[Anthony Gray]

  What do you like better? The blind tee shot,the blind second or the blind par three.

    Anthony

[Cristian]

The blind second; the other two are unavoidable, this one some times isn't!

[Greg Taylor]

Given that there is an element of luck involved in every respect my answer is "none of them" !

Fun to play, but as a fair test of golf I would say not the right thing... IMHO

[James Boon]

All three, in moderation are generally fine by me, though there are always going to be some circumstances were a blind shot just doesn't work. I would say the most fun is an approach be it on a par 4 or 5, or the tee shot on a par 3. Always exciting getting the the crest of the dune or whatever, to see if you've managed to a, get on the green and b, are you anywhere close? Disappointment usually follows, but nevermind!   

Greg,

All I can say to that is a, whoever said golf was supposed to be fair?  and b, its only blind the first time you play it (which I've often quoted, but only recently realised it was Tom Simpson)

Cheers,

James

[michael damico]

tee and approach shot are welcomed in my book; the blind 3...well, if it's partial, i have no problem, but fully blind: there better be a great reason why a connecting hole had to be placed like that (and work well within the 'whole')

[Niall C]

James

Agreed, OK in moderation. Unfortunately Mr Simpson didn't seem to agree when he came to redesigning Cruden Bay which is maybe why he came up with such a pitiful excuse as it only being blind the first time  .

Niall

[Adrian_Stiff]

BLIND par 3 holes (total, ie at a MP) are pretty much a no no. I cant think anyone would design one today in a good course, perhaps some archies will chirp in that they have. I like some blindness in a course and degrees of partial blindness but like James it has to be in moderation.

[Michael George]

All are fine so long as there is variety amongst the shots throughout the course.

I would take a Dell hole on my course in a heartbeat.  However, I would not want another blind par 3.  I think a well designed course on a good property has at least one uphill (blind or not), one downhill and one level par 3.

In addition, I think the blind tee shot can be one of the more exciting shots in golf.  The tee shot on #3 at Old MacDonald and #11 at Bandon Trails are certainly two of the more exciting shots at Bandon.  Further, as often used by MacKenzie, the heroic tee shot uphill (sometimes blind) and usually involving choosing an angle in which to approach the fairway (over a line of bunkers) should often be used on golf courses. 

[Kalen Braley]

The only blind shots I prefer on the course are the ones that come in small glasses.  (You never know when your buddy is going to slip in a little 151 on you). 

I don't think it matters on which shot, its blind...it only matters, as has been said before, that its used sparingly.  Too many blind shots make for a long day of hunting for lost balls.

P.S.  Does this mean TOC isn't very good based on the alleged number of blind shots it has?

[Bill Satterfield]

The blind second shot.  Tee shots have the biggest chance of getting lost on a golf course due to the length and inaccuracy of long clubs versus short clubs.  I'm not a fan of spending much time looking for a tee ball that may have been less than stellar and no true idea of where to look due to the blind aspect of the tee shot.  I been fortunate to have two holes-in-one and both of them I could see go in.  I think the excitement of seeing it drop while standing on the tee is a visual I'll never forget and was very exciting.  For whatever reason, need to see an an approach shot hole out isn't as important to me as on a par three and I enjoy the anticipation of getting up to the green and finding the result.

[Melvyn Morrow]

The Great Equaliser, it sorts the men out from the boys, it minimises technology leaving it to the golfer to face the challenge head on -  Yes, Blind shots are a must on a course, hell we sometimes need to know our own ability to read the unreadable, that’s the underlining fun of the game.

How many run from these shots, hide stating their dislike, yet are they any more uncertain than a strong gust on a windy day from a good on shore wind. 

Melvyn

[Jim Franklin]

I love them all. Moderation would be good, but I love the mystery involved with a blind shot.

[michael damico]

The Great Equaliser, it sorts the men out from the boys, it minimises technology leaving it to the golfer to face the challenge head on -  Yes, Blind shots are a must on a course, hell we sometimes need to know our own ability to read the unreadable, that’s the underlining fun of the game.

How many run from these shots, hide stating their dislike, yet are they any more uncertain than a strong gust on a windy day from a good on shore wind. 

Melvyn

Melvyn, could you better explain this for me? I may just not be reading it correctly, but how does a blind shot minimize technology?

[Jim Franklin]

The Great Equaliser, it sorts the men out from the boys, it minimises technology leaving it to the golfer to face the challenge head on -  Yes, Blind shots are a must on a course, hell we sometimes need to know our own ability to read the unreadable, that’s the underlining fun of the game.

