[Frank M]

I'm trying to get a good explanation as to why so many courses surround their center line bunkers with rough? Is it simply because of maintenance issues (i.e. mobility of machinery)? Is it for strategic purposes (keep your ball from going in, easier to see from a distance)?

[Anthony Gray]

 That looks like a short par 4 that may be drivable?

  Anthony

[Scott Warren]

Frank,

It looks to me more like the management not wanting/being able to have greens staff regularly whipper-snippering the steep banks and cleaning the clippings out of the sand moreso than a playability decision to leave the grass longer.

Looking at the pics - I don't know the course - it seems a ball would need to be moving very slowly to hang up in the grass. Is that so?

[Frank M]

Frank,

It looks to me more like the management not wanting/being able to have greens staff regularly whipper-snippering the steep banks and cleaning the clippings out of the sand moreso than a playability decision to leave the grass longer.

Looking at the pics - I don't know the course - it seems a ball would need to be moving very slowly to hang up in the grass. Is that so?

Anthony and Scott,

It is a shorter par 4 (343 yards) at Tarandowah Golfers Club in Southern Ontario.

I would have to assume it comes down to more of a management decision, but I've seen this "ribbon" of rough around bunkers in the middle of fairways at many golf courses. I personally don't like it, but again, I'm thinking it's just a question of time and $'s. Also, I'm thinking it is to make the bunkers more visible off the tee as some of the bunkers sit deep and could be considered blind.

[Matthew Sander]

Frank,

I'm no authority, but it would seem to be primarily a maintenance issue. As you stated it could be cumbersome and time consuming to be exacting with the equipment near a bunker's edge and many facilities probably don't have the manpower and/or budget to execute the practice. I'd love to hear from some of our experts regarding the maintenance implications. It is a shame because bunkers in general are so much more effective when their surrounds lead into them seamlessly.

Also, have we become conditioned to accept bunkers on the periphery of a hole that are outside of the fairway surrounded by rough? Would it stand to reason that many don't even notice the shortcomings of bunkers surrounded by rough, whether they are fairway bunkers, cross bunkers, or even centerline bunkers?

Here is another picture of centerline bunkers surrounded by rough. However, when we played this course the turf was firm enough and the rough light enough that it didn't seem to be too much of a deterrent for balls to find the bunker.

[Greg Chambers]

When the terrain leading into the bunker is gentle and rolling, it can typically be mowed rather easily with a piece of equipment right up to the bunker edge.  However, when the transition is steep and abrupt, like in your pictures, it would require hand work to maintain tight turf leading in.  This is a large labor expense.  At the last course I was at, I had fairway height turf leading into the bunkers, because it was designed for that.  But, alas, a management company has taken over, so I'm sure the rough around the bunkers will appear.

[Matthew Sander]

This is a link to Bradley Anderson's photo thread of Holston Hills. Several bunkers there seem to illustrate Greg's explanation that a low profile entrance to the bunker makes tightly mown turf possible...

http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,46182.0.html

[Frank M]

Thanks everyone for the info.

[Doug Siebert]

Frank,

Actually I don't think your picture is a good one....at least I don't think it illustrates a real offender in this category.  So long as the ball can enter the bunker on the short grass, as it will do in the bunkers you pictured, I think its fine.  Its when there is a collar of rough six inches to sometimes as much as six feet on the FLAT ground around the outside of the bunker that its really stupid.

As for why they do it, that's simple.  Its less expensive to maintain that way.  No one would deliberately do that if it cost the same to do it right.  Well, at least I sure hope no one would deliberately do it that way!

[Frank M]

The picture above doesn't really demonstrate how thick the grass is, and most of the time, it's longer than shown in this particular picture. 

[Tom_Doak]

Frank:

It is very difficult to build a bunker so that it can be mowed all the way around at fairway height without excessive hand labor.  [UK courses accomplish this by using revetted faces, but replacing the sod walls every 3-5 years is just a different way to spend money on hand labor.]

People always ask why architects don't include more centerline bunkers on our courses, and though I never think to mention it, this is a big reason why not.  Centerline features are either going to cost extra in the maintenance budget, or be improperly maintained ... in which case, why put them in at all?

[Frank M]

Thanks!

[Greg Tallman]

Frank:

It is very difficult to build a bunker so that it can be mowed all the way around at fairway height without excessive hand labor.  [UK courses accomplish this by using revetted faces, but replacing the sod walls every 3-5 years is just a different way to spend money on hand labor.]

People always ask why architects don't include more centerline bunkers on our courses, and though I never think to mention it, this is a big reason why not.  Centerline features are either going to cost extra in the maintenance budget, or be improperly maintained ... in which case, why put them in at all?

Tom, Are you saying a center line bunker with a one yard ribbon of second cut around it ruins the intent?

[Doug Siebert]

I hadn't really thought of a rough collar stopping the ability to "hide" the bunker links-style, as Frank mentions - this is something that requires a pretty flat hole (if there is movement in the land, you could just as easily hide the bunker behind a hill if this is your intent)

Tom's point makes sense though.  Dunno if there is a good way around this, and its too bad because I really do like centerline hazards as a way to get people away from the usual "aim down the middle" and start thinking strategically a bit.  Maybe I'm dreaming, but I think if you expose people to a bit of strategy, they might start thinking about strategy elsewhere over time.  Get enough people thinking about it and the better courses (well, the courses we in GCA consider better ) will get more love, and "championship"/penal/purty courses will not be overrated quite so much.

If they're going to maintain the bunkers with rough anyway, maybe just stick a grass bunker out there instead of a sand bunker?  If its small and not SO long that you have to stomp around for 5 minutes hoping to step on your ball to find it, but have a combination of grass length and sloped faces that make it something testing even for good players.  I know a lot of people here will have an immediate revulsion to this idea, but this is really a fairer test - poor players are a disaster in the sand but can at least chop the ball out of the long grass (they have plenty of experience in rough, after all!)  Unless you have a true pot bunker, which is hard to build in most places in the US, good players don't really care about bunkers if they're hitting a short iron.  But hitting off a 30* sidehill lie out of 7" grass.....yeah, that's going to concern them!

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