Why Do Courses Have To Be Innovative?

[JNC Lyon]

The Tobacco Road thread got me thinking about this question.  Should we try to build courses that are strategic, fun, and reminiscent of the classic courses? Does an obsession with "innovation" move architects away from the traditions of the game that are so valuable?

Personally, I would like to see a modern course designer lay out a course like Brora.

[Sean_A]

John

It is clear that the very concept of innovation is up for grabs and despite what many archies may want to believe, in architectural terms, innovative may very well mean using concepts from the Golden Age well today.  We could start with building easily walkable courses as an "innovation".  It seems that these days archies are willing to slap in those 150 yard walks because of the visuals.  Thats fine once in a while if the hole is really dramatically improved, but even on the wonder gems of today these are tough walks compared to the great courses of yester-year.  I spose what I am asking is for archies to have the balls to leave wlll enough alone rather than trying to prove they are worth the fee and to start by designing for a 3.5 hour game. 

Ciao 

[Jaeger Kovich]

When more courses are closing than opening, something is obviously wrong. What makes you think you can do the same thing and succeed?

Maybe its not innovation, its just trying to be different and the rest is marketing.

[Kyle Harris]

When more courses are closing than opening, something is obviously wrong. What makes you think you can do the same thing and succeed?

Maybe its not innovation, its just trying to be different and the rest is marketing.

Not sure I agree with the conclusion that more courses closing than opening means something is wrong.

I think the opposite could be argued just as effectively - insomuch that more courses opening than closing could mean something is wrong too.

[JNC Lyon]

When more courses are closing than opening, something is obviously wrong. What makes you think you can do the same thing and succeed?

Maybe its not innovation, its just trying to be different and the rest is marketing.

Jaeger,

Maybe many of these courses are doing the same thing, but they might be doing the same WRONG thing.  I see a lot of expensive modern courses where architects moved a ton of earth and relied on water and aesthetics.  This is neither innovative nor good.  Building a course like Brora today would not necessarily be innovative, but it certainly would not be the same thing that other architects are doing.

I agree with Kyle as well.  If course are opening in droves, that means that many of these golf courses are being mass produced and are missing both originality and tradition.

[James Boon]

John,

I suspect a lot of talk of innovation comes from the course architects who see other creative types constantly changing, adapting and being innovative and see that golf courses design is generally always looking backwards? Having said that, building architecture, music, fashion etc are always looking backwards but then other things from outside, be it new materials, computers or peoples expectations mean that there can be a strand of that creative industry that is pushing the boundaries.

I recall touching on this in another thread recently, but there doesn't appear to be much that is currently influencing golf course architecture that could push it to being innovative? Sure there are constant aesthetic changes, and courses are being lengthened to cope with technology, but there isn't anything really innovative coming from outside? Perhaps that means there are golf course architects out there who wish they were in a position to be more innovative and yet we are currently in a position where the looking back in time for influence from the golden age is pretty much the norm, and some wish they could put there own times stamp on things?

In 100 years time (or at the moment for that matter) will we be able to tell the difference between a course designed and built today and yet influenced by the golden age, rather than one built in the golden age, without in depth archeology? It may not be in all cases, but there are certainly enough buildings around at present that are totally different from one built back in the 1930s, to be able to tell which ones are of their own time?

Personally I don't think we need to be massivly innovative, and that courses (or buildings, or music etc) can be designed that are rooted in their own time but influenced by the past, without the massive need for innovation. But there is no harm with there being a group who are pushing the boundaries with their design, that can then filter down to the rest, its just in the current economic times, who will take those risks?

Cheers,

James

[Brett_Morrissy]

In regard to innovation, I believe it is troublesome to draw on design or creative mediums, like music, fashion, art or building architecture, as there are no rules apart from perhaps gravity that need to abided by in these forms, and new discoveries in materials can readily be incorporated and drive innovation.

Clearly, this is the defining element in course design, that it's intended use is for a game bound by strict and traditional set of rules.

In other sports, innovation is driven thru a rule change that can allow a change to the playing arena or playing equipment.

Perhaps innovation could be let loose, if the course was for viewing, appreciation and interpreting only??
- what would today's GCA's do if their designs were intended not for play - but purely to be walked and appreciated, discovered and studied?

Thinking of other mediums for golf course architecture, paintings, drawings, photography, even video games - these are open to much greater and wider innovative techniques, and do sometimes stretch the "rules", but that doesn't matter does it, because we do not have to play golf on a beautiful water colour, just appreciate it! A simple black and white photo is manipulating nature, and can be viewed as a form of innovation, do the rules allow for us to wear 3D glasses? Or perhaps just rose colored glasses...?

So, as long as we have 34 rules governing the playing arena, then innovation will always be severely hamstrung, IMO.

[Carl Rogers]

Strantz ..... I am trying to convince some friends to take a trip to Tobacco Road, but I have played Royal New Kent multiple times.
I have found playing at RNK a bit tedious.  I only want to play it once or twice a year.  .... I agree with most about it's strengths and weaknesses.

I am having a hard deciding about the "innovation element" of the course versus the "I am tired of doing the same old, same old ... let's do something different" or "separate himself from the GCA field, market wise".  It may take me a while to work through this.