[TEPaul]

Another thing about "firm and fast" conditions "through the green" is that most people believe to achieve it you have to "brown out" the course or that that's likely to happen.

I wonder about that. Some of the courses I've seen in the last few years like a few of the East end Long Island courses are extremely firm and fast but they have that "dull green sheen" to them that you can just look at and almost feel the speed! But they are green, not brown, just a lighter green!

I realize most of the East end LI courses are sand based and maybe that's part of the reason.

The question is how possible is it to get that "dull green sheen" on other courses in other areas that evidences that kind of speed. And how possible is it to keep it that way?

There has always been a big battle between "green" vs "firm and fast". So isn't it possible to get both? Really firm and fast and green too--even if it is that "dull green sheen"?

That tournament fast "dull green sheen" is also absolutely beautiful to look at too! I can't imagine anyone, even those that say they love "green" not liking the look of that "dull green sheen".

[Don_Mahaffey]

TEPaul,
You've heard it from me before, one of the biggest misconceptions on this DG is that a course can't look good and be firm/fast. Nothing could be further from the truth and good superintendents across the country are proving it everyday.

Regards,

[TEPaul]

Just keep it coming guys because I'd like to point my guys at my club to this site when the info is in! We need research to acheive a "playability" goal and the more info the better!

[Brad Miller]

Tom, in my example on your other thread, the colors where a mixture of green, that shinny shade of green and light browns (light) much more appealing to my eye than plain old lush green. The golf course is not and should not be ones front lawn.

[Rich Goodale (Guest)]

Tom

In the good old days of metal spikes, a properly prepared green could also be identified by the slight crunching noise made as you ventured across it.

[Tim_Weiman]

Brad Miller:

I think many here, myself included, will agree with you.  But,  given that many Americans seem convinced lush green is good, maybe Tom Paul is on to something.

Perhaps, if the "dull green sheen" is compatible with "firm and fast", more people will accept that kind of set up.

[TEPaul]

Describing the color of firm and fast as a "dull green sheen" really does seem to be a contradiction in terms, and I'm aware of that, but it really is the way the color appears to me on what I saw last year at Shinnecock, for instance. Maybe I should call it a "light green sheen" so as not to confuse someone.

[Peter Galea]

The key is careful water management. I like to see turf stress a little at the end of the day. Then, irrigation that night is done to replace the water the plant lost during the day. This is not always possible. Depends on the quality of the irrigation system, soil types, environmental factors and water quality. In a perfect world....

[Brad Miller]

Tim, I hear you.
Tom, went for a run today at my home club (Greenwich CC) in CT, clearly because of winter weather the ground is soft, but the colors where great, all those that we have been talking about. Goal.. these colors with F&F conditions as opposed to the lush green we normally see for most of the season. Maybe the membership at some of our clubs need to "go for a walk"

[Tony Ristola]

At Artland GC (named for the region), a project I completed in Germany, was reviewed by Golf Digest Germany (Golf Sport magazine) and they stated that one significant draw-back of the course was that it had no fairway irrigation system.  I was so pissed I could have bitten through rebar.  The course didn't need one, and for the extra bucks to keep the course green for a few weeks every couple years I considered it a waste.  We had only one small problem area during grow-in, about 1200 sq. yards!  The climate their is like England, cool and wet with some potential heat in the summer.  

Artland was designed for firm and fast play, and the one additional benefit is the board of directors can't abuse the fairway irrigation system when they don't have one (there is tee and green irrigation), the other is the course changes character with the climatic conditions and it does get fast...it's on sandy soils.  

Another course I built down the road from Artland should also play hard and fast...was designed so and did play hard and fast during the first year but then the board got the Graveyard Green, Japanese Garden mentality in their blood and have overwatered and overfed since.  The irrigation system was put in for grow-in as the course is on a river which floods a couple holes every year and insurance required it and seeding by a certain date...I'd like to go back now and rip out all the heads in the fairways.  It's a waste and it's all done for color.

The Golf Sport type reporting is partially responsible for promoting the green is great mentality...which is wholly irresponsible.  When a major magazine starts pushing this (they're "authorities") the public eats it up.

