[Dan Herrmann]

Entropy is defined as the inevitable and steady deterioration of a system or society.

I think that entropy is the enemy of golf course architecture, especially over time - decades even.     It can be the result of a lazy employee not mowing the green surfaces correctly, a misguided green committee chair that decides to "beautify", or just the effects of wind/water/weather over time.

We know that some of today's architects have specialized in restoration/renovation of courses designed by the ODG's.  

A couple of questions:
1.  Will 2070 see an architect that specializes in the restoration/renovation of, say, Doak courses?  In other words, are today's clubs/courses losing the battle against entropy?

2.  How should a green committee/owner work to reverse or prevent the small effects of entropy that occur every year? (The changes that, over time, can really mess up a great original design)

[Tom_Doak]

Dan:

A lot of modern courses will have little trouble keeping the shapes and sizes of their greens intact, because the USGA green specs make for a pretty clear demarcation between the green and everything else.  Of course, when Mr. Dye dug up Crooked Stick in 1986 -- it was the first course with USGA greens -- he found that some of the greens had moved as much as ten feet since 1964!

Also, that won't be any help for courses like Pacific Dunes and Sand Hills which don't have USGA greens.

As for bunker edges, mowing lines, etc., they are going to change as one superintendent takes over for another on down the line.  Hopefully every once in a while there will be a guy who cares enough to look back at old pictures and try to move it back in the right direction.  It really shouldn't be that hard ... it really shouldn't require a restoration architect if the owner values what he has in the first place.  And if not, there is no stopping change.

[Dan Herrmann]

Tom,
Amen - but we've all heard horror stories about the green committee chair what wants to put "his thumbprint" on a course.  Ego can be a really bad thing.

[Phil_the_Author]

Tom,

I am greatly intrigued. "when Mr. Dye dug up Crooked Stick in 1986 -- it was the first course with USGA greens -- he found that some of the greens had moved as much as ten feet since 1964!"

Wouldn't this require either a complete breakdown in the greenside bunkers or their moving as much as 10 feet as well? Can you be more specific in what he meant by this.

[Tom_Doak]

Phil:

I was on site the day they dug up most of the greens on the front nine ... just passing through between assignments.  We found the plastic liner on #5 green (a par five) 10-20 feet in front of what was being cut as green ... Pete had built a massive false front there ... while in back the green was ten feet beyond the liner and mix!

Pete's reaction to seeing the false front, referring to Jack Nicklaus building so many of them:  "Well how about that?  I invented that and I didn't even know it."

[Phil_the_Author]

Tom,

The reason I asked is that an unnamed architect once told me that a Tilly course he restored had greenside bunkers that had moved away from the putting surfaces by as much as 12-15 feet and that is why he restored the bunkers by moving them much closer to the greens. I maintained, and still do, that he blew it and that the putting surfaces themselves had simply been shrunken to a far greater extent than thought by poor maintenance. These green complexes were built way before the use of plastic liners...

[Tom_Doak]

Phil:

I have never seen bunkers grow away from the greens.  Usually, they shift a bit toward the back of the green and into the green as they are edged over time.  If there's a lot of play, the excavated sand will raise the lip significantly ... Riviera is a huge example of the latter.  But I don't know by what maintenance practice or natural force bunkers would grow away from the greens.  The only chance is if the club deliberately moved them to make for ease of maintenance at some point.

[Colin Macqueen]

In the times we live in would the golf courses now being built or renovated not be given, as a matter of course,  very high quality topographic maps and detailed descriptions of constructed holes at the end of the project. If this is the case then “entropy” may still occur but could be easily rectified by the club in question. This might require some energy input mind you!

In greenkeeping terms does this “creep” happen so insidiously that it takes, for example, a new, incoming superintendent/board to notice the discrepancy. In general does an architect’s original conception and intention often become diminished due to practical maintenance difficulties and/or a lack of attention to the design detail as time goes on?

Colin

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