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Mike Cirba

Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« on: June 23, 2010, 04:18:55 PM »
The first public golf courses in this country were Van Cortlandt Park in NYC and Franklin Park in Boston.   Over the next 35 years most of the cities in the country built public golf courses, sometimes even offering free play to their constituents.

Most of the courses were rather crude affairs, often short and ragged, often just nine holes with little architectural interest.   However, as the game grew and the golfing public became more sophisticated, a number of courses did offer something more than just basic back and forth "field golf".  

in fact, some of these courses are still fairly higly regarded today, and from an architectural history standpoint, a number of them remain remarkedly well preserved, as some cities simply did not have funding to do much over the years after the initial course was built.  

However, by 1930, with the market crash and the start of the Great Depression everything changed.   Many public courses were abandoned.  Others, with the advent of public financing of large labor projects became "make work" projects, and the influx of cash led to significant changes in "muni golf" that created some of the best public golf systems in this country, such as Bethpage in Farmingdale, NY.   New York City hired architect John Van Kleek to completely redo all of their city courses.

What follows is a modest attempt to name the best of the public golf courses prior to the Great Depression.   All suggestions for additions to this list are greatly appreciated.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2010, 04:44:50 PM by Mike_Cirba »

Mike Cirba

Re: Best Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2010, 04:41:44 PM »
I should point out that this list is an attempt to compile the most highly regarded courses for historical informational purposes and to spur further conversation and understanding only.   This is simply my take on it based simply on a lot of personal historical research of the time period, and should be taken with that grain of salt.

I've only played a few of the courses in question, and some of them have changed significantly for better and worse over the years, but this is an attempt to classify them as they stood at the time in question, not today.   With that said;
 

The Top Ten

Brown Deer Park - Milwaukee, WI - 1929
Cobb's Creek - Philadelphia, PA - 1916
Community GC - Dayton, OH - 1909
Eastmoreland - Portland, OR - 1917
Forest Park - St. Louis, MO - 1912
Griffith Park (Wilson) - Los Angeles, CA - 1924
Harding Park - San Francisco, CA - 1925
Keller GC - Minneapolis, MN - 1929
Rackham GC - Detroit, MI - 1924
Wellshire GC - Denver, CO - 1926

Other contenders?   Here's some that come to mind.

East Potomac - Washington DC
Shawnee - Louisville, KY
Coffin GC - Indianapolis, IN
Rancho Park  - Los Angeles, CA
Waveland - Des Moines, IA
Franklin Park - Boston, MA


By definition I'm not including resort courses, which were played primarily by the same upper class folks who populated the country club game at the time.   Submissions of others for consideration is most welcomed.   Thanks.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2010, 04:49:51 PM by Mike_Cirba »

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2010, 05:02:06 PM »
I don't know if was "highly regarded" but Clifton Park was Baltimore's first muni dating to 1915:

http://www.bmgcgolf.com/sites/courses/baltimore.asp?id=502&page=25865
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Sean Leary

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2010, 05:03:55 PM »
George Wright in Boston? When was that built?

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2010, 05:07:14 PM »
Steve,

I've played Clifton Park...it's nice enough at about 5800 yards, but not sure it was ever very highiy regarded.   Mount Pleasant, built in the 30s, changed Baltimore golf.

Sean,

George Wright was a child of the Depression, opening in 1938.

Michael Blake

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2010, 05:22:57 PM »
Wilmington Municipal Golf Course-Wilmington, NC (Ross 1926)

JLahrman

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2010, 05:34:27 PM »
Never thought I would see Community GC on this list!  36-holer in the Dayton area, still going strong.

I might consider adding Avon Fields in Cincinnati, which according to its records is the oldest public golf course west of the Allegheny Mountains.

Phil McDade

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2010, 05:38:04 PM »
Mike:

Theodore Wirth in Minneapolis -- muni dating to 1916.

Kirk Gill

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2010, 06:18:51 PM »
For what it's worth, Wellshire in Denver was built as a private club, and only became a muni after it was purchased by the City of Denver in around 1936 or so.

The history of Denver Municipal golf is an interesting one, something I've been researching now and again. More to come.
"After all, we're not communists."
                             -Don Barzini

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2010, 09:08:34 PM »
Michaell/JLahrman/Phil/Kirk,

Thanks for the additional info.

I think Wilmington is clearly a contender...was it always public since inception?

Looks like Wellshire needs to get dropped.

Isn't it fair to say that by 1930, Keller was tops in the Lake state?

Here's an update;

The Top Ten

Brown Deer Park - Milwaukee, WI - 1929
Cobb's Creek - Philadelphia, PA - 1916
Community GC - Dayton, OH - 1909
Eastmoreland - Portland, OR - 1917
Forest Park - St. Louis, MO - 1912
Griffith Park (Wilson) - Los Angeles, CA - 1924
Harding Park - San Francisco, CA - 1925
Keller GC - Minneapolis, MN - 1929
Rackham GC - Detroit, MI - 1924
Wilmington Muni - Wilmington, NC - 1925

Other contenders?   Here's some that come to mind.

