Chicago Highland pictures

[Paul Richards]

Terry and Matthew:

As I stated above, when the berm is complete, you will certainly see water towers in the distance, as well as the big Westchester one, but there will be no tollway signs and no maintenance sheds -- the course will be quite insular, with the focus on the best greens around and a very fun and interesting golf course.

And, unlike nearly every new course built in the past 30 years, this is NOT a housing development.  The few houses along the eastern perimeter will eventually be covered by berm and by foliage.

BTW, if I recall correctly, nearly every course I have played in Scotland (and there are about 50 of those), you hit tee shots at steeples or other structures in the distance.  This is especially so at hallowed St. Andrews.

I also realize that Oakmont is bisected by a freeway - and it  doesn't have a 200-foot-wide berm  to keep the noise level down there.   And this is a top five course in the world!

And, best of all, the ninth green sits some 95 feet above street level.  For the Fourth of July, they roped off the green, we had a large party with the family, and we all put blankets around the green and watched fireworks in 360-degrees!  Great evening fun.

[Paul Richards]

Terry:

You lost me when you compared CH to Ivanhoe.  

Ivanhoe is a parkland golf course, CH is not.

The only thing they have in common is Arthur Hills.

And, to totally disagree with you, Ivanhoe does not hold a candle to CH.  I have played there a couple times and there is nothing memorable about it, other than it is a very nicely conditioned golf course.

CH has many memorable holes, a lot of interest and a ton of variety.  For instance, par 3's range from 130ish to 260ish;  four pars from 260ish to 520ish; and five pars from the high 400s to well over 600.  Ivanhoe has nothing of the sort.

Finally, I agree with Warren: '"kudos to Terry for using "Brobdingnagian"...word of the day'

- I assume you learned that word at the end of "The O'Reilly Factor" and decided you HAD to find a use for it?!? 

 

[Paul Richards]

One more thought - the views of downtown Chicago from the Chicago Highlands course are absolutely spectacular.

You first get a good look of this when you are on the first green - a grand vista of all of the buildings downtown.  

Then at the #9 green, (some 95 feet above street level) you get an even more amazing view.  

Finally, as you tee off at the driveable four-par fourteenth, your target is actually Sears Tower from the back tee!  This was done on purpose.

Overall, upon completion, the less-than-beautiful nearby views will be obscured and the gorgeous vistas will be left.  Should be awesome.

 

[Paul Richards]

Someday I plan to add Chicago Highlands to the offerings of "My Home Course."

 

[Terry Lavin]

Terry:

You lost me when you compared CH to Ivanhoe.  

Ivanhoe is a parkland golf course, CH is not.

The only thing they have in common is Arthur Hills.

And, to totally disagree with you, Ivanhoe does not hold a candle to CH.  I have played there a couple times and there is nothing memorable about it, other than it is a very nicely conditioned golf course.

CH has many memorable holes, a lot of interest and a ton of variety.  For instance, par 3's range from 130ish to 260ish;  four pars from 260ish to 520ish; and five pars from the high 400s to well over 600.  Ivanhoe has nothing of the sort.

Finally, I agree with Warren: '"kudos to Terry for using "Brobdingnagian"...word of the day'

- I assume you learned that word at the end of "The O'Reilly Factor" and decided you HAD to find a use for it?!? 

 

Paul,

I compared Chicago Highlands to Ivanhoe because they are both the product of the same architect.  Whether it's parkland or faux links, there's every reason to compare and contrast the work of an architect at different sites.  There are a number of holes at CH that were reminiscent of holes on the Prairie and Marsh nines at Ivanhoe, which are surely not properly described as parkland style, in my judgment.  The Forest nine is another matter entirely.  When you say that you greatly prefer CH to Ivanhoe, I accept your statement, with its inherent bias noted, but I think that Hills did better work at Ivanhoe, based on my one play at CH.  Maybe Hills was out of his element with the landfill links look, but I wasn't overwhelmed by the course as a whole, even though, as I mentioned earlier, there are at least seven very good holes.  The rest were uninspiring and/or overly quirky.

The site has some issues, to be sure, but it seems to me that a different architect could have gotten more out of it than Hills did.  And I don't know how many architects would be proud to put their name next to the design for #9.  Is it unique?  Probably?  Is it great?  NFW.

As for your statement about the quality of the putting surfaces this year, I'll readily agree that they are in great shape, especially when compared to other courses in Chicago, which have had a lot of weather-related stress issues this year.  But let's not forget, that CH has a number of factors going for it in this regard.  First, the greens are all brand new and they bask in uninterrupted sunshine, drain in brand new sewers and sit atop a huge landfill which surely can't hurt when you get hit by a bunch of rain.

