[Patrick_Mucci]

Ronald,,

I don't think the "average" viewer watches the Golf Channel, I think they're above average.

As to just having an architect walk around, explaining the course, that won't work, there's not a big enough audience.

But, with two great golfers playing,  a knowledgeable architect commenting on the course, features and intended play options, now that would be the icing on the cake.

I HOPE, that whomever televises the WALKER CUP in 2013, has the BRAINS to have a Macdonaldphile in the broadcast booth, commenting on the golf course.  Now there's a job I'd take without pay.  I'd also ban TEPaul and Wayno Morrisson, not just from the booth, but, from the grounds.  Make that from Long Island for a week before and a week after the matches.

[Kevin_Reilly]

Does it seem that recent matches are more promos than in the past?

Bill:

It doesn't just seem that way.  It was that way, because the host course had to pony up a lot of $$ to host the event.  That's why pretty much all of the modern courses were real estate golf courses and/or resorts.  (I don't know how Sunningdale and Winged Foot slipped in.)  If there were any exceptions, it would be because one of the players only agreed to play on condition that they host it at one of HIS courses.

What a wonderful world!

It has to be a corporate boondoggle because I went to the Miller - Nicklaus match at Olympic and Shell brought in bus loads of people for the event.  I want to say they also played the course but can't remember if there was a pro-am.

Callaway was there in force as well...I stood next to Richard Helmstetter. 

I imagine the Callaway folks wanted to exit quickly as their man Johnny played so poorly.

[Carl Rogers]

SWWoG back when I was 8, 10 or 12 in the early to mid 60's was a very large part of my inroduction to the game.  I did not have any family much less adult influences.

It seems to me that the only way to introduce a larger segment of the "peripheral and casual" golf observer to a course lack let's say Sand Hills. ... also as a way to introduce the larger public to the game that is outside ANGC or US Open model.

How much $$ does it take to send a film crew out to the Midwest?  As the camera strolls down the fairway in between shots discuss the architecture?  Why bother "preparing" the course?  Who cares what they shoot?  How much inconvience is there to course management?  Why do they need to pony up anything?

[Patrick_Mucci]

SWWoG back when I was 8, 10 or 12 in the early to mid 60's was a very large part of my inroduction to the game.  I did not have any family much less adult influences.

It seems to me that the only way to introduce a larger segment of the "peripheral and casual" golf observer to a course lack let's say Sand Hills. ... also as a way to introduce the larger public to the game that is outside ANGC or US Open model.

How much $$ does it take to send a film crew out to the Midwest? 

Plenty.
How about the cost to acquire two big name PGA Tour golfers who will be the "stars" of the show, along with the golf course.

 As the camera strolls down the fairway in between shots discuss the architecture? 

I think most agree on that

Why bother "preparing" the course? 

Ask yourself, if you're the owner of Sand Hills, do you want millions of viewers to see a course not up to today's standards, or, do you want your course to put its best foot forward.  Courses rarely get the opportunity to be "on stage" for an hour, so when the opportunity presents itself, you want the course in GREAT condition, playing as it was intended to play.


Who cares what they shoot? 

The viewers,  the competitors, the network, the producers and the sponsors just to name a few.

How much inconvience is there to course management? 

How about the inconvenience to the dues paying members who enjoy a rather limited season.
Have you ever seen what it takes to prepare a course for a PGA our event ?

Why do they need to pony up anything?

WHo's going to pay for the production costs ?
Who's going to pay the two "name" PGA Tour golfers ?

You need to learn more about club/golf finances
Please call TEPaul at 1-800-Idiot-Savant, it's his special toll free number

[Carl Rogers]

I do have a feel for the mega bucks involved despite having the exact knowledge.

Play the ball and course as it lies. You say it does not work .... I say it has not been tried.  Independent Film & Reality TV plays golf.

The existing "Hollywood" or the "British Royal Family" golf paridigm is the one that creates all the problems.  I am suggesting a different paridigm.  Someone like Geoff Ogilvy or Tom Lehman, on one of their golf courses, may not be that averse to this idea.  Sell DVD's of it.

In looking at the SWWoG at PB back in 1962 with Nicklaus & Snead, I was amazed at the scratchy nature of the turf and semi-unkempt bunker edges.  That did not detract from the golf or the golf course.

Do any of you watch "Globe Trekker" on PBS?  A camera follows an individual low cost under the radar tourist around in all types of locales through out the world?  As a first step, try that out on a practice round?

[Adam Clayman]

Not a bad idea Carl, if you get a pro (or celeb) who is part owner. Isn't that Trumps incentive? He gets his course on the tube where he can then have someone else inform the audience it's the #1 course in the _____ (insert state, country, zip code)

Pat's point about disruption is good one, when considering Sand Hills. But, everybody knows Dick Y. always has that place in top condition.

