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Simon Holt

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Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« on: September 29, 2010, 04:58:27 PM »
I played the Dunluce and Valley on Thursday and then RCD on Friday.

I loved the Dunluce and really enjoyed the Valley, then RCD blew my mind on Friday.  The question was posed over dinner that night and after some deliberation I think I might go for the Dunluce but purely because I felt the balance of RCD might have been a little in favour of the front 9....but then I felt that 17 and 18 at Portrush felt like they let the other 16 holes down.  Help!!

RCD was the best conditioned links course I have ever played, the greens were the best condition of ANY course I have played world wide and the first 6 holes were perhaps the best opening stretch I have ever played.  Lots of 'ever played' means I should have liked it more right?

What's with the water on the back 9 at RCD?  Too many blind shots?  I loved it but felt that after 6 holes it was the best course in the world- then I didn't think that at the end.  Am I alone??  Help me out guys! 

2011 highlights- Royal Aberdeen, Loch Lomond, Moray Old, NGLA (always a pleasure), Muirfield Village, Saucon Valley, watching the new holes coming along at The Renaissance Club.

Patrick Glynn

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2010, 05:10:31 PM »
RCD blows Portrush out of the water.

Went north expecting to prefer Portrush since I had heard it was a great driving golf course. RCD is just amazing and to echo Simon's comments - RCD is just in amazing condition. Greens were pure, course was firm and the bunkers are really special.

Tommy Williamsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2010, 05:15:29 PM »
RCD is my absolute favorite course.  I really like The Dunluce Course, but I would play TCD before any course I have played, including Pine Valley and Cypress Point.  That says a lot because those two are about as good as it gets.  The first time I played RCD and got to the top of the hill on 9, I was hooked.  #18 didn't bother me as much as it does some, because by then I was saturated for all the great golf holes I had played.

If you go there, though, take a caddy.  I didn't the first time and found the going very difficult off the tee.  I don't think I broke 90.  The second time I shot 78 with a caddy who babysat me all the way around.
Where there is no love, put love; there you will find love.
St. John of the Cross

"Deep within your soul-space is a magnificent cathedral where you are sweet beyond telling." Rumi

Cristian

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2010, 05:16:30 PM »
Interesting thread. The vast majority of people seem to think that RCD is the better course, but I have found if you talk to people from (Northern) Ireland the split-up is much more towards fifty-fifty. I am not sure why.

FWIW: I am a Portrush man. Since I drove up from Belfast airport ten years ago and drove over the hill for a first peek of the course(s) I have never seen a sight in golf that comes close. I find it difficult to differentiate between the two, but if I had to think out loud, I would say that Portrush is probably rawer, even more exposed to wind and therefore even firmer, while RCD is more intimate, and esthetically superior. Probably both the best and worst holes on both courses are mostly on RCD. (Maybe this explains in part the higher % of Portrush fans among those who know the courses better.)

I would like to hear a more educated opinion as I have only played each twice on the same day (but not on one day of course).

Simon Holt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2010, 05:31:06 PM »
Cristian

I think I am with you on the landscape at Portrush- it really is special dunescape and that run 4,5,6 is pretty hard to beat.  It is much more demanding off the tee as the rough is so dense just off the fw.   having said that I was lucky not to be in a bunker for all 36 holes at RCD so that might have changed my opinion...one look at them and you didnt have to think about where not to be on that course!

The scenery at RCD seems to be what gets most people I think.  That might be harsh but I think fair- not specifically amongst us here but certainly of the masses.

I thought the 7th at RCD was a bit too penal for a blind hole and that is when I started to question my early thoughts that it was the best course I have ever played.  

We shot 74 in an alternate shot format and thought the place was hard.  I had a great partner and all the way was thinking 'i wouldn't like to be a high handicapper with these forced carries and blind shots'.  No way there is a ground game there off most of the tees.

