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Whistling Straits Fescue Fairways

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Matt Schulte:
I realize that Pete and Herb wanted to replicate links playing conditions by using fescue grasses in the fairways at Whistling Straits.  However, in that climate fescue cannot be cut very short.  My experience was the loss of "fast and firm" rolls that are so much a part of true links golf.  Additionally, the greens seemed very receptive.  As such, the player has the option of flying the ball to the pin more.  In my opinion the whole experience would be much more fun had the course conditions encouraged more ground game.

Paul Richards:
matts:

I have played Whistling Straits on multiple occasions.

Each and every time, it played hard and fast. :)

Maybe you just visited at a bad time? ???

Tom Doak:
Matt,

I haven't seen Whistling Straits since the fall before it opened, but Tom Mead in my office did help them with the grassing of the course when they decided they wanted to go with fescue.

A lot of the people who have tried fescue fairways in America are afraid to cut it short, because the conventional wisdom is that it will go away.  Yet on British links it often appears tight as linoleum.

If they're still mowing at 3/4 of an inch, that negates one of the great advantages of fescue -- being able to putt the ball from 10-20 yards off the green.  An approach shot may bounce home because of the firmness of the turf, but real links conditions mean the ball should ROLL.

At Pacific Dunes we planted Colonial bentgrass with the fescue, and since they aren't worried about the bentgrass failing, they're not afraid to mow it short.  There's still a lot of fescue there, so I'm not sure it would go away at Whistling Straits if they mowed it shorter.

Tight fescue is the best playing surface in the world.  You just can't ever have a pure stand of it like Americans want.

John_McMillan:
Tom -

High Pointe was a fescue design in very similar climate to Whistling Straits (though they've redone the greens with bent).  What were the design issues you faced in putting fescue in there?  Were there concerns that it could not be closely mown?  Given the fairly easy summers of Northern Michigan (and of Wisconsin), I can't imagine them being that stressful on shortly cut grass.  Does the conventional wisdom only apply to fescue grown further south in the US?

RJ_Daley:
I wish someone with great turf knowlege would answer this question authoritatively.   My super friends in Nebraska tell me that the fescue issue is mostly about the relative humidity whereas SH is drier and colder than WH in micro climate.   Thus, SH fairways are fescues and WH fairways are planted in blues with only the wide surrounds seeded in fescue.  Disease in the heat and humidity of the Platte River Basin is tough on the fescues.  

WHistling Straits is much cooler in degree days, yet can have brief periods of 88-90s heat.  But, nights and days are generally cooler right next to the lake, and humidity is relatively high.  So, is the issue that even though WS is cooler than Nebraska, it isn't as cool as the north sea courses?  Is that why they can manage the fescues at shorter cutting heights in Scotland?  Fescue is not as agressive to respond to injury from divots either, I don't believe.  How about a short course on this issue from a turf head?

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