[Tom_Doak]

Tom,

You will be happy to know I didn't mention Championship Course at any point.  Don't believe anything that begins of ends with 'Mr Clayton said'!!

Mike:

I am relieved to hear that.  Typical newspaper journalist inserting his own ideas, I guess. 

P.S.  Please tell Chris Kane I am not out to get you, I just know when something sounds wrong.

[Chris Kane]

That is good to hear, Tom.

Mike, any further details about the business model of this project? They say it will be public, but will they sell memberships as well? Will it be just golf, or are the planning a conference centre/hotel/day spa etc etc?

As I've probably said to you, if the golf course is even as remotely as good as you say it could be, this should be a slam dunk. Within 30 minutes of a city of 215,000, where there isn't a top 50 course at present. Whereas Barnbougle/Lost Farm rely on interstate (and some overseas) visitors for a good portion of their traffic, this one might be able to generate a lot of repeat business from locals.

[Bill Brightly]

How far will the drive be from BD/LF to the course Mike is building?

How do you get to King Island? Plane only or is there a ferry service?

(I am already planning my return to Australia!)

[Richard Chamberlain]

Congratulations Richard on the gig at King Island  - look forward to seeing what you do down there.

Thanks mate.
It goes without saying I am seriously excited about being involved in this project but to be honest just as excited to see all these other fantastic looking sites coming onto the radar.
If all the planets line up this will be a tremendous place to go golfing.

King can be accessed on Rex Airlines (30 seater) and its a comfortable 40 mins from Melb airport. There are other smaller plane options from the smaller airports around Melb.
For those that don't know its hanging out in the middle of Bass Strait off the north-west coast of Tassie.

[RJ_Daley]

I remember not long ago, we had a thread on the golf-residential on-going plan 35 miles from this Hobart plan. Greg Norman's team dropped out after several failed years.  Here is a news story recently about that failed project:

http://www.themercury.com.au/article/2011/11/20/278231_most-popular-stories.html

And a peek at the land that lies scarred and fallow there:
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=-42.539675,147.889152&spn=0.021091,0.052314&t=h&z=15&vpsrc=6

And that project was walking distance to their little town club.  

It seems that Taz is just following the same golf overbuilt market, driven by dreamers as here in many parts of the states, and world.  In this "Solis" project as described, they had 680 residential units planned in a remote area of the world where a seemingly thriving metro area is 35 miles away, has several golf courses in the area, and an isolated population of 220K.  Jeez, there can't be 680 people living near Solis, let alone folks that can afford to build in a Greg Norman designer enclave!  Sure, you have folks like us who travel 1000s of miles to play at a place like Barny dunes and Lost Farm.  Yet, is that even secure, despite being indisputedly world class golf?  

The more I look at this Hobart situation, the more I'd love to spend some time there.  Taz really seems like a great adventure.  The wine industry seems to be on the rise.  Wiki describes a cultural experience on the rise, arts, sports, and entertainment.  Hell, I'd go for these oysters and meal at a place like this!!!  

http://www.barillabay.com.au/restaurant

If they did build a world class course on that 7 mile beach Hobart suburban peninsula, would they just be fighting for the intrepid golf traveler crowd making their way to Barny Dunes, or would the nearness to Hobart be such a better draw that they'd survive on their own?  I just wonder, can the 1% crowd keep all these remote golf destinations going from Hainan to Barny D., to Bandon, to Mullen, to Nova Scotia?  And Doak and C&C have been to every one of them!!!

Honestly, I think you are going to have to expand that 1% crowd by several more percentage points to keep all these balls in the air.  

[Scott Warren]

RJ,

Here in Sydney, Barny Dunes is seriously popular even among those who'd never consider design.

It is unique for Aus, it is affordable and it's near enough to go, but far enough that it feels like a getaway.

Tasmania is a great place, well worth spending lots of time.

[Chris Kane]

I just wonder, can the 1% crowd keep all these remote golf destinations going from Hainan to Barny D., to Bandon, to Mullen, to Nova Scotia?  And Doak and C&C have been to every one of them!!!

Honestly, I think you are going to have to expand that 1% crowd by several more percentage points to keep all these balls in the air.  

RJ, a golf course next to Hobart Airport is not a 'remote golf destination'! - its in a vibrant capital city of around 430,000 heads. As I said above, I think the big advantage this project enjoys over Barnbougle is that it shouldn't have to rely on the '1% crowd'.

[Scott Warren]

Nicely done there Chris. I don't expect anyone outside Aus to get it, but well played!

[RJ_Daley]

Chris and Scott, I believe it, that Hobart is a vibrant city.  At this point all I have is google tourism to go by, but it does look great.  But, perhaps you should contact Wikipedia regarding their serious error by a factor of almost 100% if you are saying population of 430,000 heads, as they have it at 212,000.  Unless part of the whole Tasmanian devil is a two headed-on soul, bloke! 