I actually liked the 18th but didn't feel the love for the 14th or 17th.  14 didn't seem to fit the eye and was a bit of a let down after 13 which I loved.  And then 17 seemed bizarre having that water in the fairway even though I believe it is a natural low spot.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2010, 05:33:16 PM by Simon Holt »
2011 highlights- Royal Aberdeen, Loch Lomond, Moray Old, NGLA (always a pleasure), Muirfield Village, Saucon Valley, watching the new holes coming along at The Renaissance Club.

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +2/-1
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2010, 05:35:32 PM »
I have visited both several times since my inaugural trip in 1983 ... Most recently two years ago.  Both are 9's in my book, and I've gone back and forth a couple of times as to which I prefer.  County Down has the most beautiful site in golf, raw golf architecture, and drama on its side.  Portrush has a beautiful site as well, more sophisticated greens, and the Valley course as a killer tiebreaker if the question is not just about the big courses.

Both of them suffer from a weak finish.  County Down has tried architectural modifications to address this; Portrush has gone the other way by tightening fairways and thickening the rough, which has pushed me into the County Down camp ... unless the second course counts.

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2010, 05:38:54 PM »

The Mountain of Mourne gets my vote, spent many years there

Royal County Down
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErjvEZZkTEg

Royal Port Rush is fun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LbYfR8gEg4

But the Mountains of Mourne keeps calling

Melvyn

K. Krahenbuhl

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2010, 05:39:15 PM »
I enjoyed them both A LOT, but I think Royal County Down was easily superior and to this day is one of my favorite courses on the planet.  The front nine might be the best in the world.

Roger Tufts

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2010, 05:39:53 PM »
This is a very interesting debate that I have had with my brother and father a lot since playing these two courses in the Summer of 2007. They both are on another level compared to any other course I have ever played.

The first time I played RCD and got to the top of the hill on 9, I was hooked.

I agree with this statement in full. When I got the opportunity to play RCD, I thought that holes 1-6 were amazing, as the OP stated. However my true obsession didn't begin until #9. I had never (hard to believe, I know) seen pictures of the 9th hole, and my caddy told me to simply aim at the steeple on top of the Slieve Donard, so I did and fired away. I had no clue walking up that fairway what my eyes would behold upon the hills' crest, and I almost fainted. It was, and remains to be, the best golf hole I have ever played.

Since I drove up from Belfast airport ten years ago and drove over the hill for a first peek of the course(s) I have never seen a sight in golf that comes close.

I also agree completely with this statement. I played Portrush before playing RCD, and upon walking up the first fairway at Portrush I immediately knew that the golf course I was playing was so far beyond anything I had experienced before. Holes 1-6 of Portrush are also a spectacular stretch of golf. Hole 5 is one of the best holes I have played as well; I have a particularly strong memory of taking a picture with my brother and father with the white cliffs and castle ruins in the background off the 5th green, so it is a special spot for me. Hole 14 also remains as probably the best Par 3 I have ever played.

That all being said, I think I enjoyed RCD slightly better. I would like to have another crack at them however, as I played the last 4 holes of RCD in a horrific downpour (more like side-pour...) and was drenched. I was hitting my tee ball no more than 170 yards off the 18th tee, and my round ended quite horribly for a mid-80s score. Quite the contrary, the day I played Portrush could not have been better, and I played fairly well (36 - 42[eesh] for a 78).

I don't really have much of an explanation for my preference, I just felt that RCD was more impressive overall to me. It was a strange comparison as well, because in the summer months a lot of RCD seemed very "brown" (although the good kind of links golf brown, with the heather and gorse and all that...) and Portrush stands out as unbelievably "green" to me. The picture of the first hole fairway in Ran's GCA course profile of Portrush exemplifies how I vision the course in my mind.
Cornell University '11 - Tedesco Country Club - Next Golf Vacation: Summer 2015 @ Nova Scotia & PEI (14 Rounds)

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2010, 05:55:35 PM »
Well, I am neither, but I don't tnink there is anything to choose between the two.  At the end of the day I prefer Portrush because I think the greens are better and more varied than at Co Down.  But I am not sure of this talk of best in the world or even Ireland.  I think Ballybunion easily overshadows either course in terms of quality and variety and I would take Lahinch over the bunch as my favourite.  To be honest, I would take Sligo over either RCD or Portrush as well!  Its a great pity because if Portrush widened their fairways it is a match for any course, but all are outstanding in their own way.  

