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Steve_ Shaffer

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Scott Miller, Architect
« on: July 27, 2004, 07:05:33 AM »
This article is a profile of Scottsdale based Scott Miller who designed the highly acclaimed WeKoPa. Of interest to Adam Clayman is the description of the new course at Sandia in New Mexico. From today's Arizona Republic:

www.azcentral.com/community/scottsdale/articles/0727sr-miller27Z8.html


It plays downhill from here
 


Scott Miller of Scottsdale not only is at the pinnacle of the golf-course design industry, he's just been to the summit of Mount Kilimanjaro in Africa.
 
Course architect climbs Kilimanjaro

Rebecca Larsen
Special for the Scottsdale Republic
Jul. 27, 2004 12:00 AM


NORTHEAST VALLEY - Scott Miller has climbed lofty heights in golf-course architecture, but one of his recent high-elevation experiences had nothing to do with golf.

Miller, who designed We-Ko-Pa Golf Club, the Golf Club at Eagle Mountain in Fountain Hills and Kierland Golf Club in Phoenix, climbed Mount Kilimanjaro, which at 19,400 feet is the tallest peak in Africa.

"It's one of the safest tall mountains, as well, with not as many glaciers and crevasses, which is why my family let me go," Miller said.

Miller, 48, of Scottsdale, made the trek in January with five friends and acquaintances from Arizona and one from Denver.

One of the toughest parts of his African trip was getting to Tanzania.

"First, you fly to Detroit, then to Amsterdam (Holland) and then right into the town near Kilimanjaro. It was brutal," he said.

 The climb took six days.

"You start at 4,000 feet and then climb about 5,000 feet a day," he said. "During the last couple of days you get to 15,000 feet, but then you descend to camp at 12,000 feet for a while. That's how they get you used to the altitude.

"Then you make a base camp at 15,000 feet, and you start during the night to go to the summit, which you reach at daybreak."

Miller said the wind-chill factor on top was 20 degrees below zero. . "Some of the wind gusts were 50 miles per hour," he said.

Back in the world of golf design in the Southwest, Miller travels weekly to New Mexico. He's busy laying out a course for the Pueblo of Sandia, a Native American community north of Albuquerque.

Miller said members of the tribal council visited the Northeast Valley several times to play Miller's acclaimed desert-style courses before selecting him to design their golf course, which will open in June 2005.The Sandia Resort Golf Club course will be similar to We-Ko-Pa "as far as beauty, contrast between the desert and the fairways and playability," Miller said.

"There were not as many trees and bushes on the location as at We-Ko-Pa, but the site is stunning. It's right at the base of the mountains, and 12 of the 18 holes look right at the mountains. It's very similar in that respect to courses in Palm Springs."

Miller is one of those rare people who knew what he wanted to do with his life by the time he was in the sixth grade. He was raised in Augusta, Kan., close to a nine-hole course, but his family couldn't pay for his greens fees.

"So I worked on the maintenance crew and I got to play and fell in love with the game," he said.

"My buddies and I also played cross-country golf - playing through the area and making up holes as we went along.

"Then I'd go home and sketch out the holes we had just played," he said. "I'm not sure I even knew at the time that courses had 18 holes."

Hanging on the wall in his office is a framed version of one of those early golf-course layouts that his mother saved for him.

With a degree in landscape architecture from Colorado State University, Miller worked for Jack Nicklaus' design firm and moved to Scottsdale to handle the western end of Nicklaus' business.

He helped design Desert Highlands Golf Club in Scottsdale as well as the Renegade, Cochise and Geronimo courses at the Desert Mountain Club in Scottsdale. In 1988, Miller decided to venture out on his own.

Miller's specialty has been building desert-style courses, but he contends that his courses, despite having a target flavor and limited turf, still allow the traditional recovery shot.

"When you're playing a traditional course out East, and you get into trouble in the rough, you can either be a hero and hit through the trees, or you can chip out to the fairway and take your penalty," he said.

"But when you hit into the brush in the desert, it's often just unplayable. Every one of my courses, though, has transitional areas, so you can have a chance to recover."

FYI

Scott Miller
AGE: 48.

RESIDENCE: Scottsdale.

EDUCATION: Colorado State University.

OCCUPATION: Golf course designer.

FAMILY: Wife, Jenny; daughters Jenna (18), Kylie (16), Carrie (14).

HOBBIES: Mountain climbing, raising horses for his daughters.

HE DESIGNED THEM: Coeur d'Alene Resort Golf Course in Coeur d'Alene, Idaho; We-Ko-Pa Golf Club; the Golf Club at Eagle Mountain in Fountain Hills; Kierland Golf Club in Phoenix.
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Norbert P

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Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2004, 04:31:01 PM »
Miller's specialty has been building desert-style courses, but he contends that his courses, despite having a target flavor and limited turf, still allow the traditional recovery shot.

"... when you hit into the brush in the desert, it's often just unplayable. Every one of my courses, though, has transitional areas, so you can have a chance to recover."  S Miller

 I am very limited in my desert golf experiences but this sort of struck me as obvious, yet insightful.  I not only experience a lot of recovery shot situations, I've come to rely on them for excitement and memorability in a round.  

 (Will he tackle Chungalungma next?)

 
"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Joel_Stewart

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Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2004, 07:16:46 PM »
I played WeKoPa last year and then called him to discuss it.  He was polite but not overly freindly, didn't reveal anything just answered the questions.  

WeKoPa is very Jack Nicklaus in style, maintance and probably big budget.  It is part of an Indain casino, and is one of the few newer courses in AZ that doesn't have any homes.  The pro said it is the #1 course in AZ for rounds played, or maybe it was revenue.