I'm glad you love your new club.  I've heard other members rave about it as well, but I highly doubt that it will be highly rated by any of the golf course architectural cognoscenti.  The bunkers are my main beef, but there are just too many ho-hum holes and too many unsightly views to capture my interest.  To each his own.

[Paul Richards]

Terry:

Thanks for the response.

You said:
>I highly doubt that it will be highly rated by any of the golf course architectural cognoscenti.

On this, I will make you a bet.  Chicago Highlands will be ranked on some list(s) and will win some 'Best New' awards.

Place your bets!  Place your bets!!

[Jud_T]

Paul,

Haven't seen the place yet, but the bench for "best new courses" in this economy isn't very deep.

[Paul Richards]

Jud, no doubt that is correct, not a whole lot of openings.

Let's see:  Old MacDonald - been there.
Prairie Club - not yet.
Harbor Shores - been there.

A couple ones around here - Bowes Creek and the Highlands of Elgin - been to both.

Maybe put Dubs in there since it just opened late last year?  - been there.

I am sure there are a few more to add, but the Chicago Highlands greens are better than all on this list that I have seen.  Period.
 

[Paul Richards]

Terry, a coupla last things.

You said:
>too many unsightly views to capture my interest.

As explained above, 110,000 loads of dirt have been dumped and 60,000 more to go.  There will be few, if any, of your 'unsightly views' after the berms have been completed.  That should 'capture your interest.'

You said:
>I don't know how many architects would be proud to put their name next to the design for #9.  Is it unique?  Probably?  Is it great?  NFW.

That is your opinion.  I have played the hole with probably 50 different golfers, in all kinds of weather and wind conditions, including a couple hackers and a couple pros. 

My guess is that 45 of them loved or liked the hole.  It is soooo different and so unique, the favorite comment is that they 'have never seen this hole before.'

I have had fun birdieing it a number of times and I have also managed to make a number of double-bogeys.  Each time I walk off the eighth green, I look forward to seeing the ninth green - it is interesting!

So your opinion squares with just a very small portion of the people I have played the hole with.

[JR Potts]

Is this a thread about Chicago Highland's pictures or an informercial about Chicago Highlands hosted by Paul Richards with a cranky caller, Terry Lavin, chiming in every so often? 

[Terry Lavin]

Is this a thread about Chicago Highland's pictures or an informercial about Chicago Highlands hosted by Paul Richards with a cranky caller, Terry Lavin, chiming in every so often? 

Even I'm sick of myself talking about this place.

[Paul Richards]

Last I checked, this was a discussion group for golf course architecture. No?!?!

Some people asked questions - some people made disparaging remarks.

There has been a tremendous amount of interest in CH, so I am merely addressing the merits of the golf course and the club.

If people wish to continue to take pot-shots based upon one visit, and make negative comments based upon work that is yet to be completed, the record needs to be set straight.

[Terry Lavin]

Last I checked, this was a discussion group for golf course architecture. No?!?!

Some people asked questions - some people made disparaging remarks.

There has been a tremendous amount of interest in CH, so I am merely addressing the merits of the golf course and the club.

If people wish to continue to take pot-shots based upon one visit, and make negative comments based upon work that is yet to be completed, the record needs to be set straight.

One man's pot shot is another man's considered judgment even if it's based on one visit.  If you can't handle criticism about your course, don't talk about it.  I said on several occasions that I've only played it once.  I'll probably never gain any more knowledge about the place because it doesn't particularly interest me, even though it's a pretty decent Arthur Hills course with at least seven very good holes, as I said.  I'm sure everybody else in the civilized world will love the landfill links, but it isn't for me.  So sorry.

[Paul Richards]

Terry:

You said:
>If you can't handle criticism about your course, don't talk about it

I am not the one who started the discussion, in case you hadn't noticed. I am merely replying to a thread started by another, who posted pictures, and from then you decided to denigrate the course - and the photos.

Not sure who asked you to join the 'landfill links' - but from what I can tell, it is not on Western Avenue, so I am quite sure it wasn't me that asked you.

 

[JR Potts]

If people wish to continue to take pot-shots based upon one visit, and make negative comments based upon work that is yet to be completed, the record needs to be set straight.

Fine, then Medinah is off limits as well....as I'm sure we have some work to do in the future.

[Paul Richards]

Ryan, fair enough.  

This summer has been especially harsh on all Chicagoland golf courses - especially those with newly planted grass.

Medinah is no exception.

So until we have some cool days, and, especially, some cool nights, grass will not grow in Chicago very well.

So I say that you are correct in calling Medinah 'out of bounds' on the 'Lavin scale' until the growing season begins again...

That being said, the greens at CH are still immaculate.

 

[JR Potts]

That being said, the greens at CH are still immaculate.

 

Medinah's greens are immaculate as well.  The fairways....not so much.   Sounds kind of like your bunkers and berming.   

