another rules violation: Inky DQ'ed...

[PThomas]

..for using a swing donut during a backup in play to stay loose...and she was in 2nd place at the time , which really must have hurt since she's almost 50, doesnt play as well as she used to and there arent that many LPGA events these days!

[Fred Yanni]

I saw that -

A viewer called in and said she was using a swing aid.  Interesting ruling as a weight or "donut" to loosen up is not ever used on a club when to playing an actual shot so I don't know how it can be interpreted as a swing aid.  But apparently it is.  Good thing a viewer called in to protect the field from that cheating Inkster  .

[Sean Leary]

Amazing that she didn't know this rule.

[RSLivingston_III]

A swing aid is something used for teaching or stretching, not for modifying the club. So that call was correct. If she had added weight to the club for the shot it would have been a different infraction.

[John Moore II]

A swing aid is something used for teaching or stretching, not for modifying the club. So that call was correct. If she had added weight to the club for the shot it would have been a different infraction.

And would have been a different penalty. Modifying the club during the round would be a DQ penalty. As for this situation, a weighted 'donut' is named specifically in the decision.

[PThomas]

am I wrong or are viewers no longer allowed to question rules on the PGA tour any longer?

and like Dustin she should have known better...she's been playing competive golf for about 40 years!

[Gary Slatter]

that really sucks, it's difficult to get people started in golf, things like this and DJ scare them.......

[Fred Yanni]

Thank guys I had no idea.  I guess she should of just swung with 2 or 3 clubs like we did in the old days.   However, I have to say it seems like a horribly pointless rule.   (although I am sure someone will inform me why it is so important to disallow stretching aids on the course)

[John Moore II]

Thank guys I had no idea.  I guess she should of just swung with 2 or 3 clubs like we did in the old days.   However, I have to say it seems like a horribly pointless rule.  

Worse yet, if you have a weighted training club, such as one of those Momentus Power Hitter's, you can have that in your bag as one of your 14 clubs in play. Talk about contradicting rules.

[Dan Herrmann]

I'd love to know how these folks know the phone number to call.  This is a joke - get a life Mr. Caller!

[Brent Hutto]

Playing Match Play Madness instead of golf looks more attractive every day.

[John Moore II]

I'd love to know how these folks know the phone number to call.  This is a joke - get a life Mr. Caller!

To quote Mr. Joe Nichols: Song-It Ain't No Crime:  If everybody minded their own business, They'd be too busy to worry 'bout mine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BO3ZBb1wRaY

[Jim Sweeney]

To add to  Mr. Moore's comment, changing the playing characteritics of a club during a round (ex. adding weight) results in disqualification only if the player uses the club in its altered state. If it is altered, carried, but not used, the penalty is two shots per hole with a maximum of four shots. If the player returns the club to its original state before carrying it or using it, there would be no penalty. Rule 4.

Ms. Inkster did not violate Rule 4. She violated Rule 14, "Striking the Ball."

A player can carry and use a device specifically designed for stretching ( a rope, stretching bar, etc- 14-3/10.5) if it is not designed to be a club. The problem with a donut is that it is an artificial device used in conjunction with a club during a swing(14-3/10), even if the swing is forr the purpose of stretching. That makes it a swing aid as opposed to a stretching device. Suppose yo0u had a device that you could attach to the club to help you practice your aim between shots. Same thing. In the Rules of Golf like situations are treated alike.

A weighted training club may be chosen as one of the fourteen clubs for play so long as it conforms to the rules for form and make of clubs. I have no idea if the Momentus clubs conform.

[Chuck Brown]

To add to  Mr. Moore's comment, changing the playing characteritics of a club during a round (ex. adding weight) results in disqualification only if the player uses the club in its altered state. If it is altered, carried, but not used, the penalty is two shots per hole with a maximum of four shots. If the player returns the club to its original state before carrying it or using it, there would be no penalty. Rule 4.

Ms. Inkster did not violate Rule 4. She violated Rule 14, "Striking the Ball."

A player can carry and use a device specifically designed for stretching ( a rope, stretching bar, etc- 14-3/10.5) if it is not designed to be a club. The problem with a donut is that it is an artificial device used in conjunction with a club during a swing(14-3/10), even if the swing is forr the purpose of stretching. That makes it a swing aid as opposed to a stretching device. Suppose yo0u had a device that you could attach to the club to help you practice your aim between shots. Same thing. In the Rules of Golf like situations are treated alike.

A weighted training club may be chosen as one of the fourteen clubs for play so long as it conforms to the rules for form and make of clubs. I have no idea if the Momentus clubs conform.

I have a Momentus, and I've been asked about it many times, including this exact question.  Mine, which is a standard retail Momentus iiron (5-iron, I think) is obviously not meant for hitting (ridiculous weight, short re-rod shaft, etc.), but it looks like a club and I'd certainly consider it as such under the Rule you cited -- and yes, it would be a non-conforming club because it has one of those molded training grips on it.  I think that if I swapped out the grip and put a Golf-Pride on it, it could pass as one of the 14 clubs.  And any self-respecting caddy, if forced to carry the damned thing, would hit me with it.

[Jay Flemma]

Amazing that she didn't know this rule.

That one fooled me!  Is it possible it's an obscure rule?

[Chuck Brown]

I don't like many of the responses above.

The Rule makes sense.  It is intended to discourage people from having a whole flock of time-consuming hardware with them on the golf course.  Keep the game moving.  Keep people focused on playing the game, with real clubs.

As for carrying a Momentus as a 14th club, uh, whatever.  If you want to dedicate one of your fourteen to that purpose.  And if it is an otherwise legal club.  How would anybody propose to stop such a thing?