RJ_Daley

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Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2004, 07:32:07 PM »
I played one Scott Miller course, Bristlecone Pines outside of Milwaukee.  It is OK, yet has a few awkward holes mixed among some pretty good ones.  I'd definitely play it again.  It is a periphery parade of homes, with nothing intrusive within the golf course boundaries of the course.  The course fairway grading was done in a bit of an inconsistent theme, with some overly graded "moguls" on a couple of fairways.  But, overall, it ain't bad...
« Last Edit: July 27, 2004, 07:32:44 PM by RJ_Daley »
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Norbert P

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2004, 03:28:55 AM »

Bristlecone Pine  (Pinus longaeva)

"Earth's oldest living inhabitant "Methuselah" at 4,767 years, has lived more than a millennium longer than any other tree."

http://www.sonic.net/bristlecone/intro.html

(Jus' cuz)

There was a tree older of the same species but a feller cut it down with a chainsaw.
"Golf is only meant to be a small part of one’s life, centering around health, relaxation and having fun with friends/family." R"C"M

Scott_Burroughs

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2004, 02:04:02 PM »
I played the Couer d'Alene Resort course twice earlier this month, which got a renovation by Miller on his own original design.  Lengthened by close to 500 yards and tweaked the 11-13 holes, I believe, among other things.  The par 3's are the highlight of the course (even besides the floater), with some decent bunkering and other holes.  The containment mounds between the parallel holes got old real fast, but I guess it's for protection of the resort goers, also to have holes seem by themselves.  The greens were the flattest set of greens I've ever seen in my life, of all 280-some courses.  That got old after just a few holes.  Interestingly enough, the first green has one of the few greens with any interest.

At least the howling wind (and 49ers coach Dennis Erickson in the group behind one day) added interest that the greens couldn't.

Matthew Petersen

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Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2011, 04:34:29 PM »
Miller's specialty has been building desert-style courses, but he contends that his courses, despite having a target flavor and limited turf, still allow the traditional recovery shot.

"... when you hit into the brush in the desert, it's often just unplayable. Every one of my courses, though, has transitional areas, so you can have a chance to recover."  S Miller

 I am very limited in my desert golf experiences but this sort of struck me as obvious, yet insightful.  I not only experience a lot of recovery shot situations, I've come to rely on them for excitement and memorability in a round.  


I find that comment quite interesting as I consider WeKoPa Cholla to be one of the more extreme desert golf courses I've played. I'm not entirely sure what he means by "transitional areas," but I'd be very interested to have him show me some examples on the ground. There's a lot I like about the WeKoPa course, but it has struck me over several plays as a course where getting off the fairway almost definitely means a lost ball.

Matthew Petersen

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Re: Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2011, 04:42:21 PM »
Anyway I sought out this thread based on mark's excellent tour of Couer d'Alene, which is a Miller design.

I have played several of his courses here in Arizona, and one in Colorado, with mixed impressions.

Some of his notable work includes:

Couer d'Alene, Idaho
Deer Creek at Meadow Ranch, Colorado
We-Ko-Pa (Cholla), Arizona
Eagle Mountain, Arizona
Kierland, Arizona
DC Ranch, AZ (private)
Sandia, New Mexico

I've played Eagle Mountain, Deer Creek, WeKoPa, and Kierland. I'm struck among those courses (and this is reinforced based on the photo tour of CDA) by a decided lack of any dominant personal style.

Eagle Mtn and Kierland both featured greens with irdges that cut into the sides extending from mounding that surrounds the green. I did not like the feature at either course. I can't remember any particularly interesting holes at Kierland at all; there's a nice driveable par 4 at Eagle Mtn and that's about it. On the other hand WeKoPa is an excellent desert design, though markedly in contrast to the style of the C&C Saguaro course that was built some years later.

As for the Deer Creek course in Colorado, it's another with a variety of good holes and questionable ones. Perhaps like CDA it is squeezed onto an area of land that couldn't have been easy (plenty of environmentally restricted areas at DC) but I have played it multiple times and always enjoyed the round.

This leads me to a question I often have about some of the designers who are somewhat known 9so aren't going to be working dirt cheap), but also aren't upper echelon in terms of reputation or name value. I'm thinking of guys like Art Hills, for example (though he obviously has a portfolio much larger than Miller's).

Why would a developer hire Scott Miller?

Sean Leary

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Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #8 on: July 18, 2011, 04:58:37 PM »
I played WeKoPa last year and then called him to discuss it.  He was polite but not overly freindly, didn't reveal anything just answered the questions.  





Perhaps because he thought you were stalking him?  

Doak, Nicklaus and Crenshaw don't even answer the phone when I call them...  ;)
« Last Edit: July 18, 2011, 05:43:06 PM by Sean Leary »

Alex Miller

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2011, 05:35:21 PM »
I played WeKoPa last year and then called him to discuss it.  He was polite but not overly freindly, didn't reveal anything just answered the questions.  





Perhaps because he thought you were stalking him?  :)

Doak, Nicklaus and Crenshaw don't even answer the phone when I call them...  ;)

I sent Coore a picture of himself with the eyes cut out. Weird that he didn't get I was requesting more blind shots on his courses...

paul cowley

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Re: Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2011, 10:52:52 PM »
.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2011, 06:28:53 AM by paul cowley »
paul cowley...golf course architect/asgca

Adam Clayman

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Re: Scott Miller, Architect
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2011, 11:04:10 AM »
Steve, I never saw this until just now. Thanks for thinking of me.

Paul, Is there anyway you can resign from the organization that is keeping you from being honest? I'm getting sick of these dot posts   .
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

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