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Padraig Dooley

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Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« on: November 04, 2010, 11:59:06 AM »

http://www.irishgolfdesk.com/news-files/2010/11/4/golf-digest-irelands-top-100-ranking-2010.html

More rankings!!

The reality is there is only one ranking that matters, you like to play the course or you don't!

However there is always a bit of fun discussing a list. This one has had a lot of movement since last year with some established courses Donegal, Dooks and Nairn and Portnoo taking some big jumps. Some of the newer developments have taken some slides backwards as well.
There are painters who transform the sun to a yellow spot, but there are others who with the help of their art and their intelligence, transform a yellow spot into the sun.
  - Pablo Picasso

Ken Kearney

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2010, 12:27:23 PM »
Padraig... got back from your travels safely ...
These listings are worthless.
Discuss... what has happened at Murvagh GC that they have moved +30 places??? I love the course...
Killarney -9 places. This is interesting in light of the profile of the course and in particular since the irish Open... when the course played great. The pros liked it ... not that this is a great recommendation !!!!
I am delighted to see Carlow on the up +8... wonderful golf course and the club is making efforts to restore much of the "natural areas"... good for them and to be applauded. Much of Tom Simpson's hand has been lost over the years but nonetheless a superb game of golf...
Galway Bay  ... new at 89... get yourself up West to play it... after 3 renovations it is now fantastic... super golf, although it is always blowing a gale... which doesnt bother a 5'10 16 stone guy....

KK
KK.

Jud_T

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2010, 12:43:17 PM »
TEC over Ballybunion?!  I think we need an Irish version of the rearrange these 10 courses thread.....
Golf is a game. We play it. Somewhere along the way we took the fun out of it and charged a premium to be punished.- - Ron Sirak

Matt_Ward

Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2010, 12:46:05 PM »
Can those who have played it numerous times explain to me what is the big deal with The European Club ?

I played it twice and frankly I don't see the magic that I guess so many others see.

It's brawny but far from compelling -- certainly not in the same remote league as the other gems of The Emerald Isle.

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2010, 12:50:21 PM »
Ken,

Murvagh moved up 30 places because it was clearly misplaced last year...

Full rankings:

1. Royal County Down (+1)
2. Portmarnock  (-1)
3. Royal Portrush (+1)
4. The European Club (-1)
5. Ballybunion (Old) (=)
6. Waterville (=)
7. Lahinch  (+1)
8. Adare (-1)
9. Co. Louth (Baltray) (=)
10. Tralee (+1)
11. Co. Sligo (+5)
12. The Island  (+6)
13. Mount Juliet  (-1)
14. Killeen Castle (NEW)
15. The K Club (Palmer Course) (-5)
16. Ballyliffin (Glashedy Links) (-1)
17. Enniscrone  (+3)
18. Royal Dublin (-5)
19. Donegal (Murvagh Links) (+30)
20. Portstewart (Strand) (+4)
21. Rosapenna (Sandy Hills) (-4)
22. Lough Erne (NEW)
23. Killarney (Killeen Course)  (-9)
24. Carlow  (+8)
25. Belmullet (Carne) (-4)
26. Seapoint  (+1)
27. Druids Glen  (-5)
28. Castlerock (=)
29. Cork  (+8)
30. Carton House (Montgomerie Course)  (-4)
31. Portmarnock Links (-6)
32. Ballyliffin (Old Links)  (+6)
33. Rossapenna (Old Tom Morris) (NEW)
34. The K Club (Smurfit Course) (+6)
35. Portsalon  (+10)
36. Doonbeg Links  (-2)
37. Dooks (+30)
38. Powerscourt (West) (NEW)
39. Concra Wood  (NEW)
40. Headfort (New) (-10)
41. Malone (-8)
42. Slieve Russell (-6)
43. Belvoir Park (-8)
44. Royal Portrush (The Valley) (NEW)
45. Westport (-2)
46.Dun Laoghaire (-7)
47. The Old Head of Kinsale (-18)
48. Farnham Estate (NEW)
49. Luttrellstown  (NEW)
50. Dundalk (-2)
51. Narin and Portnoo (+29)
52. Carton House (O'Meara Course) (-5)
53. Tullamore (+6)
54. Palmerstown Stud (-23)
55. Druids Heath (NEW)
56. Connemara (+2)
57. Hermitage (-5)
58. Tramore (-4)
59. Bunclody (NEW)
60. Glasson (-14)
61. Portumna (NEW)
62. Arklow (+21)
63 Powerscourt (East) (-22)
64. Killarney Golf and Fishing (Lackabane) (NEW)
65. Dromoland Castle (-12)
66. Kilkenny (-9)
67. Rathsallagh (-17)
68. Ardglass (NEW)
69. Clandeboye (-7)
70. Bantry Bay (-15)
71 St. Annes (NEW)
72. Shannon (-4)
73. Royal Belfast (-2)
74. Castlemartyr (NEW)
75. Courtown (NEW)
76. Mount Wolseley (-34)
77. Balbriggan (NEW)
78. Mullingar (-22)
79. Knightsbrook (-35)
80. Castle (-14)
81. Galway (+1)
82. Galgorm Castle (+8)
83. Strandhill (NEW)
84. Grange (-19)
85. Castletroy (+4)
86. Laytown and Bettystown (-2)
87. Skellig Bay (-13)
88. Ashbourne (-3)
89. Galway Bay (NEW)
90. Athlone (-14)
91. Ballinrobe (+5)
92. Faithlegg (NEW)
93. Ballybunion (Cashen) (-6)
94. Blainroe (+1)
95. Woodbrook (-26)
96. Letterkenny (NEW)
97. Curragh (-5)
98. Rosslare (-22)
99. Esker Hills (-24)
100. Roganstown (-27)

Ken Kearney

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2010, 01:32:41 PM »
Ally,
That explains Murvagh I suppose...

Brian,
I dont agree with you on Montgomerie... its a big course for sure... wouldnt say that it is uninteresting though IMHO. Montgomerie is too long for most golfers and even off the medal tees many of the fairway bunkers are lacking strategy. They are just too far from the tee to even consider taking the challenge. Most of the fairway bunkers are located at the doglegs but rather than being tempted to take on the angle most golfers must play away from the bunkers. The course plays better from the forward tees. So maybe your observations are actaully correct but the solution is quite simple. I suggest that the "style" of the Montgomerie is wrong...
I dont agree that Ireland doesnt do inland golf courses ... there are many wonderful golf courses to play inland.... Carlow GC to mention one. Ireland doesnt do "heathland" for sure...

KK

KK.

Tommy Williamsen

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2010, 01:39:33 PM »
What is striking is that there are only about 300 courses in Ireland.  The quality is pretty high.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Simon Holt

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2010, 03:27:51 PM »
I don't know that much about golf in Ireland but I am glad to see the Valley course did well and very surprised it is listed as new.  I really enjoyed it and look forward to playing all the other courses on the list if the Valley is anything to go by.

Anything that comes near Dunluce and RCD must be amazing as I was blown away by them.
2011 highlights- Royal Aberdeen, Loch Lomond, Moray Old, NGLA (always a pleasure), Muirfield Village, Saucon Valley, watching the new holes coming along at The Renaissance Club.

JNC Lyon

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2010, 03:50:23 PM »
Can those who have played it numerous times explain to me what is the big deal with The European Club ?

I played it twice and frankly I don't see the magic that I guess so many others see.

It's brawny but far from compelling -- certainly not in the same remote league as the other gems of The Emerald Isle.

Be careful what you say about European Club--Pat Ruddy might threaten you with legal action!  :o
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Kevin Pallier

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2010, 05:44:35 PM »
I am glad to see the Valley course did well and very surprised it is listed as new.

