Firestone

[Joe Andriole]

While few if any on this site would applaud Firestone as great golf architecture I find it to be a good pro venue.  The straight tree-lined fairways and moderate rough create a lot of interesting recovery shots.  While watching the tourney there seems to be far more than the usual demand for significantly shaped shots, often from the rough. Not exactly strategy but good theatre.  Any thoughts??

[Michael George]

I have played Firestone many times.  It is a great test of golf.  It will expose any weakness that you have in your game, while reward you for good shots.  For competitive golf, it is a great course.  Also, there are many holes that individually are great holes.  #3, #8, #13, #16 and #18 are all great golf holes that are both fun and challenging.  Always perfectly maintained. 

However, I understand why it doesn't get any love on this site.  First, it is pure RT Jones.  Straight forward, tough par, easy bogey golf.  Very little strategic decision making (just looking at the routing can tell you that).  Most shots you know what you need to do and the only issue is whether you can hit the shot.  I think that is why it is a good pro venue, as the strategic golf that many on this site love (including me) is often not as challenging for the pro tour and is certainly difficult to capture on television.

I enjoy every round that I play on Firestone and believe that it is worth the effort to play if you are in the Akron area.  I may enjoy playing Country Club (PP) and Kirtland more,  but neither is a better test of my game.  As a comparison, it is very similar to Oakland Hills CC.  The greens at Oakland Hills CC would be the only noteworthy difference (as they are original Ross designs and more undulating).  While this style of design may not be the favorite of me and many others on this site, its still is a fine golf course.

[Gary Slatter]

I've played Firestone many times (45 holes in one day, twice).  When it is set up for the best pros in the world, there isn't as much strategy off the tee, however when it's under normal operation with wider fairways there arelots of options.

One of my best golfing experiences in the USA - staying in the locker room at Firestone!  Great rooms, pizza service at 2:00 am, perfect!  We worked a corporate event on Labour Day Monday for several years, and got to play all three courses on the Sun/Mon/Tue.  While the south was the favourite, the other two were great!  And playing 45 holes per day with 3 great pro friends was as good as it gets.  One of America's secrets.

[Michael George]

Gary:

You are right about the locker room.  The hotel rooms up there are really cool and so is the 55th hole balcony overlooking the 9th hole green.  It is the best locker room that I have ever been in, that is for sure.  The villas along 16 are great too.

 

[Tim Gavrich]

I'm curious as to the quality of the other two courses at Firestone.  From both Google Maps and pictures on the club's website, both courses seem massively more visually interesting.  The Fazio one especially, actually.

[Terry Lavin]

Firestone is great.

But it ain't Askernish.

[Michael George]

You are correct Terry.

While a great test, the course and club is about as far as it gets from the links of Ireland/Scotland.  It is very corporate with a ton of outings.  Owned by ClubCorp so more profit driven.

[Jaeger Kovich]

Every time they show views from the blimp on tv I puke from parallel hole syndrome 

[mike_beene]

were there ever two parallel holes where the driving range is located?This would have made every hole a north-south and 5 and 6 seem out of place and on an offshoot piece of land which is now part of one of the other courses.

[Michael George]

Agree fully on the routing and you can certainly feel it when you are playing the course.     

[Terry Lavin]

You are correct Terry.

While a great test, the course and club is about as far as it gets from the links of Ireland/Scotland.  It is very corporate with a ton of outings.  Owned by ClubCorp so more profit driven.

My tongue was firmly in cheek. Firestone is an iconic American muscle course even if it has been softened (for the pros) by technology.

I'm watching the early coverage. Tiger has 5000 people following him. Phil has about 100 and Lucas Glover?  Maybe eight lost souls.

[Tim_Weiman]

Tim Gavrich,

Many years ago I was taken to Firestone by a member who understood my passion for golf coure architecture. He decided we would first play the North course because he thought I would enjoy it a lot more.

He was right.

We later played the South, but before doing so we did a tour of the famous 16th. This member insisted it wasn't that good of a hole and wanted to see if I agreed.

I did.

What always seemed cool for the pros on TV, seemed kind of boring. It really wasn't an interesting risk reward par 5....just three shots you hoped you didn't mess up.

I'm not really an RTJ basher - one of his courses (the Cashen) is my favorite place in the world - but Firestone South is not worth a special trip to play and if you are local, the North seems like more fun, except for one brutal par 3....8 or 17, I can't remember.

[Matthew Rose]

I think it should be mentioned that RTJ did not rout the course and was not the original designer. That guy's name was Bert Way. RTJ hated the routing but was essentially stuck with it.

I'm not RTJ's biggest fan by any stretch of the imagination, but he should not be getting criticized for the back and forth routing when it was not his to begin with.

[BCrosby]

I think it should be mentioned that RTJ did not rout the course and was not the original designer. That guy's name was Bert Way. RTJ hated the routing but was essentially stuck with it.

I'm not RTJ's biggest fan by any stretch of the imagination, but he should not be getting criticized for the back and forth routing when it was not his to begin with.

Glad to hear Firestone's routing was not RTJ's, because the only thing imaginative about it is how unimaginative it is.   

What really shocked me was that everyone was hitting PW approaches into 475 yard par 4's. Were there any par 4's where players were hitting mid-iron's?

All of which bears out the thesis that at 7500 yards these courses are short.  If you really want courses to play long - as a 7000 yard course played in 1970 - they need to be 8000 plus yards. The math is easy.  They are hitting it about 15% farther today. Increase 7000 by 15% and you get something well north of 8000 yards. If you think it worth testing players' ability to hit greens with mid-irons, that's how long courses need to be today.

Which is insane.

Bob