[Ally Mcintosh]

A follow on from Anthony's thread... He concentrated on tee shot versus 2nd shot... I'm asking what you consider to be a blind shot...

Klondyke is as blind as you get no doubt: There is no view, there is no shape in the ridge to show you where to aim.
Dell is less so: You see the right side of the green surface (just) and on a good day can grab sight of the top of the pin.

On a par-4 from the tee, do you consider a hole where you can see the pin but can't see the landing area blind?... Or do you consider a hole where you can see your ball finish but have little clue where the green is located as a blind hole?... Which do you like better? How many of each of these types of holes is too many during a round of 18?

Generalisations of course... But it's perception I'm looking for...

[Sean_A]

Ally

I think blindness has to be taken shot by shot.  Seeing the flag from the tee certainly helps mitigate a blind tee shot.  The actual blindness only really matters if an archie is f*)_*ing with us.  By that I mean he is sticking in nasty hazards which can easily be hit.  If the fairway is generous the blindness doesn't really matter.  I often talk about Pennard for blindness because folks go on about all the blind shots.  Most are due to being out of position (2nds for #s3, 4, 6, 7, .  A few from the tee don't really matter as we have clear aiming points and can see the flag (#s 8, 9, 14 & 17).  There are actually only a few holes I would say are well and properly blind (#s 8, 12 & 17).  On eight the ball can end up either side of the fairway and it can be impossible to know which, but one should nearly always find it and the approach is short.  12 is not overly difficult as it is drivable and the 17th is one where I would say the archie is F()_)(ing with us.  So blindness can be made a big deal of, when in truth it rarely is an issue for the player who can think a bit. 

I wouldn't say if I can't see the ball when it finishes that the shot is blind.  The shot requirements can be on view and yet the result blind.  This is one of the great advantages of hollows. 

Ciao

[Niall C]

To me blind is where you have absolutely no inkling whats going on. On the other hand holes where part of the green is obscured but you can tell by the way the green sits in the surrounding landform what the contours are like, aren't really blind.

Two examples that spring to mind, both par 3's, are the 11th at Rennaissance where the front left corner is partially obscured by the front left bunkers but you can tell by the surrounding ground the slope of the green goes from left to right. And generally I would guess the front left portion is where you would want to land the ball when tackling the pin anywhere middle to left. A lovely simple hole (that I made an arse of)

Another more obvious one is the fantastic par 3 around about the turn at Strathlene. Similar in that the left handside is obscured this time by a small hill. You can tell by the way the shoulder of the hill comes down that your ball landing short left will kick forward and right. Another par 3 I made an arse of.

Niall

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