I concur Simon - how was it missed ?

Matt_Ward

Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2010, 06:01:45 PM »
JNC:

I meant what I said -- I'd like to hear from those who really see The European Club as being one of Ireland's supreme best courses.

I played it twice and it totally escaped me.

Solid.

Yes.

In the same league with the others just above and below it -- no.

Matthew Hunt

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2010, 06:08:36 PM »
Good to see RCD at number 1 where it belongs! ;) Can't understand who would say the K Club is better than Loch Erne?

Mark Pearce

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2010, 06:23:45 PM »
Matt,

Being very careful what I say, I suspect you are asking the wrong audience for an explanation of what makes TEC worth its ranking.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Tony_Muldoon

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2010, 07:07:05 PM »
Waterville seems to have a fair few knockers but anyone who played it this summer will agree that it deserves at least this high a ranking...

To each his own but..I did and I don't.  Have photo's but they loaded small and I will try and sort.



Nice to see Arlow, Dooks and the Valley shooting up.


TEC over Lahinch?  Can't see it.
Let's make GCA grate again!

JNC Lyon

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #14 on: November 04, 2010, 09:13:01 PM »
JNC:

I meant what I said -- I'd like to hear from those who really see The European Club as being one of Ireland's supreme best courses.

I played it twice and it totally escaped me.

Solid.

Yes.

In the same league with the others just above and below it -- no.

Matt,

I am glad you are being frank, as you always are, about European Club.  I have not seen the course, so I will withhold judgment.  I am just glad to see that people on here are not afraid of criticizing TEC on this site.
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Jack_Marr

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #15 on: November 04, 2010, 09:17:19 PM »
Tony

I like TEC a lot, but, personally, I think Lahinch is far better, with more charm and more quality. I'm not expert, though. Glad to see Arklow and Strandhill moving up.

John
« Last Edit: November 04, 2010, 09:19:07 PM by Jack_Marr »
John Marr(inan)

Bill Gayne

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #16 on: November 04, 2010, 09:38:22 PM »
The ranking is based on the opinions of a panel of ten. With such a small number of rankers a couple of outlier opinions can really impact an average.

SELECTION PANEL: Pádraig Ó hUiginn (chairman), Declan Branigan (course designer/ agronomist), Mark Gannon (RA selector), Garth McGimpsey (former Walker Cup captain), Michael McCumiskey (Irish PGA secretary), John Quigley (Irish Association of Golf Club Secretaries), Eddie Connaughton (agromonist)*, Kate McCann (Curtis Cup)*, Valerie Hassett (Curtis Cup)*, Cecil Whelan (Links Society founder)*, Ally McIntosh (course designer and writer)*.


Bill Brightly

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #17 on: November 04, 2010, 10:54:56 PM »
RCD #1 is fine, but I just don't get Portmarnock ahead of Ballybunion and Portrush. Portmarnock is very nice, but I just don't see it in the same class as the other two, and I'd put it right behind Waterville and Lahinch.

I also don't see how Glasheedy is better that Ballyliffin Old. Not even close, IMO.

Dónal Ó Ceallaigh

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #18 on: November 05, 2010, 05:05:41 AM »
Can anyone explain why the Heritage dropped from 19th to nowhere in the space of a year? Is it in receivership?
Also what's the story with Luttrellstown entering at 49th? It's been around for a number of years, so what magic did they do to the course to warrant elevation to 49th place?  ??? The last I heard, it was closing down.

Were all the courses in Ireland played by at least one member (but not necessarily the same member) of the panel?
Did they consider history, tradition, etc. as they did in the past?

Is there a pattern where new courses come in very high at first and then gradually descend down the list, only to gradually ascend in later years.

Laytown and Bettystown deserves to be there, but I think Dunfanaghy is worthy of inclusion.

