[Kyle Henderson]

#17 is a par 5 (494 meters). Tee shots should favor the left-center of the fairway due to its rightward slope. With a mighty tailwind, one might try to play over the inside edge of the left bunkers and bring the green within range of their second shot.

A wide swath of fairway provides many positional options for those electing to lay back with their second and play an uphill wedge for their third shot to the medium-sized green.  That large tree is ~100 meters from the green’s center.

Note: That’s “The Judge” in the blue shirt. I hope everyone who heads Down Under has a chance to play with him and hear the “Chocolate story.”

[Kyle Henderson]

By dazzling players at their culmination, golf courses can make up for some of their earlier shortcomings, but the Ocean course does not end well.  The 18th, at 445 meters, it is a very lengthy test for a par “4” that narrows considerably between 230-160 meters from the green’s center  -- the visible fairway bunkers effectively pinch this area even more tightly than the terrain dictates.


The bunkers protecting the approach are set (mercifully) well short of the extremely deep green to allow for those playing long, low shots in.  However, despite being softened subsequent to the course’s opening, the final green is still drastically over-shaped.


The Ocean Course enjoys a superb setting, but must be considered a great disappointment given its high potential. Play The Moonah Course instead (as we did earlier in the day), or head down the road to St. Andrews Beach.

*Note: The Old Course was closed for play during my visit. Some say it’s worth a play but quite flawed (overdone greens, forced water hazards, etc.). Others tell me it may be the best course in Australia. I’m guessing it’s somewhere in between those extremes.

[Matthew Mollica]

Kyle - the 18th green is one of the better greens on the course. Which is saying something.

I feel for you that you travelled half way aroud the world, had limited time here, and still played Ocean.
I hope the experience was educational, and that your playing partners lightened the experiece.

Old is a very good course I hope you play some day. Must be one of RTJ Jnr's best.
The greens are wild, the bunkering excellent, great terrain, and thrilling shotmaking.
On sunny days, with little wind, it also provides an experience that is tough to match.

MM

[Kyle Henderson]

MM,

My analysis of the 18th green may have been colored by the day's pin location, but I watched group after group take 3-4 putts each during my lunch break.

It was a pity to miss The Old. How much wind is accommodated by its design? 10mph?

[Matthew Mollica]

Winds of probably double that are considered in it's design. Maybe more.
Approaches are often hit from "sheltered" positions on Old, and the fairways are wider than people think.

It really is a very good course. Way ahead of it's time.
Read my description again in the second to last post above.
That description could be applied to most Doak courses.
Yet National Old is derided by some.

Also - for your pleasure, I've copied a post below from an Australian forum.
Needless to say, the poster and I don't completely agree.

As I've explained before, if you pick The Ocean to pieces you simply miss the point. My two favorite courses on the planet are St Andrews and Machrihanish. Both old and quirky and easy to disparage. Blind tee shots, blind approaches, wild bunkering everywhere, double greens, rough you can lose your Kelpie in and you know what? None of that matters. When you finish playing you want to go again.

The Ocean's like that. I love it. Love isn't too strong a word. Playing it fills me with joi de vive.
I hit off and I know three things: I'll need every club in my bag. I need to hit the middle of the bat all day if I'm going to break 80. I'm going to need some luck.

Please, the next time you play it, do me a favour. Forget the internal out of bounds, the false fronts, the mean bunkering, the incongrous dog-legs and everything else that doesn't please your architectural pallette and just try and have some fun with it. Don't try and beat it up 'cause you won't. It's tougher than you. Just play quietly and fall in love.

I'll dig up my response for you soon.

MM

P.S. - Was your host correct with his assessment over lunch?

[Kyle Henderson]

P.S. - Was your host correct with his assessment over lunch?

Pretty much. The other two players started the round by telling me the course wasn't as bad as our host would indicate, but after putting out on the 13th, both declared it (paraphrasing) a "stupid golf course."

I say its a dumb blonde with a few flashes of reasonable intelligence.

[Matthew Mollica]

Here's the promised reply.

I've played Ocean a fair bit through the last few years. In my opinion, it's a somewhat unimaginative routing, with cookie-cutter appearing bunkering placed illogically. An overly penal course, heavily dependant upon length to defend par. Contrived appearance, on a natural site, almost totally devoid of any really exciting shot making. And they had to re-do 9 greens within the first 5 years of the course opening.

No risk-reward - just miss it and get shafted. More weak holes on Ocean than Old and Moonah combined.

Internal OOB on 1 - poor effort, especially on such a large site, and on the "safe miss" side.

2 is bland.

3 is 50 metres too long. Would be great with a lofted club played from 125m.

4 is pathetic in its use of the quarry. Wrong lines, good green though. Mind you -
the black tee was positioned in the wrong spot for the 1st 6 years of the course's life.
Could be an exciting driveable par 4 with a green immediately beyond the quarry.

5 is ho-hum, 6 is a terrible hole, and 7 may be the worst par 5 on the entire Peninsula.

8 is average. Great land behind it left totally ignored (as JJ points out).

9 is too long, but with 30m would be a great tempting uphill short 4.

10's green is woeful.
The dune behind totally ignored and unused, instead opting for ANOTHER TWP push-up.

11 is a poor Redan attempt.

12s not bad. 13 demonstrates they have no idea of what a tempting par 4 should embody.

14 is the formulaic 3, play from one rise to another, across a valley - like most other TWP courses you can think of.