A solution might be a date when the course in closed and the weather is still good. Second week of October, for instance, or the 2nd week in May. October is likely better, since the Pros are usually not working too much by then.

Jack is an owner at Dismal River, I bet they'd love the op.

[Mac Plumart]

Shell's Wonderful World of Golf at Dismal River...BABY!!!!  That would be really, really cool.  Chris, hook it up!!!  It would be so cool because the land out there (and therefore the course) is so different than most of the US courses.  Heck, maybe the world.


Barney vs. Jack Nicklaus.  Oh yeah!!!  

FYI...I am serious on the first part of this post.

[Tim_Cronin]

Ronald,,

I don't think the "average" viewer watches the Golf Channel, I think they're above average.

As to just having an architect walk around, explaining the course, that won't work, there's not a big enough audience.

But, with two great golfers playing,  a knowledgeable architect commenting on the course, features and intended play options, now that would be the icing on the cake.

I HOPE, that whomever televises the WALKER CUP in 2013, has the BRAINS to have a Macdonaldphile in the broadcast booth, commenting on the golf course.  Now there's a job I'd take without pay.  I'd also ban TEPaul and Wayno Morrisson, not just from the booth, but, from the grounds.  Make that from Long Island for a week before and a week after the matches.

Patrick, good luck with getting quality course commentary on the Walker Cup. When it was at Chicago Golf a few years ago, NBC (via Golf Channel) commentators said barely a word about the architectural wonder that the course features. Looked great on TV (and better in person), but it might as well have been a muni down the street as the commentary went.

[Brad Klein]

There's a wonderful little book about the show and its origins: Al Barkow, "Gene Sarazen and Shell's Wonderful World of Golf," (Clock Tower Press, 2003). It documents how demanding the production schedule was all over the world and how so much of the tone of the show that folks here appreciate was set by Herbert Warren Wind, who was the show's original writer after he left "Sports Illustrated" and had rejoined "The New Yorker." 

[Bruce Wellmon]

Is the show still in production or has it effectively been replaced by Trump's GC Show?

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Shell has removed the former website of WWOG so it's safe to assume that it is out of production as there have been no episodes produced since 2003.

Maybe Hyundai should take over the series. 

[Mike Benham]

Callaway was there in force as well...I stood next to Richard Helmstetter. 

I imagine the Callaway folks wanted to exit quickly as their man Johnny played so poorly.

Miller hit the ball pretty well that day, it was his putting that was a train wreck. 

Perhaps after his putting display, the Callaway folks were convinced they needed a new putter line which led to their purchase of Odyssey Golf ....

[Tim Gavrich]

I always get excited when I see a rerun of SWWoG on the Golf Channel for the reasons everyone else has enumerated in the foregoing posts.  All I can add is another show to consider as a potential vehicle for exposure of GCA to the Golf Channel viewer: "Playing Lessons from the Pros."  I have noticed that the more recent versions of the show have added a celebrity playing alongside the pro, which is a savvy move on the part of the producers: drums up a bit more interests at probably not much higher a cost to the producers (methinks a lot of mid-level celebrities would not require too much payment for the opportunity to hang out with a Tour player).  I wish they would say a little bit more about the golf courses during the show, but I guess there's not much space for it in a half hour?  I don't know, it seems like it would be a natural fit to include at least a bit more about architecture in "Playing Lessons from the Pros," especially if SWWoG is not due to come back soon or ever, most regrettably.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Steve I second Bob's thank you for putting up the list. Tom, I cannot imagine NewOrleans CC, Champions or Houston CC putting up anything more than food and beverages. The idea Shell would use it for entertainment is for sure. I loved the series and do hope something like it comes back.Maybe the Golf Channel can do it rather than the endless silly shows like The Haney Project teaching fools to play golf.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Yesterday, being confied to quarters, since I have stomach virus/flu that just won't go away, I watched SWWOG

A match between Watson and Irwin was on, played at Jasna Polana, which Gary Player designed.
Gary Player provided the commentary and other than on just a few occassions, didn't talk much about the architecture.

Tom Doak's suggestion that the consulting/designing architect be involved is a good one, but this match presented an opportunity lost as very little in the way of architectural discussions were engaged in.

Ron Whitten called Jasna Polana a "modern day" Winged Foot, which boggles the mind if you've ever played it.

It's not my favorite golf golf course, although I do have a sentimental attachment to it since I held the course record, even though I had two (2) double bogies from inside 90 yards.  And, Rich Lerner said a shot I hit on # 3 was the greatest shot he had ever seen.

