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Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
New (faux?) Links in Germany
« on: July 21, 2011, 05:46:03 PM »
Winston Links near Schwerin:



An opening ceremony in style: a bagpiping quartet of Scots and the requisite weather:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9pO_00QyE4&hd=1

Ulrich
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Joel_Stewart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2011, 06:56:32 PM »
Not sure I like the cone shaped mounding.  I looked at the web site and it's fairly prevalant.

Nicklaus did this 25 years ago at Grand Cypress in Florida and it's been modified over the years.
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Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2011, 07:12:34 PM »
Ulrich:

Whose design is THAT?

I thought there were restrictions on grading in Germany, but it doesn't appear the case for this project.
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Pete_Pittock

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2011, 07:29:14 PM »
David Krause did the links course, plus a nine holer.
Ing Rengstorf did the open course.
see www.winstongolf.com
« Last Edit: July 21, 2011, 07:32:44 PM by Pete_Pittock »
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Adam Clayman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2011, 09:40:11 PM »
Oh my!

Is it an old mining site?

Chocolate factory?

River dredge?  What is the origin of the mounds?
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Mark Chaplin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2011, 02:28:16 AM »
Ulrich - as faux as they come! I bet even the pipers were faux.
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Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2011, 03:32:18 AM »
I haven't played this, but reports are in that it is very difficult due to the monstrous undulations in the fairways (10 - 15 feet) and the "dunes" are about 30 feet. Lots of blind shots, apparently, and the highest greenfee in Germany (120 Euros). It just won "best new course" in Germany.

Greens are slow, which is to be expected for a new course of this type. Was the same thing at my home course, which is a "light-version" of this design style and the greens are coming along nicely in the third or fourth season. Obviously, the mounds overgrow with time, which improves the scenery somewhat. But it's never going to look natural.

Ulrich
« Last Edit: July 22, 2011, 03:39:25 AM by Ulrich Mayring »
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Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2011, 03:57:04 AM »
David Krause organised a round prior to the last EIGCA meeting in May... Unfortunately I could not get there in time and I never received any feedback...

It looks bold. He has been bold before in a couple of his designs...

Although it may fly in the face, I would offer that bold (even if misguided) is usually more interesting than a lot of copy and paste design we see... The Castle course comes to mind...
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Joel_Stewart

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2011, 10:39:29 AM »
I would rather play Budersand 9 to 1 over this course without seeing it.

Does anyone know how Budersand is doing financially?

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,39465.0.html

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John Foley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2011, 10:40:36 AM »
I like what I see - yeah it's busy - looks tough - checeked out the course guide on the web site and it looks like some very interesting options.

Check out the picture - what's not to like

sandy soil - check
rumpled ground - check
hairy bunkers - check
walking golfer - checkmate!!

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Patrick Kiser

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2011, 10:48:41 AM »
Immediate feelings that come to mind:

Looks like a kitty litter box... 
Overdone... 
Hand of man is too evident, even in the effort of trying to appear "natural"...
Trying too hard...
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“One natural hazard, however, which is more
or less of a nuisance, is water. Water hazards
absolutely prohibit the recovery shot, perhaps
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course architect

Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2011, 12:45:09 PM »
Looks like a before picture in a Proactiv infomercial...
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Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Anthony Gray

Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2011, 04:20:02 PM »
Quote from: Ally Mcintosh on July 22, 2011, 03:57:04 AM
David Krause organised a round prior to the last EIGCA meeting in May... Unfortunately I could not get there in time and I never received any feedback...

It looks bold. He has been bold before in a couple of his designs...

Although it may fly in the face, I would offer that bold (even if misguided) is usually more interesting than a lot of copy and paste design we see... The Castle course comes to mind...

  Good point Ally.Bold trumps boreing.

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Jud_T

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2011, 04:21:24 PM »
Of course boring trumps boreing.
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Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Emil Weber

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2011, 04:45:44 PM »
Joel,

I don't have any facts, but I am pretty sure Budersand is doing well. The investors are solid aswell as I've heard.

Concerning Winstonlinks, it does look overdone and contrived, but I'm pretty sure it would be more fun to play than 90% of all other German courses!
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Scott Weersing

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #15 on: July 22, 2011, 07:50:03 PM »

I think we may have someone trying to copy Mike Strantz and doing it poorly. Royal New Kent has some over the top mounds too. But we can't really judge this course without playing it first. Photos can make a good course look great and photos can make a great course look just good.

It could be the best links course in Germany but that's not saying much.

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Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2011, 04:47:42 AM »
That's saying it's a better links course than Budersand, which would be no small feat. For one, Winston Links is about 35 miles from the sea, whereas Budersand is right in the dunes of Sylt.

Ulrich
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Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2011, 05:07:26 AM »
Ulrich

While perhaps OTT, it does look interesting.  Do you have more pix?

Do you have pix of your home course? If it is Winston light it sounds very interesting.  Perhaps I am one of the few people left that is intrigued by alpinization!

Ciao
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Emil Weber

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2011, 05:20:46 AM »
Sean,

in your thread a few years back Ulrich posted some pics of his home course: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,40059.0.html
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Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #19 on: July 23, 2011, 07:09:57 AM »
Quote from: Scott Weersing on July 22, 2011, 07:50:03 PM

I think we may have someone trying to copy Mike Strantz and doing it poorly. Royal New Kent has some over the top mounds too. But we can't really judge this course without playing it first. Photos can make a good course look great and photos can make a great course look just good.

It could be the best links course in Germany but that's not saying much.



Scott

In what way is it copying Mike Stranz ?

Niall
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Mike Nuzzo

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #20 on: July 23, 2011, 06:02:19 PM »
John
Yes that picture doesn't look as bad as the first.
Is it meant to be a ball eating golf course?
Who is the target player?
How much did it cost to build?
How is wasting that much diesel environmentally sound?
Cheers
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Ulrich Mayring

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #21 on: July 23, 2011, 06:26:43 PM »
To shed some light on the owner's thinking, he is one of the largest Caterpillar dealers in Europe :)

Cost - no issue, they'll write it off as marketing expenses.

Target player: in their own words they want to attract accomplished golfers, regional and international.

Ulrich
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Scott Weersing

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: New (faux?) Links in Germany
« Reply #22 on: July 24, 2011, 11:17:24 AM »
Quote from: Niall Carlton on July 23, 2011, 07:09:57 AM
Quote from: Scott Weersing on July 22, 2011, 07:50:03 PM

I think we may have someone trying to copy Mike Strantz and doing it poorly. Royal New Kent has some over the top mounds too. But we can't really judge this course without playing it first. Photos can make a good course look great and photos can make a great course look just good.

It could be the best links course in Germany but that's not saying much.



The picture reminds me of No. 1 and no. 8 at Royal New Kent in Virginia. Big mounds on both of these holes that have been softened over the years with bushes and grasses. I can remember when Royal New Kent opened in 1996 and how awestruck people were.
Scott

In what way is it copying Mike Stranz ?

Niall
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