15 - bunkering in the wrong spot off the tee. Fill it in & replace with 1 small pot on the L fairway egde

16, extensive green re-working and tee re-alignment has made it better.

17's nice and 18's a joke at 445m uphill into the prevailing wind, with a canted landing zone feeding to traps, or leaving 215plus metres into the wind, onto an unsighted green, with an uphill lie.

The course may be the biggest waste of a quality site in this nation's history. I'm not sure there's a solitary hole on Ocean which would get more than a 7 out of 10 from me.

It does have it's minor advantages though.
It gets golfers off the courses I'd prefer to play.
It'd serve as a wonderful car park when Moonah hosts a pro tournament.
It protects the rest of the complex from rising sea levels in the event of global warming
and it's a very generously sized turf nursery.

[Kyle Henderson]

MM,

I concur nearly entirely, though I don't think # 7 is as bad as you say (as we discussed earlier).

Do you prefer The Moonah or The Old?

[Justin Ryan]

MM,

I concur nearly entirely, though I don't think # 7 is as bad as you say (as we discussed earlier).

Do you prefer The Moonah or The Old?

Kyle, I'm not sure I wanted to relive the Ocean course.

One thing it does do is make the Moonah look much better than it is by proximity. I've got the Old in front by a mile.  The sad thing is a plan to build 45 new holes was scuppered around 2002. This would have seen the terrible mistake they made in making the Moonah and Ocean so long and difficult offset by building a couple of shorter and more playable (and most likely more interesting) courses.

[Matthew Mollica]

Kyle, I have Old slightly ahead. 10 games at The Nash would have me on Old 6 times, and Moonah 4.

I've always wanted to do a review of Old. Maybe I'll do one for GCA later in the year.
It's like Portsea, but on a bigger scale, with curvier greens, bigger bunkers, and more drama.
There isn't a really weak hole out there. It really is under-rated.

MM

[Bruce Hardie]

Kyle, I have Old slightly ahead. 10 games at The Nash would have me on Old 6 times, and Moonah 4.

I've always wanted to do a review of Old. Maybe I'll do one for GCA later in the year.
It's like Portsea, but on a bigger scale, with curvier greens, bigger bunkers, and more drama.
There isn't a really weak hole out there. It really is under-rated.

MM

Excuse me if I raise a skeptical eyebrow.

[Mark_F]

It's like Portsea, but on a bigger scale, with curvier greens, bigger bunkers, and more drama.
There isn't a really weak hole out there. It really is under-rated.

Shame on you, MM.  Nat Old isn't anything like Portsea, aside from the fact that you play golf on them.
There are a shitload of weak holes on Nat Old, and it is really very overrated.

[Kyle Henderson]

MM,

Thank you for your honest appraisal. There is no shame in having convictions.

I look forward to your review of The Old and the counterpoints of Bruce and Mark. Maybe someday I'll have the chance to play it with you.

Appreciatively,
Kyle

[Bruce Hardie]

I'm only skeptical of the "no weak holes" claim.  (and you know what I'm going to say)

I'm a big fan of the Old. Perhaps we can refresh our memories and get some updated photos before you do your review Matty?

[Matthew Mollica]

Some images of National (Old), by Robert Trent Jones Jnr, Cape Schanck, opened 1987.

Old is a neighbour of Ocean and Moonah courses at The National Golf Club.

These images taken in 2011.

Tee shot on the dogleg uphill 3rd


Approach on 3


Uphill approach on 5


7 tee shot


7 green from the air


13 tee shot

[Matthew Mollica]

"The exhilarating outlooks from virtually every corner of this course are a powerful reminder of golf’s ability to stimulate the senses and although now referred to as the ‘Old’ course, ‘Original’ would have been an equally appropriate caption, so unique is the experience. While the visionaries did a wonderful job building a thriving club so far from a major city, it remains Trent Jones who put The National on the map with a dramatic golf course, unlike any other in the world." - Darius Oliver

[Kevin Pallier]

I've always wanted to do a review of Old. Maybe I'll do one for GCA later in the year.

Here's to hoping you do MM

[Kyle Henderson]

MM,

There were just a few hiccups in my otherwise stupendous trip to your country. Visiting The National on a day when The Old was closed is probably the most egregious.

[Mark_F]

"The exhilarating outlooks from virtually every corner of this course are a powerful reminder of golf’s ability to stimulate the senses and although now referred to as the ‘Old’ course, ‘Original’ would have been an equally appropriate caption, so unique is the experience. While the visionaries did a wonderful job building a thriving club so far from a major city, it remains Trent Jones who put The National on the map with a dramatic golf course, unlike any other in the world." - Darius Oliver

What's the point of that quote, MM?  It doesn't say anything about the quality of the course, merely that it is dramatic and unique.  Fine virtues, but quite empty by themselves.

I look forward to your review.

[Shane Gurnett]

It takes a nice picture Mark. 

[Mark_F]

It takes a nice picture Mark. 

Maybe that is why their share prices have fallen so much, Shane.

Moonah and Ocean don't. 

[Justin Ryan]

It's like Portsea, but on a bigger scale, with curvier greens, bigger bunkers, and more drama.
There isn't a really weak hole out there. It really is under-rated.

It's great fun as well. Don't let these jokers get you down.

Its not perfect though. The second shot to the 3rd is terrible. 4 and 13 aren't too flash either.

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