But, the course has an uncomfortable feel to it, whether it's caused by land constraints or just bad design, there are a number of awkward holes, starting at # 1.

What's amazing is how good courses can look from aerial views.
It would seem easy to insert architectural comments during each hole's fly over

It would have been so easy to insert architectural content, straight from the horses mouth, during the telecast.

When I think of some great courses that SWWOG could be televised from, I think of Wild Horse, BPB, Bandon's courses, Sand Hills, Colorado Club, Hidden Creek, Ballyneal and many, many more.

I would think that the most difficult aspect of the production is getting two PGA Tour Pros, so it would seem to be an off season production unless Shell would be willing to be generous with appearance fees.  Then, Monday's or Tuesday's during season would be available.

[Tim Leahy]

It would be fun to see a SWWOG at Rustic Canyon!

[Kyle Henderson]

Was Mr. Player truly the responsible architect?

I've noted several SWWOG episodes in which the architects were present at the match but only given a short interview between shots (Pete Dye, Art Hills, Bob Cupp, etc.). I like the idea of having them narrate the hole flyovers.

Perhaps they could bring the series back using more LPGA players, since they now have so few regular tournaments.

It would be a great way to highlight newer, underexposed courses. Are the rights to the format owned by Nicklaus Productions or Shell?

A match between Watson and Irwin was on, played at Jasna Polana, which Gary Player designed.
Gary Player provided the commentary and other than on just a few occassions, didn't talk much about the architecture.

Tom Doak's suggestion that the consulting/designing architect be involved is a good one, but this match presented an opportunity lost as very little in the way of architectural discussions were engaged in.

[Mike Benham]

Perhaps they could bring the series back using more LPGA players, since they now have so few regular tournaments.

Hmmm, Kyle my dear friend, if the economics of the LPGA tour are producing fewer and fewer tournaments, especially in the USA, why would SWWoG featuring women, be successful?

If anything, the demographics of the Women's Professional Tour suggests that if SWWoG were to have a female cast, it would likely be produced overseas and would not include any American players ...

[Bill_McBride]

Perhaps they could bring the series back using more LPGA players, since they now have so few regular tournaments.

Hmmm, Kyle my dear friend, if the economics of the LPGA tour are producing fewer and fewer tournaments, especially in the USA, why would SWWoG featuring women, be successful?

If anything, the demographics of the Women's Professional Tour suggests that if SWWoG were to have a female cast, it would likely be produced overseas and would not include any American players ...

I would watch Paula Creamer vs Natalie Gulbis.  Until I dozed off.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Was Mr. Player truly the responsible architect?

YES

I've noted several SWWOG episodes in which the architects were present at the match but only given a short interview between shots (Pete Dye, Art Hills, Bob Cupp, etc.). I like the idea of having them narrate the hole flyovers.

Perhaps they could bring the series back using more LPGA players, since they now have so few regular tournaments.

I wouldn't be interested in watching an LPGA match unless it was an extraordinary golf course

It would be a great way to highlight newer, underexposed courses. Are the rights to the format owned by Nicklaus Productions or Shell?

A match between Watson and Irwin was on, played at Jasna Polana, which Gary Player designed.
Gary Player provided the commentary and other than on just a few occassions, didn't talk much about the architecture.

Tom Doak's suggestion that the consulting/designing architect be involved is a good one, but this match presented an opportunity lost as very little in the way of architectural discussions were engaged in.

[Tom_Doak]

When I lived in Britain, there was a show which did a much better job than the Shell series of showing off great courses ... it was called "A Round With Alliss".  Peter Alliss would play nine holes with someone (more often celebrities than pro golfers) on a different course each time.  There wasn't a lot of architectural commentary, but you got a decent look at a lot of good courses that were out of the mainstream.

[David_Tepper]

"I wouldn't be interested in watching an LPGA match unless it was an extraordinary golf course"

Pat Mucci -

I find your comment more than a little bit curious, especially given how often you have stated that golf and golf courses should not be viewed in the context of PGA Tour play.

Given that LPGA golfers do not carry the ball as far, do not hit it as high and do not put as much spin on their shots as their PGA counterparts, would you not agree that the game they play interacts far more with the architecture of a golf course? If one was seriously interested in viewing how the architecture of a golf course impacts play, wouldn't that be more clear watching an LPGA golfer play a course than a PGA golfer play the same course? In addition, would it not be a little closer to how most of us might play that course?

DT

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

David nice point of how the LPGA golfers works with the architecture more than the PGA counterparts.

[Sam Morrow]

I think often times we sell the LPGA players short, they still play a game that 99.999% of us would not recognize.

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