It's surprising to see so many parkland courses ahead of very solid courses such as Malone and Belvoir Park. Perhaps, as Ken wrote, Ireland does afterall "do" parkland quite well.

The whole ranking thing is a lot of nonsense in my opinion, but I guess it gives us something to write about.

Isn't Eddie Connaughton (agromonist) also an architect? Didn't he add the new holes at Nairn & Portnoo?

Jack_Marr

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #19 on: November 05, 2010, 05:09:38 AM »
Good to see RCD at number 1 where it belongs! ;) Can't understand who would say the K Club is better than Loch Erne?

Hi Matthew

I don't rate the K Club very highly either. Have you played it?

I prefer the newer course there, as artificial as it is.

John
John Marr(inan)

Jack_Marr

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #20 on: November 05, 2010, 05:12:23 AM »
Can anyone explain why the Heritage dropped from 19th to nowhere in the space of a year? Is it in receivership?
Also what's the story with Luttrellstown entering at 49th? It's been around for a number of years, so what magic did they do to the course to warrant elevation to 49th place?  ??? The last I heard, it was closing down.

Were all the courses in Ireland played by at least one member (but not necessarily the same member) of the panel?
Did they consider history, tradition, etc. as they did in the past?

Is there a pattern where new courses come in very high at first and then gradually descend down the list, only to gradually ascend in later years.

Laytown and Bettystown deserves to be there, but I think Dunfanaghy is worthy of inclusion.

It's surprising to see so many parkland courses ahead of very solid courses such as Malone and Belvoir Park. Perhaps, as Ken wrote, Ireland does afterall "do" parkland quite well.

The whole ranking thing is a lot of nonsense in my opinion, but I guess it gives us something to write about.

Isn't Eddie Connaughton (agromonist) also an architect? Didn't he add the new holes at Nairn & Portnoo?

Luttrelstown has been done up in recent years. It was going to close down, but they've decided to keep it going now. I think it's a pretty solid parkland, for Ireland anyway. I don't know about the Heritage. I believe they are in administration or receivership.
John Marr(inan)

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #21 on: November 05, 2010, 05:42:56 AM »
Donal,

Eddie is indeed an architect as well as agronomist.

The panel was given an overhaul this year. I think the change in position is quite a relevant number for 2010 because of it.

Consistent complaints I've been hearing from general Irish golfers:

- Why are links courses so prominent?
- Why are Doonbeg & Old Head so low?
- General discontent about why 'x' parkland in the 50-100 range has dropped 'y' places and is so far behind course 'z'

The two highest new entries were genuinely new courses. Both are worthy of fairly high positions.

Other Top-50 new entries such as Portrush Valley, Rosapenna Old Tom and Powerscourt West were missed in previous years and have now correctly been identified for their quality.

The magazine took a call (as in every year previous) to exclude courses in receivership. It just had a much bigger effect this year.

Cristian

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #22 on: November 05, 2010, 06:20:38 AM »
RCD #1 is fine, but I just don't get Portmarnock ahead of Ballybunion and Portrush. Portmarnock is very nice, but I just don't see it in the same class as the other two, and I'd put it right behind Waterville and Lahinch.

I also don't see how Glasheedy is better that Ballyliffin Old. Not even close, IMO.

+1

How can anybody prefer bulldozered fairways over some of the most beautiful naturally contoured fairways one can find anywhere?!

Jonathan Cummings

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #23 on: November 05, 2010, 07:17:02 AM »
Geez - I agree with Matt.  The Euro Club is ridiculously high.  Above Waterville????  Above Lahinch??!!??  JC

jeffwarne

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Re: Golf Digest Ireland Top 100 2010
« Reply #24 on: November 05, 2010, 09:54:37 AM »
Seeing Narin and Portnoo at 51st (up 29 spots no less) makes me want to get on a plane and play the 50 rated ahead of it!!!


The list seems actually pretty good in my opinion in most cases (I haven't played the European Club)
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

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