[V. Kmetz]

Today's 16th at Siwanoy (Jun 17, 2010)

The Red Line is the line of play today 375-385 yards
The Blue Line is the line of play indicated by the yardage and map described in the 1915 BDE (357 yards)
The Yellow Line is the line of play for the 272 yard version of the hole described by the 1916 card used for the first PGA



The April 1994 version of the 16th

**note the absence of a retention pond built by Stephen Kay ca. 1996-99




The April 1994 version (with various play lines from 2010 photo)

***the white line circle is where Ross had a sequence of some 9-13 bunkers, a mix of pots and pits separating the fairway from the green site***




cheers

vk

[Tom MacWood]

So all of this is to highlight the problems:

 -  how did the 16th go from 357 in 1915 (pre Winton), to 272 for the first PGA (Winton arrives six months earlier), and back to the longer distance and companion adjustment to its HCP by 1925+ evidences?

- Why or how did the BDE artist miss out on the 11 bunker complex on this hole, when he got other significant bunker complexes right?

- Why does Anderson, a Siwanoy member and national competitor, choose to specifically insinuate Winton's role as an agronomic one, the green keeper.  Is this just a gloss or carelessness; writing about his own club... in a significant magazine... covering the inaugural professional championship in this or any country?

VK
I don't know the answer to your first two questions, but as far as your last question I'd say Anderson was emphasizing the condition of the course for the championship and not necessarily commenting on or about what architectural impact Winton may have made at that point, or in future years. Winton had only been at the club for six months at the time, and his tenure would eventually cover nine years. I do think it is interesting he referred to him as 'a course architect of renown' in 1916. To my knowledge had not yet practiced golf architecture in America, which tells me the club must have had knowledge of his architectural expertise in the UK when they hired him.

[DMoriarty]

From the American Golfer, August 1913:

   The Siwanoy Country Club, of Mount Vernon, has recently acquired a tract of 110 acres about three- quarters of a mile from the present course, and Donald Ross has laid out 18 holes which, in his estimation, offer promise of being one of the finest lay- outs in the Metropolitan district. On the property and over-looking Long Island Sound, is situated a large manor house, which will be converted into an up-to-date clubhouse.
   The property is an historic one. Originally owned by a Tory, it was confiscated by the State during the Revolutionary War and presented to John Paulding for his part in the cap- ture of Major Andre.

I have also seen a Carter's ad from April 1914 indicating that the course was seeded in September 1913.

[V. Kmetz]

David,

The last portion, "presented to John Paulding for his part in the capture of Major Andre" is slightly wrong.

The 1976 75th anniversary Club History corrects the discrepancy and oft-repeated establishment of the course property as the Paulding Manor:

"Contrary to the legend, historians have established that the Manor Property was not given by the Continental congess to John Paulding, but to David Williams, who was another member of the patrol of three soldiers (Williams, Paulding and Van Wart) that captured Major Andre."

That Manor house burned down and was completely rebuilt in 1929, which is today's present clubhouse.  A more Gatsby looking thing, inside or out, there couldn't be...as I hope this photo of the 9th hole hints:



 

[DMoriarty]

You may have already seen this, but here is a photo of the 18th with the clubhouse in the background from the September 1921 Golf Illustrated.

[V. Kmetz]

David,

No, I hadn't seen that one, but given the date...it is a rare look at the original Manor House, which burned down.

Sweet.

cheers

vk

[DMoriarty]

Also, here is the rest of that article above, the one with the map.  It is from the February 20, 1915 NY Evening Telegram:






Sounds like an interesting place.  

[V. Kmetz]

David,

Thank you for the full text and its course description.  The view of the 18th green of the 1921 shot you provided previously was taken about 5 yards to the right of the right bunker.

[Tom MacWood]

The original bunkers and current bunkers look different. Is that Kay's doing? He did the same thing at Oyster Harbors, when he gave them a prototypical Ross look they never had historically.

[V. Kmetz]

Tom M,

Yes, absolutely Kay's work.

cheers

vk

[Tom MacWood]

In 1928 Johnny Farrell listed Siwanoy the 13th best course in the country.

1.Olympia Fields
2. Oakmont
3. PVGC
4. Quaker Ridge
5. Bob O'Link
6. Lido
7. NGLA
8. PBGL
9. Brae Burn
10. Hollywood
11. Merion
12. AD Lasker's
13. Siwanoy
14. Baltusrol
15. El Caballero

[V. Kmetz]

Tom M.

That's pretty cool.  From the research I've seen over the years, it seems that Siwanoy's course made a big splash within the elite circuits of golf in its first decade of existence. The association with Kerrigan was also great advertising.  He seems to have been a very popular colleague/competitor of the first era of professionals.

Yet by the late 30s, one has a hard time finding any reports of the course.

My own speculation is that the advance in steel shafts made such a distance jump that Siwanoy was quickly seen as a short course, when only 20 or so years before, it was something of a longish course.

By the late 30s, 6300-6400 yards was already thought to be puny.

Lastly, 1932 was the year the 2000 trees were planted and that may have altered its reputation to an unknown extent.

cheers

vk

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