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Paul Richards

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The Best Back Nine in Golf
« on: December 04, 2001, 12:17:27 PM »
My nomination for the "Best Back Nine" holes in golf is none
other than:

Cypress Point :)


Any other nominees? ???
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Something has to change, otherwise the never-ending arms race that benefits only a few manufacturers will continue to lead to longer courses, narrower fairways, smaller greens, more rough, more expensive rounds, and other mechanisms that will leave golf's future in doubt." -  TFOG

BarnyF

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2001, 01:26:24 PM »
I can't remember the name of the course...but I do know I would drop everthing just to play the back nine any time any day...I drop everthing to watch it played every April...and some big name architect just finished making it even better.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Gary Smith (Guest)

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2001, 01:38:50 PM »
Shinnecock Hills.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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GeoffreyC

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2001, 01:42:05 PM »
Barney aka John - you're joking right? I know Tom Fazio is working at Pine Valley but what tournament in April is held there?  ;) Isn't the Crump Cup later in the season?

I'll nominate Pine Valley here too! Name a less then superb hole.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Dunlop_White

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2001, 02:28:21 PM »
Augusta National Golf Club - pre 2001!!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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WB_Salinetti

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2001, 03:07:23 PM »
Essex County Club or Winged Foot West
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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R.S._Barker

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2001, 03:42:05 PM »
Now I realize that my suggestion might be a little off...compared to other member's excellent suggestions...and whilst I agree that Cypress ( excluding the anti-climatic 18th ), Augusta, and Pine Valley ( excluding nothing * smirk * ) are wonderful courses, and fit the bill...why not a course that by most reports has the best finishing holes across the ocean.

Portmarnock Golf Club ( when the wind blows...when it does not, this course is relatively easy ).

The 10th is a shortish par 4 with a fine line needed..especially to the falling, sloping green.

The 11th has the same type of demand, with a green that also falls away on the back and left side.

The 12th  is a 155 yard par 3 that tests the lofted game, and requires accuracy.

The 13th  at over 540 yards and all those bunkers ( 16 ) forces the player to be accurate and careful to make par.

The 14th : As premier a start to the final holes as any in the world. Top-notch design, and favored by pro's everywhere. This holes build's you up...

and the 15th tears you down. Voted by many professionals as one of the best par 3's in the world...( it has my vote for best par 3 )..this hole has a hogsback green design, with severe bunkering. It plays to about 185-200.

16th - a Par 5 that while not long, demands your complete attention.

17th - A wickedly simple design leads many golfers to take it easy on this hole..and the results can be deadly. a long par 4 even when the wind doesn't blow...this hole sets up a gorgeous finish at

18...no doubt one of the premier finishing holes in all of golf...though it can not compare to Pebble's stunning view ...it has it's own flavor...a view of the inlet bay, with the quaint clubhouse ( complete with a huge Mast of a ship ) as a backround and Howth Island as well.

I do state that WHEN the wind blows this course is one of the best...perhaps this course also fits the bill of being the one course at the mercy of the elements more than any other....nowhere to hide on the Portmarnock Peninsula...and at the same time can be pummeled by the Irish Sea and the wind.

Just a thought,
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Ran Morrissett

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Landslide victory
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2001, 03:47:39 PM »
The Old Course at St. Andrews in a landside. Consider in one 9 holes that you have:

1) one of the two finest intermediate length one shotters in golf
2) one of the two finest short par fours in golf
3) the greatest par five in the game
4) one of the most compelling intermediate length two shotters in the 16th hole
4) the most famous hole in golf, and finally (!)
5) the finest walk in golf is contained in its Home hole

AND every skill level can enjoy it on his or her own terms.

Not too bad, says I  ;)

Cheers,
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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PGertner

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2001, 06:06:00 PM »
For incredible scenic views, and some pretty good golf, too, how about Kirtland CC outside Cleveland??  No, it is not Augusta, PV or Cypress Point, but the back nine here is incredible.  

Just my 2 cents worth.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Tom MacWood (Guest)

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2001, 06:10:59 PM »
The most underrated nine in golf might be the back nine at Kirtland. Australian champion Norman Van Nida said it was the second best nine in the world -- the front at Royal Melbourne I believe was #1. Kirtland's last nine has few peers in the US.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Scott_Burroughs_

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2001, 08:04:07 PM »
Pacific Grove GL and Tijeras Creek ;) (Rancho Santa Margarita, CA)

These entries obviously aren't the best back nines in golf (though Adam Clayman may argue for PG), but their back nines are so much better than their fronts, they seem greater.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Jeff_Lewis

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2001, 01:17:08 PM »
Probably not the best back nine in England, but still a wonderful surprise is the back side at Hillside, adjacent to Birkdale, which may be as good as either nine at its neighbor. The reason it is such a suprise is because the front side is relatively nondescript.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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JSlonis

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2001, 03:20:38 PM »
How about another obvious choice....MERION. For strategy and design qualities it stacks up against any nine in golf.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Will E

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Of course it has to be....
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2001, 06:12:06 PM »
TPC Sawgrass
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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George_Bahto

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2001, 07:51:37 PM »
one of my favorite back nine is Harbour Town's
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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If a player insists on playing his maximum power on his tee-shot, it is not the architect's intention to allow him an overly wide target to hit to but rather should be allowed this privilege of maximum power except under conditions of exceptional skill.
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Patrick_Mucci

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2001, 08:14:30 PM »
Paul,

Some good back nines would be:

Essex County N.J.
Winged Foot
Boca Rio
NGLA
GCGC
The Creek
Westhampton
Shinnecock
Seminole
PV
Cypress Point
Pinehurst # 2

And about 50 others I can't think of at the moment
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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michael

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2001, 12:53:15 AM »
Augusta??