What amazes me in all of these arguments, is how easy it is, 99.5% of the time, to defend the Rules of Golf as they exist.   A lot of thought went into the Rules, and the Decisions.  The detractors are really hilarious most of the time.

[Jim Sweeney]

Chuck- The grip absolutely makes it non conforming. I don't know about the grooves, where the heel meets the clubhead, etc. ONe example used in the rule book is that a heavy driver may have a moment of inertia higher that allowed.

[John Moore II]

Amazing that she didn't know this rule.

That one fooled me!  Is it possible it's an obscure rule?

Not too obscure. Decision 4-4a/7 talks about weighted training clubs and Decision 14-3/10 talks about using a training or swing aid during the round and specifically mentions the weighted donut.


As for the Momentus clubs, the original one probably wouldn't conform and it is not designed to hit balls. The newer one, the 'Power Hitter' is not as heavy and is designed to hit balls and may conform with the rules. It would not be terribly practical to carry one of those as it is fairly pointless, but it would be legal. However, it does bring up a good question, is conforming club that is purpose designed to be a swing aid/trainer illegal to use and swing during a stipulated round?

[Chuck Brown]

...

 is conforming club that is purpose designed to be a swing aid/trainer illegal to use and swing during a stipulated round?

Answer - No.  There is no 'illegality.'  A conforming club is a conforming club.  As long as it is one of no more than 14 of 'em.  Perfectly legal.  Doesn't matter what it was "designed to be."  (Trainer or otherwise.)

[John Moore II]

...

 is conforming club that is purpose designed to be a swing aid/trainer illegal to use and swing during a stipulated round?

Answer - No.  There is no 'illegality.'  A conforming club is a conforming club.  As long as it is one of no more than 14 of 'em.  Perfectly legal.  Doesn't matter what it was "designed to be."  (Trainer or otherwise.)

You sure?

4-3/10 Use of Training or Swing Aid During Round
Q. During a round, may a player make a stroke or a practice swing using a club with a weighted headcover or "donut" on it, or use any other device designed as a training or swing aid?

A. No. The player would be using an artificial device to assist him in his play in breach of Rule 14-3, but see also Decision 4-4a/7 for use of a weighted training club.

4-4a/7  Carrying Weighted Training Club
Q. May a player carry a weighted training club in addition to the 14 clubs selected for the round?

A. No, but a weighted training club may be selected as one of 14 clubs carried by a player, provided it conforms with Rule 4-1 (e.g., an excessively-weighted driver head may breach the limit on Moment of Inertia — see Appendix II).

So, that makes for some real gray area in the rules. Can a club be both conforming with the rules AND purpose built as a training club? And if so, which rule applies? After all, Decision 4-4a/7 only says the player can carry the club, not use it. Put it this way, the question has two right and two wrong answers. I've been a rules official in small events in the past, this is not a decision I would want to have to make.

[Chuck Brown]

John, I would have no problem in interpreting the rule this way:  An otherwise-conforming weighted club, counted and carried as on of 14 conforming clubs, is legal.  Such a "club" is not a "device" under 4/3-10.

I would apply Decision 4-4a/7, just as you have posted.  A weighted training club may be carried by a player, as one of his 14 clubs, provided (as above) that it is otherwise conforming.

[John Moore II]

John, I would have no problem in interpreting the rule this way:  An otherwise-conforming weighted club, counted and carried as on of 14 conforming clubs, is legal.  Such a "club" is not a "device" under 4/3-10.

I would apply Decision 4-4a/7, just as you have posted.  A weighted training club may be carried by a player, as one of his 14 clubs, provided (as above) that it is otherwise conforming.

However, you also have to consider that 14-3/10 says ANY device DESIGNED as a swing aid. That is where the uncertainty comes into play. I am not saying I would have any problem accepting your ruling as you wrote it out. I would also have no problem with the ruling going the other way.

[Fred Yanni]

 A donut and a weighted training "club" serve exactly the same function, to allow the player to loosen up.  It makes no sense to me why one is legal and the other is not.

Lets for a minute forget hypotheticals about a futuristic detachable aiming device.  That would be easy to correct in the rules if one ever came about.  But to allow one item that functions 100% the same as another item that is disallowed because it is detachable just seems like a huge loophole in the rules.  

Chuck I do understand and agree 100% with your point about protecting the field from the use of swing aids or other devices designed to help or teach the swing, or help with alignment etc. being carried or employed during the round.  But this is really a function argument and a heavy club and a donut serve the exact same function, both should either be allowed or disallowed.  I don't care.  Maybe I was wrong in saying its a horrible rule as you enlightened me on the swing aid issue which I did not consider because we all know a donut is used only to loosen up.    However, the device in question, the weighted donut, serves the same function as an allowed item, the heavy club - there lies my issue.

My guess is the rules committee will eventually change the rule to focus on the function of the device.  I would have loved to hear the discussion at the USGA when they determined the donut is a training aid and a weighted club is conforming and not a training aid. 

One follow up question for you rules experts -  Could she have used it on the back of the first tee 2 minutes before her first shot without penalty?  I guess she could because the round had not started yet.  Just curious  Thanks



  

[John Moore II]

Fred-Yes, she could have used it on the 1st tee prior to teeing off. That is not 'during the round.' And, I agree with what you say about the different definitions.

[Dave Falkner]

The Rule makes sense.  It is intended to discourage people from having a whole flock of time-consuming hardware with them on the golf course.  Keep the game moving.  Keep people focused on playing the game, with real clubs.

the irony in that statement  is just too rich!

the only reason she thought she needed the thing was b/c there was a 1/2 hr back up in the 10th tee!

I would think a  gun would come more in handy in such a situation