How many run from these shots, hide stating their dislike, yet are they any more uncertain than a strong gust on a windy day from a good on shore wind. 

Melvyn

Melvyn, could you better explain this for me? I may just not be reading it correctly, but how does a blind shot minimize technology?

You can't use a laser to a pin you cannot see. You need to trust your yardages and not technology.

[Melvyn Morrow]

Thanks Jim, you have covered it, well most of it.

I would not work on yardage but faith in my ability. I believe blind shots helps ones natural tendency to have a go, it teaches the golfer a valuable lesson of how to take real control, which I believe is the actual secret in developing a level of skill in the game.

Melvyn

[Michael George]

Jim:

Had many blind shots after looking at your shoes at Dunes.  Do those count???  LOL

[michael damico]

Thanks Jim, you have covered it, well most of it.

I would not work on yardage but faith in my ability. I believe blind shots helps ones natural tendency to have a go, it teaches the golfer a valuable lesson of how to take real control, which I believe is the actual secret in developing a level of skill in the game.

Melvyn

understood, I read it more on the club and ball technology...not aids

never used a laser yardage finder...only a laser level

[Melvyn Morrow]

I have never used a Sat Nav, GPS or Range Finder nor Distance Markers, they are for the less confident among us who seem to have little faith in their abilities. 

Melvyn

[Tim Martin]

I like the blind tee shot and approach. Not a fan of the blind par three. The 3rd at Yale gives you a blind tee shot and approach.

[Melvyn Morrow]

Michael

There is a degree of ball club technology being affected by blind holes/shots. The simple factor of the unknown negates their potential advantage, so yes I do mean it also minimises club/ball technology.

Melvyn

[Garland Bayley]

Given that there is an element of luck involved in every respect my answer is "none of them" !

Fun to play, but as a fair test of golf I would say not the right thing... IMHO

Golf is not meant to be played on a billiard table. There is always a factor of luck in golf. Holes-in-one are always luck. Since all competitors play the same hole, golf is fair.

Hopefully YHO will become more informed.

Until then, I suggest you play all your golf at the driving range where things are somewhat predictable.

[Sean_A]

  What do you like better? The blind tee shot,the blind second or the blind par three.

    Anthony

Anthony

I don't mind any of the blind options so long as there is space to miss.  Beyond that, the issue is really about quantity.  I just played a course with an incredible number of blind tee shots.  There wasn't any trouble fo these tee shots, but so many were the same that it is "problem" with the design.  I am thinking of Cleeve Cloud, but TOC suffers from this a bit as well - enough to be noted. 

My favourite blind shot is the "out of position" blind shot.  I greatly enjoy the strategy of playing to see the target or being safer and suffering a blind next.

Ciao

[David Harshbarger]

Devereux Emmet's Mechanicville CC originally started with a short blind par 4/ long blind par 3 depending on the tees.  I assume the par 4 tees were used for 1 and the par 3 for 10 given the location of the clubhouse (if the second set of tees even existed to start).  I thought it would make a nice way to "get away" from the clubhouse to climb up and away out into the course.

Today, with a new clubhouse sited elsewhere, this hole plays as 7/16.

Tim, I don't clearly recall but at Yale 3, if you challenge the water right do you get a view of the pin? How about if you play short left to the hill?  Yale 10 is one of the best strategic examples of blindness that I've seen (take that FWIW), with the choice to play short off the tee opening up the long, visible shot to the green, while long off the leaves a short blind uphill approach.  I don't know that "Carries" is a template hole in the traditional sense, but I can't imagine any course that had the supporting topology wouldn't be proud to have that hole.

Melvyn, I absolutely agree that at an essential level the test that is the blind shot, ESP. The blind tee shot, is a fundamental part of the complete golf challenge.

Sean,  I also absolutely agree that blindness as a penalty is a great feature.  As noted about Yale 10, the fact that blindness and distance are traded off as strategic options on well placed shots is also very cool.

Are there good examples of holes where the best angle requires accepting a blind shot, or other strategic trade offs for even well played shots?

[Sean_A]

David

Yes, rather oddly Burnham's approach to 15 is a better angle, but blind, from the short right rough compared to the fairway.  

Jeff

Other than your love of forced marches and your uncanny robot-like precision, I believe you are my kindred spirit of golf.  I tend to agree with you more than anybody about what golf should be.

Ciao

[David Harshbarger]

Sean, is that a trade off you accept willingly?  Is it "fair" to ask the player to accept the rough as the penalty for a look?  It certainly is uncomfortable thinking about it.

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