[Colin Macqueen]

gentlemen,
Apropos what Scott said a few replies ago. The situation is very similar in Brisbane where many groups visit Barnbougle/Lost Farm even though it is 2000km away! More quality courses in Tasmania will just ensure that golfers of all persuasion visit.  It is very well worth it and the food and scenery outstanding.

Cheers Colin

[Dieter Jones]

Yes Chris, two heads are better than one :-)

Well the developers didn't need to wait long for the conservationists to express their veiws. The head of conservation Tasmania basically said that they were not against a golf course per se but wanted the area available to all users, not just golfers. It seems that their "concern" was more about the size of the proposal and how much of the peninsula it takes up. At least at this early stage he had bothered to find out what the area was used for now and what limited info is available about the proposal.

On the other hand, one of the Green party members of Parliament in Tasmania was interviewed on the radio and basically said that she didn't know any of the details about the project but was very conrerned about the proposal. That is the attitude that every project in Tasmania faces with the Greens. How can they be taken seriously when they admit that they are against something they have not even bothered to find out any details about.

I guess balancing the size of the project & the retention of existing uses against the viability of it what can be approved will be the key to getting it over the line.

[Dieter Jones]

RJ - the Solis project was doomed to fail from the start. The first issue was Water availability (it doesn't rain much on the east coast of Tasmania) for the course. The second was that the model used involved selling small blocks of land (600m2 to 900m2) for very high prices (premium blocks were close to $500K and even the internal crappy ones were in the high $200K range. SOme of the land was scenic with lovely views out to Maria Isalnd but as far as golf terrain goes it was just average.

The course they designed was a pretty straight forward cookie cutter residential golfing layout. It would have been a decent course that a golfer would consider playing whilst in the area but not one that they would travel to the area espeically just to play the course.

[Chris Kane]

On the other hand, one of the Green party members of Parliament in Tasmania was interviewed on the radio and basically said that she didn't know any of the details about the project but was very conrerned about the proposal. That is the attitude that every project in Tasmania faces with the Greens. How can they be taken seriously when they admit that they are against something they have not even bothered to find out any details about.

I wouldn't be too worried about what some renegade MP has to say. As you know, the Greens are in Government in alliance with Labor (a roughly similar situation to the current governing coalition in the UK), so they have an effective veto over every government policy. This project will almost certainly have been ticked off by the Tasmanian Cabinet (which includes two Greens MPs) before the announcement - if it didn't have the support of the Greens leadership it wouldn't be happening.

The smart members of the Greens (few and far between!) recognise that this sort of development is crucial to Tasmania. They've spent years telling us that tourism is the future rather than cutting down old-growth forests, so it would be very disappointing for them to kill a relatively environmentally-friendly use of the land which will create jobs.

[RJ_Daley]

I guess we should put Solis plan down in the "what were they thinking" file. 

With regards to this 7 mile beach project, and the clamor for public access to the area, they might want to take a look at the Chambers Bay in Tacoma Wash, where they have a US open scheduled.  They had to compromise and place wide pedestrian walking paths among the dunes.  From the photos and aerial of 7 mile, one would think that a public access to the environment of the beach-estuary, sandy dunes and heathland scrub of that area ought to be relatively easy to design a golf course around. 

I take your point that placing a 7 mile beach project 5 minutes to the airport is a plus, compared with asking 500K for a lot, probably 750-1MM to build a house, and then be an hour across hill and dale to get to a store or services- entertainment of Hobart. I doubt Orford would be on any list of larger retailers and grocers to build anything significant in the next few decades... 

[Dieter Jones]

Chris, I liked your amusing Tautology "The smart members of the Greens". Yes you would hope that this tourism development sits OK with them especially given that the site is otherwise a sand mine & plantation for Radiata pine (which I believe is considered a noxious weed in most places!!). I was just pointing out how the automatic "NO" response that green poly's tend to leap today without bothering to look at the facts behind the story.

RJ, Orford has a pub, a pizza joint, a cafe / bakery and a IGA supermarket. That's about it. The real estate can be quite pricey there especailly on the beach front. It is caught between it's old shack heritage and upmarket weekender for the wealthy of Hobart.

The site at 7 mile is very big. Most of the peninsula is 1Km to 1.5Km wide and even the narrowest squeeze point is 500m wide. It is about 7km long too so I think that as long as they leave those corridors for access it should be OK. Besides there are 2 beaches that make very good access paths to the dunes at the end.

[George Pazin]

Population stats are often misleading. For example, the Burgh has an official population of maybe 200,000. However, that's just for the city proper - the surrounding metropolitan area is more like 1.5 million.

Congrats to my Aussie and Tasmanian friends, can't wait to share your joy someday.