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2010, 05:59:04 PM »

The Mountain of Mourne gets my vote, spent many years there

Royal County Down
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErjvEZZkTEg

Royal Port Rush is fun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LbYfR8gEg4

But the Mountains of Mourne keeps calling

Melvyn


Oh common Melvyn  SING the praises


Oh Mary this London's a wonderful sight
with the people here working by day and by night
They don't sow potatoes nor barley nor wheat
But there's gangs of them digging for gold in the street
At least when I asked them that's what I was told
So I just took a hand at this digging for gold
But for all that I found there I might as well be
Where the mountains of Mourne sweep down to the sea
.
I believe that when writing a wish you expressed
As to how the fine ladies of London were dressed
Well if you believe me, when asked to a ball
They don't wear a top on their dresses at all
Oh, I've seen them myself, and you couldn't in truth
Say if they were bound for a ball or a bath.
Don't be starting them fashions now Mary Macree
Where the mountains of Mourne sweep down to the sea
.
I've seen England's king from the top of a bus
I never knew him, though he means to know us;
And though by the saxon we once were oppressed
Still I cheered-God forgive me- I cheered with the rest
And now that he's visited Erin's green shore
We'll be much better friends than we've heretofore
When we've got all we want we're as quiet as can be
Where the mountains of Mourne sweep down to the sea
.
You remember young Peter O'Loughlin of course
Well now he is here at the head of the force
I met him today, I was crossing the strand
And he stopped the whole street with one wave of his hand
And there we stood talking of days that are gone
While the whole population of London looked on,
But for all these great powers he's wishful like me
To be back where dark Mourne sweeps down to the sea.
.
There's beautiful girls here - Oh, never you mind
With beautiful shapes Nature never designed
And lovely complexions, all roses and cream
But O'Loughlin remarked with regard to the same,
That if at those roses you venture to sip
The colours might all come away on your lip
So I'll wait for the wild rose that's waiting for me
Where the mountains of Mourne sweep down to the sea


If you have an itunes account Don MacLean does a fine version (thought purists say he played with the melody). Recommended.

What a question.  Those of us who have had the opportunity to try and decide, should “count their blessings” (Joseph Locke also does a fine version!).
Let's make GCA grate again!

Melvyn Morrow


Sean Leary

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2010, 07:46:26 PM »
This is a question that I have changed my mind on numerous times.

If RCD's greens had the undulation that Portrush's do, RCD would be the one...


Melvyn Morrow

Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2010, 08:09:36 PM »

Sean

If you build it (the Greens) will he (they) come – question recently asked by RCD Greens Committee  ;)

Melvyn

PCCraig

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2010, 08:17:01 PM »
RCD is one of my top 5 courses I've ever seen. I'd play it over Portrush 8-2. Portrush is very good on it's own, just not in the same league IMO.
H.P.S.

Wade Schueneman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #15 on: September 29, 2010, 08:44:47 PM »
RCD!

The finish could really be improved but all I can say is that by the time I reached the 13 green I was so happy that it just didn't matter.  I do agree with Sean Leary.  It would be nice to add a bit more contour to a few of the greens though (which are wonderfully true and quick).

I really like Portrush (especially holes 1-14), but RCD is in a class of its own in my book as far as a golf experience.

I also agree with Sean Arble about Lahinch.  It is the only links course that threatens my allegiance to RCD. 


Bill Gayne

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #16 on: September 29, 2010, 09:19:55 PM »
Portrush has the best greens in Ireland so it gets my vote. 