Another trap which mezmerizes club committees every April is when Augusta hits the screens...even Birkdale fell into this trap and after overfeeding and overwatering eventually had to dig up their greens and start over.  Remember how bumpy they were when Baker-Finch won?

I wonder what will be made of the changes.  I wanted to say Augusta would be celebrated earlier but never imagined jack would give his seal of good-housekeeping on the changes, especially after his rant about the ball being out of control.

Was Carnoustie due to irrigation and feeding madness or just unfortunate circumstances?

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Yesterday, while playing Schmidt & Curley's Goose Creek in Mira Loma, I was treated with fine fast and firm conditions that so many of us here on GCA love. Mind you that this is a modern course in an area that is deaf to such overtones.

Think about it. The dead of winter and the couse is not only playing fast and firm, but green and very beautiful. no matter how many leaves were missing from the trees or the lack of reeds in the hazards.

Imagine my excitement when paired with a two-some that hit the ball 180-190 average and a short game that relied on two words--"Chili" and "Dip." Both expressed a style with the flat stick that would make Wayne Gretsky fearful of his scoring records disappearing. I'm not complaining about the way they played, but more of their insistence that the putting surfaces were "just too difficult and needed the water to be turned on them for about four hours." (an exact quote.)

To me it is an utter amazement that "part-time" players such as these (3-10 times a year max) could ever think that they know better then the hard and admirable work of the superintendent at Goose Creek who maintains the course in such a grand fashion. True, they are the paying customer, but the thoroughly uneducated ones whose opinions would best be served at a social function, where tiddly winks is the game at hand. These gentleman sincerely have never been educated in how the game is played by the rules, and only have learned what they know from what they have seen on and heard on television and print.

If Fast & Firm conditions were better accentuated at Masters by the CBS and USA networks, could you imagine how well they would receive it?

Too extreme? Yes, maybe, but I'll fight for fast and firm conditions as well as the purity of the game like a Papazian in heat.

[Paul Turner]

Links courses often have their own hue, that simply governed by the local climate:

Rosses Point always appears to have a light green colour;  same for Muirfield and Gullane.

Waterville, Lahinch and Ballybunion are a darker shade of green.  

But Sandwich and Deal, often look burnt to a crisp.  

[TEPaul]

It is probably very true that one of the main objections of Americans to firm and fast conditions is that their courses will then have the same coloring of the links courses and that is not something they want!

Unfortunately, this is just a simple but prevalent misunderstanding! Americans look at those European courses (and other areas of the world) and they see that mottled coloring and they think something is wrong with the agronomy! They think if a course or a green is mottled (many different colors) that some of the grass is unhealthy and that the brownish color or some other off color that may be natural or even dormant is synonymous with "dead"!

That's a misconception that is hard to overcome. But the key is that we may be able to achieve firm and fast and not even have the colorations of the links and foreign courses. And I think that's what this "dull green sheen" or "light green sheen" may give us!

[Tony Ristola]

TEPaul:  To change the mindset requires the press to push this hard, but every April, after the Master and a diet of overseeded perfection everyone dreams of playing in fields of monostands.  

In some areas, especially the winter resort areas like Phoenix/Scottsdale or Palm Springs overseeding in the winter will always give that uniform look.

[W.H. Cosgrove]

I have always felt that grass has two colors; green and brown.  Green sells lots.  As crass as that may seem, money drives the color.  

With that in mind, irrigation technology has reached a point where a course can remain a shade of green and yet play firm and fast.  Once again money is important.  A wall to wall state of the art irrigation system costs in the neighborhood of $1million.  Unless owners/members are willing to foot that kind of bill, then they will need to make some dificult decisions.

Places like GCA important because the education of the playing public begins here.  

I received an EMail from a friend in New Zealand who was lamenting how shaggy Paraparaumu Beach looked on television at the recent NZ Open.  I had been commenting that the course looked as it should.  I was fortunate enough to play the course a year ago, it drove me crazy with it's speed.  The ball seemed to run on forever. Unless a shot was perfectly conceived, the ball would find the rough.  

The 'Augusta effect' is costing us all a lot of money and also the quality of the game.  

As players we should be demanding a firm fast track.  If that means we get some brown turf in doing so, bring it on!

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