I'm not surprised the writer took liberties with Mike Clayton's statement. My limited contact with the press has resulted in some things I know I would never say somehow being immortalized in print.

[Warwick Loton]

The site at 7 mile is very big. Most of the peninsula is 1Km to 1.5Km wide and even the narrowest squeeze point is 500m wide. It is about 7km long too so I think that as long as they leave those corridors for access it should be OK. Besides there are 2 beaches that make very good access paths to the dunes at the end.

Dieter do you know exactly what land is involved?
If they had a 7km long stretch, that would be the entire peninsula (ie beyond Pittwater Rd) - which would be thousands of acres. The newspaper report indicated an area much smaller than this.

[Mike_Clayton]

Warwick,

It is about 700 acres - so lots of room for two is they needed it.

[Mark Chaplin]

As far as the Australian travelling player is concerned am I right in thinking Barnbougle and a Hobart classic couldn't work together as venues?From memory it's a days drive between the two, so they would be in direct competition rather than a two centre long weekend.

[Chris Kane]

As far as the Australian travelling player is concerned am I right in thinking Barnbougle and a Hobart classic couldn't work together as venues?From memory it's a days drive between the two, so they would be in direct competition rather than a two centre long weekend.

Its only 3 - 3.5 hours Mark, a very easy drive.

[Sean Walsh]

Clarence City Council sat on the 24th of February and appears voted against the 7MB planning proposal.  It appears the golf course fits within the recreational use status of the land but rezoning the land to allow the other parts of the proposal was objected to and voted against by the council.

http://www.themercury.com.au/lifestyle/golfer-mat-goggins-plans-for-golf-course-and-resort-at-seven-mile-beach-hit-the-rough/story-fnj64ocs-1226837629146

http://www.themercury.com.au/news/tasmania/new-development-blow-as-second-tasmanian-golf-resort-hits-rough/story-fnj4f7k1-1226839044410

Comment from James Walker - Clarence Alderman on Mercury Article

"May the Planning Commission arrive at different outcome than Council did on Monday. I was genuinely surprised that only myself the Mayor & Deputy Mayor supported it. This proposal would be a tourist drawcard on what is largely an underutilised & degraded area with a sand mine and introduced pine forest. It has a spectacular coastline & access would be greatly improved especially for those with physical constraints. The coast would be protected by a 50 metre minimum buffer. The officers examined issues raised in representations & recommended Council endorse the proposal. I shudder to think how many pot holes we could fix with the ratepayers money that will now be spent arguing against the proposal at the Planning Commission."

Interesting fact is that one member of the council is pre-selected as a PUP candidate for the coming election. I would have thought the PUP platform would have been business friendly but it appears that is only towards miners.   Founder of that party being the one and only Clive Palmer, he of the dinosaur infested Coolum Resort.  Apparently crap golf up in Queensland is very desirable, possibly great golf in Southern Tasmania is not.

It appears The project now has to wait on a decision by the planning commission later in the year. 

[Colin Macqueen]

Sean,

"Founder of that party being the one and only Clive Palmer, he of the dinosaur infested Coolum Resort.  Apparently crap golf up in Queensland is very desirable, possibly great golf in Southern Tasmania is not."

".......crap golf up in Queensland..." is NOT at all desirable and there are plenty of very fine albeit often "resort" courses for public consumption. There has been very little golf played at Coolum since he descended on the complex.

Rumour has it that the whole shebang is on the verge of being closed.... goodness knows what dear old Clive thought he was doing!

Cheers Colin

[Sean Walsh]

Colin,

I meant from the perspective of Mr Peers.  I can't find the reference but I have seen an article of Peers being at Coolum recently for a PUP event and praising the Resort. I am unsure if this was purely rumour or well sourced journalism and as I can no longer recall where I saw it I can't vouch for its accuracy. 

[Dieter Jones]

I can't believe john peers voted against it. If nothing else he is a sports tragic who I would have expected to support it. Too much time with big Clive and his dinosaurs. Is anyone surprised column is struggling under Clive. Gold Coast united anyone!!
 
I don't think the proponents could have seen this coming given how closely they had been working with council. Reading the council report it seemed they had addressed all of the objections successfully and the council report pointed towards a very strong endorsement of the project.

The crazy thing is that building a golf course in the site is permitted under the existing zoning. So if the state government grants them a lease or sells them the land they can build a golf course anyway which is what most of the objectors are worried about.

Do they reduce the amount of housing and re submit to council or do they take a punt that the planning commission will give the OK and overturn the council decision.

Either way let's hope the course(s) get built. It's too good a site to pass up.

[Matthew Mollica]

Thanks Dieter. That confirms some things I've heard and a little I've read.

Can you tell me what the latest is re: Arm End, and Musselroe Bay?

Thanks,

MM

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