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Bill Brightly

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2011, 06:38:04 AM »
Sven beat me to it, it is an Amen Hole, or Amen par three.
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Mark Chaplin

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2011, 07:03:32 AM »
Mark - 4RCP would be an odd "Creek"!

Off on my US travels next week, two of the lads leave today and play member/guest at TCC tomorrow then a few games before meeting in Philly on Monday prior to our stay at PV. Also collecting the unique custom "Swampy" Scratch irons in RCP colours as well, their first four rounds will be at PV....happy days   :P
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Mark Pearce

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #27 on: September 01, 2011, 08:24:58 AM »
Swampy (if I may),

There are plenty of Road Holes without a road!

Enjoy the new irons.  As to the venue, you are indeed a lucky bastard.
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In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

J Cabarcos

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #28 on: September 01, 2011, 09:11:33 AM »
17th at Kiawah's Ocean Course.  I believe the four requirements are met there.  For sure an "Amen Hole."
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Mark Chaplin

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #29 on: September 01, 2011, 10:04:56 AM »
I stand corrected; David Dobby informs me Sandy Parlour was changed for the 1938 Open by J S F Morrison.

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Bill_McBride

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #30 on: September 01, 2011, 12:25:35 PM »
Quote from: Mark Chaplin on September 01, 2011, 10:04:56 AM
I stand corrected; David Dobby informs me Sandy Parlour was changed for the 1938 Open by J S F Morrison.



Meaning the current 4th at Deal could not have been an antecedent or inspiration for Augusta #12.

Bryan Izatt above says the green doesn't appear from the aerial to have an oblique tee shot to the current green at Deal, but it sure feels like it when you play the hole from the left tee.   I haven't played from the seaward tee; that must be almost straight on to a very shallow, crowned green.   Does it play harder or easier from that side?  A question for the Deal cognoscenti.....paging Tuco Ramirez.
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Mark Chaplin

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #31 on: September 01, 2011, 12:37:53 PM »
Bryan - the green is at a 45 degree angle to the tee. If the pin is at the front or back it is in a direct line relatively shallow, probably 15 paces.

From the winter tee the green sits pretty much at a 90 degree angle making it very shallow with trouble short and long. It is probably easier as it's shorter, around 130 yards and being a winter position the ball will stop unless thin or really over clubbed.
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Bryan Izatt

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #32 on: September 01, 2011, 01:34:33 PM »
I stand corrected about Deal. I was looking at the seaward tee.  It looks more straight on from there.

Re the name, I'm leaning toward a Bigot Oblique.  Bigot, of course, pronounced Bee-go.
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John Kavanaugh

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #33 on: September 01, 2011, 01:59:28 PM »
Brian,

If the green were not oblique it would not be a bigot.  You see the turning of the green is a maneuver used by a frigate in battle to prevent cannon fire from hitting directly onto its side.  What fascinates me more than even the tribute to the French tactician is the use of bigot from the palindrome To Gib in the second World War as code for being clear.

As referenced earlier:  According to the book "A short course in the secret war", by Christopher Felix, BIGOT was actually To Gib backwards. Gibraltar was a jumping off place for the Royal Navy, and lots of secret men and material were ordered To Gibraltar, or To Gib. Bigot to conceal and confuse. Anyone ordered To Gib had already been cleared, so Bigoted became a synonym for cleared.

and,  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigot_de_Morogues
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Anthony Gray

Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #34 on: September 01, 2011, 02:49:59 PM »
Quote from: John Kavanaugh on September 01, 2011, 01:59:28 PM
Brian,

If the green were not oblique it would not be a bigot.  You see the turning of the green is a maneuver used by a frigate in battle to prevent cannon fire from hitting directly onto its side.  What fascinates me more than even the tribute to the French tactician is the use of bigot from the palindrome To Gib in the second World War as code for being clear.

As referenced earlier:  According to the book "A short course in the secret war", by Christopher Felix, BIGOT was actually To Gib backwards. Gibraltar was a jumping off place for the Royal Navy, and lots of secret men and material were ordered To Gibraltar, or To Gib. Bigot to conceal and confuse. Anyone ordered To Gib had already been cleared, so Bigoted became a synonym for cleared.

and,  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigot_de_Morogues

  To Gib has a totally different meaning for me.

  Anthony

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George Pazin

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #35 on: September 01, 2011, 03:58:47 PM »
I'd just call them Twelves or Twelfths. As in:

Joe Sixpack: Hey, whatdya think of the 12th at Muirfield? Jack really scored with that one, eh?

GCA poster (stroking beard): Naaaaah, that's just a Twelfth...

Some other ideas, mostly too wordy:

Freddie's Delight
Freddie's Happy Accident
Rae's Revenge
Rae's Little Devil
Swirleybird
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Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Bryan Izatt

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Re: Let's Name This Template
« Reply #36 on: September 02, 2011, 04:18:18 AM »

John,

I read the Wiki reference.  Seems Bigot de Morogues wrote books on naval strategies.  Turning away at an angle would likely be one of them.  I thought adding "Oblique" would help establish which one. 

George,

Swirleybird has a nice ring to it, but I'm not sure it conveys the essence of the hole.  ;)
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