... curious.

Don't you think at CB this is due to the firm and fast nature of the course and not truly realizing how it would play when that fast? If we were talking bent fairways and poa greens I don't think we would see as many changes.

Next time you are here we should head down and check it out, me thinks...

[PCCraig]

Interesting stuff, thanks for posting. Without seeing it in person, I like the idea of the bunker in the 18th fairway...as I remember from March that it was a pretty easy layup (into the wind). As for the other changes, I don't know the course well enough to say yay or nay, but I didn't see anything that screamed "fix me!" when I played the course...however I'm hardly a TOUR pro.

[William_G]

thanks Zac, I like the improvements on 18 and 1

[Mike Hendren]

With apologies to Dr. Seuss, do I like this? oh no I do not:



It's clumsy.
It will only come into play for the mid to high handicapper who won't be able to get out.  Always a treat having to pick up on the last hole.  
It sets a dangerous precedent to tinker with the golf course.
The clean edges don't fit with rugged/jagged lines that are the golf course's visual strength.
Looks like what happens with you give a man with too much time on his hands a machine that stands idle.

As a heretofore unabashed supporter of Chambers Bay, I think it's awful.

The only redeeming quality is that even Dustin Johnson will know he's in a bunker.

Mike

[Garland Bayley]

With apologies to Dr. Zeus, do I like this? oh no I do not:



It's clumsy.
It will only come into play for the mid to high handicapper who won't be able to get out.  Always a treat having to pick up on the last hole.  
It sets a dangerous precedent to tinker with the golf course.
The clean edges dont' fit with rugged/jagged lines that are the golf course's visual strength.
Looks like what happens with you give a man with too much time on his hands a machine that stands idle.

As a heretofore unabashed supporter of Chambers Bay, I think it's awful.

The only redeeming quality is that even Dustin Johnson will know he's in a bunker.

Mike

Why don't the just put in a pond? Dustin could tell he was in that too.
"As a heretofore unabashed supporter of Chambers Bay, I think it's awful." is dead on right!
Whose responsible for this idiocy?

[Tim Nugent]

This makes me think of Erin Hills - another relatively new golf course where significant redesign work "was required" in advance of hosting a USGA event... curious.

Not so curious when you stop and look at the egos involved.  No architect would  appreciate, after years of thought, design and tweeks to get it "just right" having someone in a blue jacket popping in and declaring "Oh no, this will never do!"  Sometimes I wonder if the USGA makes changes on course just to remain relavent.

[Garland Bayley]

This makes me think of Erin Hills - another relatively new golf course where significant redesign work "was required" in advance of hosting a USGA event... curious.

Was there "significant" redesign required at Erin Hills? There was redesign required. However, the owner went off on his own making changes even against advising architects advice until he essentially bankrupted himself.

Is this "significant" redesign. Adding new tees for longer hitters is not necessarily "significant" redesign. Putting a one of a kind pot bunker in the middle of a fairway is not necessarily "significant" redesign. However, I can think of lots of unprintable words for it.

[Kalen Braley]

Put me in the camp as "Like" for that new bunker on 18.

Its a short par 5 as it is, why not put a little extra something something in there to spice it up.

P.S.  I'm guessing at least a handful of pros will find it in the Open after hitting a wayward tee shot and forced to layup.

[Sean Leary]

This makes me think of Erin Hills - another relatively new golf course where significant redesign work "was required" in advance of hosting a USGA event... curious.

Was there "significant" redesign required at Erin Hills? There was redesign required. However, the owner went off on his own making changes even against advising architects advice until he essentially bankrupted himself.

Is this "significant" redesign. Adding new tees for longer hitters is not necessarily "significant" redesign. Putting a one of a kind pot bunker in the middle of a fairway is not necessarily "significant" redesign. However, I can think of lots of unprintable words for it.

I hate agreeing with you generally but I agree with you..

[Sean Leary]

Put me in the camp as "Like" for that new bunker on 18.

Its a short par 5 as it is, why not put a little extra something something in there to spice it up.

P.S.  I'm guessing at least a handful of pros will find it in the Open after hitting a wayward tee shot and forced to layup.

Commie,

Short par 5? 604 is not short in the PNW no matter what time of year.

[Kalen Braley]

Put me in the camp as "Like" for that new bunker on 18.

Its a short par 5 as it is, why not put a little extra something something in there to spice it up.

P.S.  I'm guessing at least a handful of pros will find it in the Open after hitting a wayward tee shot and forced to layup.

Commie,

Short par 5? 604 is not short in the PNW no matter what time of year.

604 ain't what it used to be.  And also consider the following:
1)  The course is Fast and firm
2)  Prevailing summer wind is a tail wind.
3)  In 2011, they already bomb it massively long distances...in 4 more years, they'll likely be 10-15 yards longer.

I'm seeing the bigger hitters go Driver, 3-5 iron into that hole. (350 off the tee with 250 left for the 2nd)

[Michael Essig]

I don't know if the redesign is "significant", to me it more of a massage to the design, because there were holes that just didn't work.
A lot of the changes are being made after the Amateurs, who hit it as far as any pro, exposed problems with the course under the firm and fast conditions.  What was the average score, something like 77? That's what happens when you don't water for 3 weeks.
What they discovered was that there were no places to land the ball and hold a green, whether you landed short and tried to run it on or go high and land it on the green - that is a problem that needs a remedy.  It was only on a few holes, and it is no more work then Augusta seems to do every few years, but I am glad to see they are addressing the issue.  Remember, they had already done work on it prior to the Amateur, I just hope it makes it even better.  Cheers.

[Richard Choi]

The changes they are making at Chambers are not the same kind of changes they made at Erin Hills. To use a software development terminology, these are bug fixes not real design changes. The intent of the hole is still the same, but some of the holes were not playing as intended when greens and fairways were as firm and fast as USGA wanted. The modifications are so that the holes will play as intended when the course is extremely firm and fast.

Also put me down for "not like" on the 18th hole bunker. I wasn't aware that this change was coming. I don't think the hole really needed this as the green is very severely shaped. Unless you hit the right level, getting a birdie, even if you get it on in two is not a given. You need to think hard about angles and distance with the pin positions on the green. You really didn't need to make it any harder with this bunker.

I still remember during a practice round for US Am, the group I was with hit about 3 balls each from about 100 yards to the pin in the back right. I think only 1 got a shot within 15 feet and they had to hit away from the pin quite a bit to get it there. I would say it was plenty difficult.

For the bunker changes on the 10th hole, does it also have anything to do with the drainage issue from the mound? I know there were some severe water channels created from the mound runoffs into the green. Will the changes lessen that?

Good to have you on board, Zac.

[Kalen Braley]

Rich,

I would totally agree on that 1st part.  From what I've read and seen, these tweaks are indeed like shipping a hot fix/semi-annual updates, as opposed to the 1.1 and 1.2 type changes that have occurred at EH.

P.S. I do love the new bunker, but understand i'm in the massive minority on that one.  Its quirky, and I love quirk in almost all its forms.