Kevin Pallier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #17 on: September 29, 2010, 10:16:23 PM »
To me a game of golf isn't all about the greens it's also about how you get there and the journey one takes at RCD is superior to that at RP.

RP for mine has a great begining, middle and a soft end whereas RCD is more consistent throughout. Both are high calibre courses and two must plays IMO if one gets to Northern Ireland.




Daryl David

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2010, 11:03:38 PM »
Portrush is my choice due to superior greens and the Valley course as a bonus.  Would rather spend 2-3 days there than at RCD.   Using the 10 round test it would be 5 Portrush Dunluce, 1 Portrush Valley, 4 RCD.

Doug Wright

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2010, 11:26:29 PM »
Simon,

I played Portrush Dunluce/Valley then RCD as you did exactly two years ago. I loved the Dunluce course, and had a magical round there that was so good compared to my regular game that it was almost an out of body experience. However, the Royal County Down course is at a whole different level IMO. The routing, the topography and the variety of shots required and challenges presented just seemed far superior at Royal County Down.
Twitter: @Deneuchre

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #20 on: September 30, 2010, 03:01:02 AM »
In my opinion, the 5 best courses in Ireland are as follows:

Royal County Down
Royal Portrush
Ballybunion
Portmarnock
Lahinch

On any one day, I could argue for any of these over another to the extent that I have stopped trying. They all have different aspects that make them excellent.

James Boon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #21 on: September 30, 2010, 03:15:10 AM »
Simon,

I've only played both courses once, Portrush on a foggy day and County Down in a constant drizzel. I played excellent at Portrush while County Down ate me up and spat me out, but I still had a smile on my face afterwards.

I feel I really need to play them both again but based on what I've seen so far, it would be County Down for me, just! It contains some of my favourite holes on any course, 3, 4, 5, 9, 13 and is something quite different from a lot of other championship courses. Portrush also has some great holes that I love, 4, 5, 6, 13, 14 but at times does feel like a lot of the other top Championship courses that are out there all be it probably one of the very best.

Cheers,

James
2023 Highlights: Hollinwell, Brora, Parkstone, Cavendish, Hallamshire, Sandmoor, Moortown, Elie, Crail, St Andrews (Himalayas & Eden), Chantilly, M, Hardelot Les Pins

"It celebrates the unadulterated pleasure of being in a dialogue with nature while knocking a ball round on foot." Richard Pennell

Matthew Hunt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #22 on: September 30, 2010, 05:47:55 AM »
Simon its funny you don't like 7 at RCD as i'm a member and it's my choice of all the holes. I can be a bit weird thought.When I was cadding a few weeks ago we were having to get 4 handicaps to miss the green on purpose on a 125 yarder, because it was unnholdable in the wind!

Simon Holt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #23 on: September 30, 2010, 06:09:03 AM »
Matthew,

Its not that I dont like 7 I just find it a bit controversial.  To be fair I played 2 rounds of foresomes and didnt hit the shot in there either time.  In the morning my partner put us in the perfect place on the flat spot to the right of the flag, in the PM my new partner who is also an RCD member put us off the green left but thankfully not in the bunker.

All I could think was that I wouldn't want to play it in a strong right to left or downwind!  It is almost as if the hole would work better if the green was the other way around with the bunker over the back.

Cool looking hole- perhaps it needs repeated play to really appreciate it.  It is the sort of hole that I would see growing on me over time.

What do you think about 14?  Do you like 16 now or how it was before?
2011 highlights- Royal Aberdeen, Loch Lomond, Moray Old, NGLA (always a pleasure), Muirfield Village, Saucon Valley, watching the new holes coming along at The Renaissance Club.

Jim Nugent

Re: Are you a Portrush or Royal County Down man??
« Reply #24 on: September 30, 2010, 06:14:52 AM »
A couple of you have said RCD's greens are not as good as Portrush's.  Do others agree with this?  If so, could a top-notch architect re-work the RCD greens, and make the course even better?    

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