Hidden Creek revisited

[Mike_Cirba]

Ran,

I think BillV and others would agree that the pictures on the website are limited in what they show..

The dunes work in several ways.  Yes, many of them are parallel, but not unnaturally so.  For one thing, their slopes are tied into the fairway contouring, which is subtly accomplished.  What's more, on holes like 5, 6, 10, 11, 14, 16, and even the somewhat controversial 18th (unlike most controversial 18th, it's controversial because it's underdone, not overdone), the dunes come into play strategically and will even create completely blind approaches if one is on the wrong side of the fairway.  

As far as the titties, yes, a small handful of them look artificial, including the ones behind the par three 16th green.  Being a lover of all things natural, I think that a few of them would look better without the silicone.  

[GeoffreyC]

Tom Paul-  While we were walking I was talking with Archie about building Twisted Dunes and he made the exact comparison you did with Shadow Creek!  TW is very much a manufactured course.  The final product by design was not the same polished look of SC but it is very impressive indeed.

I too was more impressed then I expected based on the photos in the website and I certainly hope that Archie will update the site with more flattering photos.

I have little to add about the architectural merits from what others have commented on except to say that while manufactured to create dunes and mounds, the course plays convex rather than concave to use Mike Cirba's (registered trademark) helpful nomenclature.  There is no "containment" on the course yet its width allows recovery from less then ideal angles.

I need to see more NJ public courses but its the best one I've seen so far.  Running Deer could have been in the same league but it missed the boat.  TW combined just the right amount of strategy and adventure.

[BillV]

TomPaul, I read your comments with interest also!

There is a naturalness of the site with its artificiality which is quite high.  Near the 13 and 14th holes the containment is not as great, coupled with another water feature that is the most unnatural place on the property but has probably the greatest individual hole 14.  One thing I loved was the isolation and protection of the artificially created dunes in the transition zone from holes 12 to 13 and 14 to 15!  Protecting manufactured dunesland!  I loved it! (Sorry for the !!!!!!'s)  

The degree of the tops of some of the dunes are all I mean is out of whack, quite a small thing.  The isolation of hte property does not seem unnatural once inside, the water is the most unnatural thing there.  The dunesland in sandy New Jersey does not at all seem out of whack to me, quite honestly.  Archie took what they did at Scotland Run and sprinted at full speed from that as a staring point, but sorry TEP   there's hardly a damn tree on the whole place and it really really works!  Brrrrrrrzzzzzzzzzzzzzz the sound of McCullogh in the morning!

[Scott_Burroughs]

As happens in other threads, the original idea of the thread has changed.  

But it's true that the pics of TD on the web site don't do it justice, as a majority of pics are of holes #3, 13, and 14.

A note about #3.  When my partner and I arrived at the back teeing area, we thought we were on the wrong hole.  The card said something like 230, but it appeared much longer, like a dogleg right short par 4 of about 300 yards.  We still weren't convinced when we teed off, but were when our tee shots were pin high (but not on the green).  There's deception for you.

I also think #9 should be a par 4.  At 496 from blue tees with a down hill second shot, it's quite short.  I hit driver/5-iron over the green.  Great green complex, though.  (Like #15 at TD) they are very similar to #10 at Lehigh or #3 at Beechtree.

[BillV]

Great observations Scott.  #9 struck me as one of the holes thatI liked least and its half-par designation is probably part of it.  It is neither fish nor fowl in a way.  The use of the water is so out of place but necessary fro irrigation.  We discussed additional tees on our walk around and I and at least one other (Sorry the memory fades!) preferred a longer tee as far to the left while Archie and another preferred one right.  Any thoughts?

[Anthony_Nysse]

If any of you want to see pics of Hidden Creek, the website is:
hiddencreekgolf.com

[Matt_Ward]

BillV / Scott:

Having the tee extended on the left side of #9 is not a bad idea. When I played the hole this past June from the tips the water element is more of a side issue that could be brought more into play from that angle.

When Hidden Creek comes on line there will be plenty of people hustling to the greater AC area to see what is happening. I just hope HC is hope to the challenge that TD provides. We shall see ...

[Scott_Burroughs]

Anthony,
    That link doesn't lead to any web site.  (And hiddencreekgolfclub.com leads to a different club, just as hiddencreekcc.com lead to the private club in Reston, Virginia.

[SPDB]

Anthony -
That web address is incorrect. Fooling around, I discovered that the correct one is:

www.hiddencreekclub.com

pretty impressive