Some of you guys need your head read.
Clearly the annual tournament and the obvious drama that unfolds each year has got in the way of your true feelings.

Whilst the back Nine does feature one of the best short par 3's and par 41/2's in the game it unfortunately always has:-

*a terrible drive at the last - through an overgrown shoot of trees to a bunker on the outside of a dogleg to an albeit, invisible fairway.

*a poor drive over another aerial hazard at 17.  Neither of which (17 and 18) could be easily played by your average Augusta member.

*a poor redesign of the 16th.

*another heroic yet too difficult second / approach at 15? surely for the average player who after all needs to be considered.

I like the course and love the tournament but from a purely architecural stance you surely cannot think that it is the best??

I don't know whether Melbourne's sandbelt has the answer that your looking for but their are some wonderful holes located on their back nine's.

RM (West)
* has possibly the best short par 4 (10th), one of the best long par 3's (16th) and likewise par 4's (17th) in Australia.  As well as no bad or boring holes - even on the flat paddock.

KHeath
* the best uphill par 3 - possibly in the world, one of the best long par 4's in Australia (16th), two fantastic three shotters (12 and 14), is regarded as having the toughest 4 closing holes in Australia and one of the best short par 3's (10th) going around.

Anyway, someone needs to wave the flag in a website dominated by american's

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Mike Clayton

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2001, 03:55:12 AM »
Michael

Perfect!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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jim_lewis

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2001, 04:31:43 AM »
Michael:

American here.    I am in complete agreement with everything you said, except the part about the redesign of #16 at ANGC.

As long as I can remember #18 at ANGC has been one of the worst finishing holes in major tournament golf. BTW, I still love the place and never miss a Masters.

I also endorse your enthusiasm for RM and Kingston Heath.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Crusty"  Jim
Freelance Curmudgeon

Patrick_Mucci

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2001, 02:37:15 PM »
I would include the back nine at Augusta amongst the great back nines in golf.

How can you not include Augusta's back nine as one of the great ones ?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Chris Kane

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #20 on: December 06, 2001, 02:37:24 PM »
I'm Australian!

I agree wholeheartedly with Michael's comments: the sandbelt has some great finishes.

The only bad hole on RM West is the 14th - a hole devoid of interest - but that is the only bad hole on the course.  10 is an absolute cracker, while 17 has a wonderful 2nd shot with that huge bunker guarding the right side of the green.  18 is a great finish, the question is: which has the better finishing hole, the East or West course?

Some people may jump up and down, but Metropolitan has a great final four holes, but is let down by the earlier ones.  15-18 isn't far short of KH, except perhaps it lacks the variety.  Interesting to hear what Mike Clayton thinks - as a well-known critic of Metropolitan.

What about the 14th at Kingston Heath.  That is a par 5 up there with the best of them.  15-16-17 are all unique concepts, and very difficult to boot.  Not too sure about 18 though, what do people think?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Gene Greco

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #21 on: December 06, 2001, 06:10:36 PM »
Sand Hills
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"...I don't believe it is impossible to build a modern course as good as Pine Valley.  To me, Sand Hills is just as good as Pine Valley..."    TOM DOAK  November 6th, 2010

Ran Morrissett

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Yo, Aussies!
« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2001, 06:32:12 PM »
Do any of you Aussies think the back at RM W is better than the front?

I don't - the 3rd is the equal of the 10th, the 5th and 7th swamp the 13th and 16th, the 2nd equals the 12th, the 4th and 6th can't be matched by either 17th, 18th or 11th, and either the 8th or 9th would best the 14th.

All up, there is no better stretch in world golf than the 3rd through 7th at RM W, though Crump and Egan may disagree  ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Chris Kane

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Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2001, 07:07:29 PM »
The back at RM West is nothing compared to the front - I agree with you Ran.  However, the back isn't too shabby itself.

There is no better five hole stretch than 3-7, and its interesting that from the info I have, the only holes that McKenzie routed himself were 3-6 and 10.  The rest were simply modifications of the Sandringham layout.

Imagine how good RM West could have been if McKenzie had been able to route a whole course!  I would venture to say the undisputed top course - its already right up there.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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A_Clay_Man

Re: The Best Back Nine in Golf
« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2001, 07:33:36 PM »
Scott- I wouldn't argue about Pg, butt ( l ), If it was Patrick Hitt's round... after a freebie at Pebble and in 30 mph winds, it would be the best.
R.S. Barker-I would like to say that the one time I did play CPC I had the most exciting 18th. So, calling it anti-claimactic is falling on blind eyes. ;D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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