THM Redan! Mucci Div - 2nd Seed Yeamans #6 vs 10th Seed Fishers #2

[Richard Choi]

This is a especially classy matchup...

Please vote for your favorite Redan. As usual, you have till end of the week for voting.

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #2 Seed, Yeamans Hall, Hole #6, 190 yards

From Ran...

A classically manufactured Redan hole.One could sit on the tee all day trying to get the draw just right. The Club wisely allowed Jim Urbina to extend the tee box back anothertwelve yardsin 2003 toallow the better player tokeep a mid to low iron in his hand.The ground game aspects of a Redan green complex do not function as well if the player is hitting in too short (i.e. too high) a club.

[Richard Choi]

Mucci Division, #10 Seed, Fishers Island, Hole #2, 170 yards

From Ran - The classic set of Seth Raynor one shotters are found at Fishers Island, with the first one being a Redan with the green angled away at 45 degrees and the usual slope from the back right. This hole can be a rude awakening to golfers not accustomed to the effect of the wind as apond in front of this Redan gobbles up a ballooned tee ball.

[Bill Brightly]

Fishers Island

[Kalen Braley]

I have a feeling this one is going to be close...

Yeamans Hall

[Brent Carlson]

Yeamans

[JNC Lyon]

I haven't played Fishers, but what's up with that bunkering on the left?  It looks very strange for a Raynor layout.

Yeamans Hall has a very solid Redan.  Sean Arble will, naturally, post here and say that, while it is a good hole, it is not really a Redan.  I, of course, will disagree.  As he does on his Alps hole at Yeamans, Raynor/Doak make good use of bunker heights to obscure part of the green and give the golfer the impression that, as on the original hole, he is storming a fortress.  Moreover, the lines on the bunkers and the green are very clean and well presented.  The kick plates to the right and long are presented perfectly.  Also, the hole is very graceful because it follows the natural flow of the land from the right to left, towards the tidal marsh.  I'm guessing Raynor found this hole and routed around it, because it fits the land so well.

Yeamans wins this one.

[Kalen Braley]

I couldn't put my finger on it before on why Fishers felt a bit off...

..but the I think in this case its the pond.  I guess its just elicits feelings of yet another hole with a pond to carry and/or to punish wayward shots.  I've played dozens of par 3 holes with water left or water right like this.

[Tim Martin]

Yeamans- I`ve only played Fisher`s but Yeamans appears to have substantially more cant making it more interesting.

[Sean_A]

The shape of the green at YHC is a bit odd.  I am not convinced one can hit the front of that green with a draw and get right to the back.  If it can be done, it takes a far better golfer than myself.  Its the same with the aerial route.  Hitting that back target is very difficult.  All in all, trying to access the back hole location is much harder than at North Berwick.  I would also say the penalty for a miss is much harder than at North Berwick.  Those rear bunkers are no joke and it takes a terrific shot just to hold the green from back there.  Still, I do think this is a Redan and a very good one at that even if a bit severe.  The water at FI puts me off that hole.  Yeamans Hall.

BTW - No, YHC's 5th is not an Alps as blindness is a prime consideration of the template - tee hee.

Ciao

[JNC Lyon]

The shape of the green at YHC is a bit odd.  I am not convinced one can hit the front of that green with a draw and get right to the back.  If it can be done, it takes a far better golfer than myself.  Its the same with the aerial route.  Hitting that back target is very difficult.  All in all, trying to access the back hole location is much harder than at North Berwick.  I would also say the penalty for a miss is much harder than at North Berwick.  Those rear bunkers are no joke and it takes a terrific shot just to hold the green from back there.  Still, I do think this is a Redan and a very good one at that even if a bit severe.  The water at FI puts me off that hole.  Yeamans Hall.

BTW - No, YHC's 5th is not an Alps as blindness is a prime consideration of the template - tee hee.

Ciao

The second shot at Yeamans' 5th may not be completely blind, but you definitely can't see the green surface.  This means there remains some mysterious quality to the second shot.

[Mark McKeever]

Yeamans Hall.  Fishers should have been knocked out already anyway.

Mark

[Bill Brightly]

I understand the issue that some of you have with the pond on Fishers Island Redan. Perhaps this google earth image will show that the golfer's eye is probably more drawn to the Atlantic Ocean in the background...

 

[Trevor]

Yeamans Hall...You can play the tee shot, bunker shots, and the putting surface in hundreds of different ways.  Impossible to get bored with this hole.

[Kalen Braley]

Bill,

I love aerial as much as the next guy...but it would seem that view is only available once you're on the green, not while standing on the tee.  But perhaps this shot from the tee is not a good one.

[Bill Brightly]

Kalen,

After many tries, that was my first successful attempt to copy and post a Google Earth image! It's not easy being a dinosaur.

Like real estate,  I am a big believer in location, location, location. I just think a golf hole this close to the Long Island Sound, modeled after the original at North Berwick,which sits on the Firth of Forth, needs special mention. And when we consider how a hole plays, you can't photograph wind.

[Kalen Braley]

Bill,

You did an awesome job of it as well.    I do agree that Fishers Island is in an epic location and no doubt the course seems nothing short of fantastic from what I've seen in pictures.

I guess myself being a "zeroes or ones" kind of guy, I'm having less success interpretting the more subtle artistic attributes of these holes in this contest. Perhaps thats why I was baffled when the dragon tooth version of the Redan beat out a very faithful version of the Redan at Old Mac in the last round.

[JNC Lyon]

Bill B,

I know you are a Redan fanatic.  And I agree, the wind at Fishers is a huge factor.  However, I guarantee you there is plenty of wind at the Yeamans Hall location.  It is a couple miles inland from the Atlantic, and there is a wide, exposed tidal marsh a few yards to the left of the green.  The wind plays a major factor at the coastal courses in South Carolina, and Yeamans is no exception.

[Donnie Beck]

A more recent picture taken this spring after bunker work.

[JNC Lyon]

Wow, the new bunker at Fishers looks great.  The contouring and mowing lines around the green look much cleaner and sharper in the recent picture.

I still vote Yeamans though!

[Mike Demetriou]

Yeamans

[Kevin Pallier]

A more recent picture taken this spring after bunker work.

Donnie

Are you able to elaborate on what was done ? If I recall correctly one was also going to look at the cant of the green as well ?

[Donnie Beck]

Bill,

I love aerial as much as the next guy...but it would seem that view is only available once you're on the green, not while standing on the tee.  But perhaps this shot from the tee is not a good one.

Kalen,

There isn't a picture from the tee posted. The views you are looking at are from the drop area 90 yds from the green. The men's tees are 85-95 yds further back and slightly elevated. You can indeed see the ocean from every tee and every green at Fishers.

[Tom_Doak]

I have no special rooting interest in the overall results of this competition ... though it is hard for me to imagine that any Redan could wind up beating THE Redan.  But, I'll cast a vote for the sixth at Yeamans Hall here.  It's an awesome hole.

[Richard Choi]

I have no special rooting interest in the overall results of this competition

C'mon Tom! You still have Pacific 17th in the race