Recovery values in GCA...

[Mike_Young]

I just came back from a golf trip for a few days where I played some three great golf courses....Olympia Fields, Northshore  and Beverly. I enjoyed all immensely.  12 of us played OF and it was obvious to me that the higher handicappers were really having a difficult time with the rough.  This was not extremely high rough but a really good consistent rough.  .  the course was a blast; the bunkers were good and the condition was good.  But one thing became obvious to me....recovery shots.... With the new strands of grass , irrigation and fertilization the roughs have become brutal on our golf courses......a five inch rough of 15 years ago may be an easier rough than a three inch rough today. 
So here is my dilemma ....on many courses today a good player would be better to miss it in the bunker than in the rough....that should not be IMHO....golf may not be fair but such a situation ruins the strategy of our golf courses....same goes for shots around the green....bunkers are not feared....there is less penalty than the surrounding rough.....if it weren't for the contrast in color of the sand and grass then strategy would be best served by growing a longer grass int he bunkers themselves and forgetting sand....
While you guys are teaching TD and JN...tell me what you would do....has rough been the main culprit in changing the strategies of many of the ODG courses...

[Don_Mahaffey]

Capping the sprinklers in the rough would be a good start. We know that will not happen at clubs that need to be pretty, but that is by far the easiest, most sensible approach. Making the bunkers more difficult will only make it even more penal for the 10+ hdcp. Making one feature harder to keep things in the proper order is not the answer.

[Lou_Duran]

Back in the late 1960s or early '70s, Ralph Plummer noted that rather than length, the best, most economical way one could control scores on the PGA Tour was to tighten the fairways and grow the rough for the week of the tournament.  Then the superintendent could go back to the normal fairway widths and lower/thinner roughs for the remainder of the year.  It seems that with modern irrigation systems and better control of fertilization that this should be relatively easy to accomplish.  However, what if the clubs and the members prefer playing the tour setup course?

As to changing of strategies in old courses, perhaps trees have as much to do as the rough, considering that groove and wedge technology has improved greatly and these guys are hitting it 350 yards.

What did you think of the greens at Beverly?  I thought the members were a bunch of masochists.

[Jason Topp]

I don't think the data supports the idea that bunkers are a better alternative than rough, even today.  I would need to do research to re-confirm this but my recollection is that tour players are far more accurate from the rough than they are from a bunker.

[Adam Clayman]

Mike, I wouldn't classify it as changing the strategies, but, I would say that the proliferation of long rough  into lines of play has made it a lot less of a fun sport.

This has subsequently caused many to realize their inadequacies and they give up the game. Versus the olden days, when the golfer was given a chance to recover, without breaking their wrists and severely damaging their egos and fun-o-meters.

To me, this is at the heart of recent the loss of interest in the sport. I say recent, because I'm under the impression that golf grew and grew until proliferation of the irrigation systems and CCFAD's.

[Mike_Young]

Adam,
I think for good players that intentionally miss for bunkers instead of rough it changes the strategy.  You often hear of good players wishing their miss in a greenside bunker rather than rough...as you say...this all can be blamed on aesthetics taking a front seat to playability....or as you also say..irrigation and fertilizer.

[Jud_T]

Mike,

You make an excellent point.  One caveat re-your visit.  We've had the wettest spring on record since 1895 in the metro Chicago area.  I noticed the rough at Lawsonia was even much gnarlier than usual.  But that doesn't diminish your larger point about irrigation and aesthetics vs. playability.  Hopefully today's economic realities will help fix the problem.

[Adam Clayman]

Mike, I agree with your comment although, wishing a ball gets into a bunker on a miss, isn't really strategy. The Open at Pinehurst should illuminate some of the flaws in mindsets. Let's hope anyway.

[Mike_Young]

Mike, I agree with your comment although, wishing a ball gets into a bunker on a miss, isn't really strategy. The Open at Pinehurst should illuminate some of the flaws in mindsets. Let's hope anyway.

Adam,
I.m not sure bout that.  I know several tour pros that have told me they will plan for their miss to be in the bunker vs a high rough....example..uphill shot to a left pin over a bunker with tall rought around the green and green sloping toward fairway....

[Adam Clayman]

Ben Hogan use to put it in a bunker on purpose, too. I forget the hole but it does illustrate how strategy is different for different folks. In the case of Hogan, I recall it was the severity of the green that made him do it. I'm not sure if the severity of the rough is as justifiable but either way, it takes brains and balls to pull it off.