Grover Cleveland Park Buffalo

[Brad Tufts]

Hey all,

Is this course worth checking out?

I know there is some history there, as part of it may or may not have been the US Open host as CC of Buffalo back in 1912.

Yes, I'm asking about a likely scruffy muni that tops out under 6000 yards...but I digress of course.

Thanks!

[Mike Cirba]

Brad,

One of my favorite things to do in visiting any new city is to check out the oldest Muni in town.   Most times they come with some great historical interest and character.   As far as conditions, I grew up playing ramshackle public courses so that doesn't bother me in the least.

Can't comment on the one in Buffalo but I bet that Dan Hermann and Ronald Montesano can.

[michael damico]

Brad...I lived directly across the street from this when I went to UB for architecture. Played it alot. Not much has changed to the course in forever...severely sloping greens back > front, all of which are push up. Not well maintained, especially on the tree end, but  MORE than playable (I also grew up playing the local muni).

I don't see why you wouldn't stop by for a short visit.

[Dan Herrmann]

It used to be owned by the city, but it's now run by Erie County.   Ronald can confirm, but I think there may be some features there from the 1912 US Open.

From what I remember, the greens are very small, and the course is essentially flat.  I doubt it costs much, and it's probably worth a visit.

But for my money, you can find a better muni at Sheridan Park in Tonawanda (NY 324).  Has held a USGA Publinx, and I spent many, many days there learning how to play golf badly

[Ronald Montesano]

Absolutely worth checking out...you'll see how flatness can be overcome by decent green sites. The course is very different from the one that hosted the 1912 Open.

When will you be in town? Perhaps we can all get together.

Best stories from 1912 Open (Yes, I was there!!)...Only time a Par 6 was in play at an Open and...wait for it...an assistant pro from Rochester was forbidden by his head pro from playing, reason given was "too young." The Asst. pro was allowed to play a practice round at then-CCB before training it back to the shop. As a result, Walter Hagen had to wait a year before making his Open debut with Francis Ouimet at TCC in Brookline.

I did a piece on the two courses (then and now) a few years back for a local history magazine. PM or continue the thread if you want more info.

[Brad Tufts]

Hi Ron,

I'd love to know more...do you have your article available online or for email?

Not sure when I might be in Buffalo next, but I usually make it out at some point every year.

Thanks,

Brad

[Ronald Montesano]

Here's what I have so far...I'll try to scan my copy in tonight.

http://wnyheritagepress.org/magazine/summerfall_03/summerfall2003b.htm#golf

[Ronald Montesano]

Best Part of this opening...shows how little I knew/cared about GCA when I wrote it:

The initial six holes of golf in Buffalo were built in 1894, the subsequent expansion of the course was the result of the combined efforts of Charles Blair Mcdonald (world-renowned competitor and course architect) and club member George Hibbard.

The original course and its expansion are long gone. They are occupied by houses, so CBM's footprint in WNY is no longer.

[Dan Herrmann]

Ron - you sure you weren't trying to cover something up to protect the "myths"of Buffalo golf

[Ronald Montesano]

The original course was built on the land left vacant by the Pan-Am exposition, between Nottingham, Delaware and Elmwood. It lasted a few years. Just up the road, in Delaware Park, the first Park Country Club course was laid out. As you know, DH, both clubs moved out to Williamsville, within a mile of each other, along the Sheridan Drive corridor.

[Dan Herrmann]

Ron - Great info!

[Ronald Montesano]

I'm sending you my article, one page at a time, via email.

[Ronald Montesano]

Here are links to the article I wrote (what seems like) 100 years ago...With the 100-year anniversary of the Open at CCB approaching in 2012, it's a nice time to visit Grover and renew my acquaintance.

http://buff-golf.com/GroverClevelandArticlepage1.jpg

http://buff-golf.com/GroverClevelandArticlepage2.jpg

http://buff-golf.com/GroverClevelandArticlepage3.jpg

http://buff-golf.com/GroverClevelandArticlepage4.jpg

http://buff-golf.com/GroverClevelandArticlepage5.jpg

[Ronald Montesano]

From USGA site:

McDermott's total of 294 was two below par. He is now credited as being the first man to break par for 72 holes. The use of "par" came into official national usage in 1911 when the USGA defined it as "perfect play without flukes and under ordinary weather conditions, always allowing two strokes on each putting green".

First winner below par, only par 6, only course to host both the USGA Public Links and Open championships, venue where Hagen SHOULD have made his debut...not bad at all.

[michael damico]

Ron,

it would be great to get a small GCAtlas get together goin and possibly make a multiple course run sometime next year. I'm sure JNC would be interested, among others. Even call up Mr. Witter, get him away from his desk for a little bit...

[Ronald Montesano]

We might get Greg Vogelsang out there-http://buffalogolfer.com/wordpress/?p=1814

We could play with hickories and everything!