Reaction to Shackelford Article in Golf Digest.Com 'Where do they go from here?'

[Matthew Rose]

Or they could just play Congo as a Par 71, heaven forbid 

[Carl Rogers]

Carl. This is not a new idea and should be extended to the tour too.

For some reason they want nothing to do with it.

With 300 million in the bank, maybe the pockets need to be deeper.

The tour has, effectively, done that with their TPC courses.  Im not sure its a good idea b/c there are already enough golf courses out there that have asking prices north of $150 a round and my guess is that if the USGA built a US Open course they would charge the same as the TPC rates, or more.

Gentlemen,

Of course you are both correct.  At some point all of the problems alluded to by all of these posts may represent a tipping point.  With a facility or facilities of their own, the USGA can execute all the initiatives they strive for the game to be and have a bit of leverage over the rota.

If there was a course that could be as elastically set up as Mike Davis appears to want to do, together with the environmentally sensitive golf course ... that might be the next revolution.

[Carl Nichols]

Mr Schmiel...

From what I have read and heard, M Davis of the USGA wants no. 6 to be the par 5 risk/reward to encourage the guys to go for it in two shots over the fronting pond.  As a result, the 1997 rotation no. 16, which will become the 2011 rotation no. 15, will play as the par 4 on the back.  I suppose no. 6 will become sort-of similar to Torrey no. 18 in that it could play anywhere from 525 to 575.  The risk-reward deal doesn't exist with the par 5 on the back.

Thanks Peter.  Are those the only two changes considered for the Open (the changing of #6 to a par-5 and changing #16 to a par-4)?  

Interesting.  I haven't paid any attention to what the USGA is planning to do with Congressional, so it surprises me that they may play #16 as a par 4 -- talk about a hole designed for short approaches, rather than 3 irons.  I do think that #6, from the right tee boxes, will be a great risk/reward setup.  [#11 is the other members' par 5 that they usually set up as a par 4 for the pros.]

[Tom_Doak]

I couldn't tell you exactly how much yardage we added at Cherry Hills, but I think it is unlikely that they will get another US Open.  It's pretty much impossible to get a course in Denver to play as long as they'd like it to for an Open, although Mike Davis insists that total yardage is not a determining factor in whether or not a site is chosen.

[Adam Clayman]

With 300 million in the bank, maybe the pockets need to be deeper.

The USGA had $290 million of cash and marketable securities at the end of 2007...by November 2008, the amount had shrunk to $190 million.

This idea was thrown around before the equity was lost into thin air.

In hindsight, the 100 mil lost would've been a good start for at least one venue.

They should bring the open to new markets. Keeping it at these old venues obviously has done nothing new to grow the game.

[Wayne_Kozun]

Why the insistence on going back to Torrey Pines?  Sure the outcome was great but I am not sure that it was due to the course. 

Is there any chance that we will ever see an open at San Francisco GC?

[Kevin_Reilly]

Is there any chance that we will ever see an open at San Francisco GC?

Sort of like this scene from Dumb and Dumber, but maybe substitute a 'billion' for a 'million':

Lloyd: What do you think the chances are of a guy like you and a girl like me... ending up together?

Mary: Well, Lloyd, that's difficult to say. I mean, we don't really...

Lloyd: Hit me with it! Just give it to me straight! I came a long way just to see you, Mary. The least you can do is level with me. What are my chances?

Mary: Not good.

Lloyd: You mean, not good like one out of a hundred?

Mary: I'd say more like one out of a million.

[pause]

Lloyd: So you're telling me there's a chance... *YEAH!*

[Wayne_Kozun]

Memberships can change, if I recall my visit to SFGC the average member that I saw was at least an octogenarian, and a new generation of members may have a different attitude towards holding events like the US Open.  And stranger things have happened - David Lee Roth rejoined Van Halen, The Eagles had their Hell Freezes Over tour and The Police reunited for a tour.

Once upon a time I bet that it would have been extremely unlikely that the blue bloods at the USGA would ever consider holding the Open at a muni, never mind holding the Open at munis two years in a row.

[Ken Moum]

it surprises me that they may play #16 as a par 4 -- talk about a hole designed for short approaches, rather than 3 irons.

The problem is that unless the hole is 620 yards, 80 percent of the field is going to try to get on in two anyway.

That's the olf Payne Stewart story.  When he complained about a green not being designed for a long iron, Davis' predecessor said he'd be happy to make the hole a par five--if Stewart could get everyone in the field to agree to lay up on their second shot.

K

[JNC Lyon]

I know it does not get much love on this site, but has Baltusrol fallen out of the US Open Rotation?  What about Oak Hill and Oakland Hills?  These are all classic US Open venues.  Baltusrol has hosted 7 US Opens in all.  It seems this tournament has nothing to do with tradition nowadays.  It should be the tournament that preserves tradition more than any other.