[Terry Lavin]

Maybe if we put Merion in the thread title we can get up to three or four pages!  Maybe "Chicago Highland Pictures----Some Like it More than Merion!"

[Paul Richards]

Terry - you had me at 'Hello.'

But then you lost me with the Merion reference.  

I am quite sure that there are plenty of previous threads with Merion photos.  Just use the 'search' function.

 

[Bill Seitz]

I realize this is a pretty old thread to call up, but I played Chicago Highlands with a friend of mine yesterday, and both of us came away fairly impressed.  He was playing a practice round for the Mid-Am qualifier tomorrow and they were nice enough to let him bring a guest.  With a second year under its belt, it was in really great shape.  I'm not sure I loved it, but I sure like it a lot, and part of my opinion may have been shaped by the fact that I wasn't hitting my irons particularly well.  The greens were the fastest I've played this year, and maybe in a few years.  A speed where you can just never really get comfortable.  They were really quick, and led to a lot of bogeys.  It's really tough to get up and down on greens at that speed when you're missing a lot of greens.

I loved the look of the par 3 fourth hole.  I've never played a hole that looked like that before.  Loved the fact that all over the course, there was a lot of room.  Though I felt like it got a bit schizophrenic at times, especially with a handful of holes featuring free from tee boxes, while others had the square variety like one sees on the Rees Jones version of Cog Hill #4.  Really liked the 17th as well.  The pin was cut right over the top of the big ridge that separates the front of the green from the back.  My tee shot hit on the ridge, climbed up, then tumbled all the way back the front of green.  From there, a 35 foot birdie putt got about 98% of the way up the ridge, then came all the way back to my foot.  Sank the ensuing 38 footer for one of the craziest two putts I can remember.

Obviously the ninth is probably the most polarizing hole.  I walked away feeling that it was gimmicky and I didn't like it, but throughout the rest of the round, I really felt like I wanted another shot at it.  I think that could be a really fun hole to play over and over.  And while many of the comments regarding the views from the course focus on the office buildings, the water tower, the freeway, etc., it's the only golf course in Chicago where, on a really nice day like yesterday, you can get a view like this:

[Tim_Cronin]

I realize this is a pretty old thread to call up, but I played Chicago Highlands with a friend of mine yesterday, and both of us came away fairly impressed.  He was playing a practice round for the Mid-Am qualifier tomorrow and they were nice enough to let him bring a guest.  With a second year under its belt, it was in really great shape.  I'm not sure I loved it, but I sure like it a lot, and part of my opinion may have been shaped by the fact that I wasn't hitting my irons particularly well.  The greens were the fastest I've played this year, and maybe in a few years.  A speed where you can just never really get comfortable.  They were really quick, and led to a lot of bogeys.  It's really tough to get up and down on greens at that speed when you're missing a lot of greens.

I loved the look of the par 3 fourth hole.  I've never played a hole that looked like that before.  Loved the fact that all over the course, there was a lot of room.  Though I felt like it got a bit schizophrenic at times, especially with a handful of holes featuring free from tee boxes, while others had the square variety like one sees on the Rees Jones version of Cog Hill #4.  Really liked the 17th as well.  The pin was cut right over the top of the big ridge that separates the front of the green from the back.  My tee shot hit on the ridge, climbed up, then tumbled all the way back the front of green.  From there, a 35 foot birdie putt got about 98% of the way up the ridge, then came all the way back to my foot.  Sank the ensuing 38 footer for one of the craziest two putts I can remember.

Obviously the ninth is probably the most polarizing hole.  I walked away feeling that it was gimmicky and I didn't like it, but throughout the rest of the round, I really felt like I wanted another shot at it.  I think that could be a really fun hole to play over and over.  And while many of the comments regarding the views from the course focus on the office buildings, the water tower, the freeway, etc., it's the only golf course in Chicago where, on a really nice day like yesterday, you can get a view like this:

Bill, you can get a similar view from Harborside International. On the fifth hole of the Port Course (as with the ninth at Highlands), you aim at Sears Tower. The left aerial, to be precise.

[George Freeman]

Bill, you can get a similar view from Harborside International. On the fifth hole of the Port Course (as with the ninth at Highlands), you aim at Sears Tower. The left aerial, to be precise.

You can get a similarly nice view of the skyline from atop the "prehistoric" bluff at Beverly CC.

[Terry Lavin]

The Highlands is more notable for it's skyline views of about twenty suburban water towers!  Snark aside it is worth a visit if you're in town and have played the 20 or so courses that are superior to it. Eight or so very good holes do not a great golf course make.

[Jud_T]

Terry,

Merit Club or Highlands?

[Terry Lavin]

Highlands is more memorable but I think Merit is a notch above.