Additionally, the Country Club in Brookline will not host another US Open.

[PCCraig]

Additionally, the Country Club in Brookline will not host another US Open.

JNC -

I think you are very wrong. In 2013 you are going to see the players in the US Am enjoy but also be tested heavily by TCC. The greens are so small in spots and the course is designed in a way that makes it very difficult to overpower it. If you add considerable rough the course can be a bear and in this modern day it's tougher than Merion.

Eventually the USGA will go back to the Northeast (Boston), and I highly doubt TPC Boston or Pinehills is an option!

[Sean Leary]

Additionally, the Country Club in Brookline will not host another US Open.

JNC -

I think you are very wrong. In 2013 you are going to see the players in the US Am enjoy but also be tested heavily by TCC. The greens are so small in spots and the course is designed in a way that makes it very difficult to overpower it. If you add considerable rough the course can be a bear and in this modern day it's tougher than Merion.

Eventually the USGA will go back to the Northeast (Boston), and I highly doubt TPC Boston or Pinehills is an option!

What will the second course be at the US AM? Charles River perhaps? Brae Burn?

[PCCraig]

Additionally, the Country Club in Brookline will not host another US Open.

JNC -

I think you are very wrong. In 2013 you are going to see the players in the US Am enjoy but also be tested heavily by TCC. The greens are so small in spots and the course is designed in a way that makes it very difficult to overpower it. If you add considerable rough the course can be a bear and in this modern day it's tougher than Merion.

Eventually the USGA will go back to the Northeast (Boston), and I highly doubt TPC Boston or Pinehills is an option!

What will the second course be at the US AM? Charles River perhaps? Brae Burn?

Charles River is going to be course #2.

[Bruce Katona]

Steve: Do you think The Donald will give the Far Hills lads the keys in exchange for having the Open at his place?

Interesting idea.....espaecially if the market turns and he needs the charitable contribution to offset gains or gets tired of writing monthly checks to cover costs.

[John Moore II]

I know it does not get much love on this site, but has Baltusrol fallen out of the US Open Rotation?  What about Oak Hill and Oakland Hills?  These are all classic US Open venues.  Baltusrol has hosted 7 US Opens in all.  It seems this tournament has nothing to do with tradition nowadays.  It should be the tournament that preserves tradition more than any other.

Additionally, the Country Club in Brookline will not host another US Open.

All those courses appear to have deals worked out with the PGA to host their events. That generally puts an end to hosting USGA events, the Opens anyway. Southern Hills is the only notable exception I can think of.

[Steve Lapper]

Steve: Do you think The Donald will give the Far Hills lads the keys in exchange for having the Open at his place?

Interesting idea.....espaecially if the market turns and he needs the charitable contribution to offset gains or gets tired of writing monthly checks to cover costs.

Bruce,

   Wouldn't surprise me one bit. His kids sure don't share his passion for the game and it might be the biggest e- stroke of his golf-related career. The facility is certainly worthy, but I strongly doubt the Bluebloods want to be anyone's Apprentice!

[Dan Moore]

I will be making an entirely coincidental tour of ther top 3 MW contenders for the 2017 US Open.    A week ago I played Olympia Fields North,  and later this week will be visiting the remodeled Cog Hill and updated Erin Hills.  My impression going into it is that Erin Hills, notwithstanding its intial failure to think outside the bun, is the leader based on the quality of the terrain and elasticity the course and grounds provide, with OF 2nd.  I haven't been to Cog Hill in many years so I am intrgued by the opportunity to compare all three within a short window of time. 

Geoff in his article notes the renovation to the South Course at Olympia Fields warrants a look from the USGA for future events.  I can report that in the Mark Chaplin organized Royal Cinque Ports Tour 1909 -2009 US Tour which visited OF ten days ago, the RCPGC members were quite impressed with the South Course, and enjoyed playing it more than the North Course.  I'm not saying that makes it a US Open contender, I think OF North still presents the stiffer challenge to the better player, but well done to Jeff Goldman and OF for their improvements to the South Course. The par 3, 4, 5 5th, 6th and 7th holes at OF Sourth is a sublime sequence of holes.   

[Bruce Katona]

I would love to see the Merck's dealing with 25,000 of the masses daily for an Open in Bedminster.  Maybe, but not likely.

[Steve Lapper]

I would love to see the Merck's dealing with 25,000 of the masses daily for an Open in Bedminster.  Maybe, but not likely.

They might try to accelerate this venue for the sole purpose of speeding up ol'Betty's moving on !! Absent that, she'll just unleash her ponies onto Larger Cross Rd and gum up everything, or move over to Woody's for the week??