East Potomac - Washington DC
Shawnee - Louisville, KY
Coffin GC - Indianapolis, IN
Rancho Park  - Los Angeles, CA
Waveland - Des Moines, IA
Pelham GC - Bronx, NY


btw...some of the architects involved on these courses are quite impressive, and possibly surprising.   I'll try to list them tomorrow.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2010, 09:17:54 PM by Mike_Cirba »

Phil_the_Author

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2010, 09:20:27 PM »
Weren't the courses at Salisbury public?

Adam Clayman

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2010, 09:36:18 PM »
Jackson Park (1897) was the first 18 hole public west of the Aleghenies. Built on the debri field from tearing down the Columbian Exposition. (1893). Some, if not most of the holes have the skelton of architectural interest. Not sure how highly others rehgard it.
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the game you've been playing your whole life." - Mickey Mantle

Tom MacWood

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2010, 09:39:59 PM »

However,Tom...whether you acknowledge the fact or not, at the time it was built until the 1930s with the creation of Bethpage, Cobbs was the best and most challenging public golf course in the country.


Mike
I thought your claim was CC was the best most challenging public course up until Bethpage...why now are you limiting your search to 1930?

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2010, 10:26:07 PM »
Phil,

I was thinking salisbury 4 qualified, but was trying to determine exactly when it was public vs private.   Do you have more details?

Tom,

Would you like to play?

There was so mich construction activity initiated by the feds during the years from 31 thru 36 that its very difficult to take a static read on any of them at any time....thus the 1930 cutoff.

Would love to have you help identify the most highly regarded of the pubs at that time...thanks


Tom MacWood

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2010, 10:49:45 PM »
Phil,

I was thinking salisbury 4 qualified, but was trying to determine exactly when it was public vs private.   Do you have more details?

Tom,

Would you like to play?

There was so mich construction activity initiated by the feds during the years from 31 thru 36 that its very difficult to take a static read on any of them at any time....thus the 1930 cutoff.

Would love to have you help identify the most highly regarded of the pubs at that time...thanks



A static read? Please explain. Weren't there a number of good public courses built in the 1930s? It sounds to me like you are backing off your original claim.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2010, 10:53:32 PM by Tom MacWood »

Phil McDade

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2010, 11:01:17 PM »
Tom:

Not to speak for Mike, but I'll take a stab, and I like the demarcation of 1930 as a good breaking point for this discussion.

As everyone knows, coming out of the Depression, Roosevelt launched a number of public works projects, the WPA being among them. And solid public golf courses were part of the WPA program. It also coincided with a growing recognition in American society of the value of recreational pursuits, and the deliberate effort by federal, state, and local governments to provide areas for recreation -- be it public parks, trails, beaches or even golf courses. Thus, one might argue that truly public golf courses built post-1930 were the beneficiary of what I might call an enhanced recognition of, with corresponding money spent on, broader recreational pursuits.

Public golf courses built pre-1930 weren't the beneficiaries of this effort. Rather, public golf courses built during this time -- I'm speculating here -- were constructed as part of a narrower interest in just providing access to golf. Most of the truly notable golf courses in the country built pre-1930 were private, and most remain so to this day. It's an interesting study, it seems, to chart those public courses built not as part of a larger economic recovery, or a broader emphasis on recreation, but to tap into the small but growing interest in golf.


Kyle Harris

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2010, 04:44:53 AM »
Marble Hall? Was that pre-1930?

Sean_A

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2010, 05:51:45 AM »
Mike

Rackham has an extremely interesting history - probably more so if you are from Detroit or are black.  I have no way of knowing how the course stacked up with munis in 1930, but it was a very highly regarded course in Detroit.  If you haven't read the report linked below it is a must read for anyone researching this stuff.  Go to the final history report lower right of the page.

http://www.saverackham.com/home.php?page=home

Ciao
« Last Edit: June 24, 2010, 05:53:45 AM by Sean Arble »
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Hankley Common, Ashridge, Gog Magog Old & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2010, 06:14:35 AM »
Phil,

That's exactly correct, and thanks for your clear explanation.   I would only add that so many new munis were being built and so many existing courses being completely revamped that it's tough 80 years later to tell the state of quality of many of them with accuracy during that five year period.

Kyle,

Marble Hall would definitely qualify, although I'm not sure how successful or well-regarded  it was from the git-go.   It may have suffered by way of local comparison with so many other courses in the region, but good suggestion.

Sean,

Thanks very much for the very interesting link.

Tom MacWood,

Any suggestions?

Sean_A

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2010, 06:21:12 AM »
Phil,

That's exactly correct, and thanks for your clear explanation.   I would only add that so many new munis were being built and so many existing courses being completely revamped that it's tough 80 years later to tell the state of quality of many of them with accuracy during that five year period.

Kyle,

Marble Hall would definitely qualify, although I'm not sure how successful or well-regarded  it was from the git-go.   It may have suffered by way of local comparison with so many other courses in the region, but good suggestion.

Sean,

Thanks very much for the very interesting link.

Tom MacWood,

Any suggestions?

Mike

Its a very long report, but be sure to read it all as all sorts of interesting tid bits are scattered throughout.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Hankley Common, Ashridge, Gog Magog Old & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2010, 06:22:44 AM »
Sean,

I absolutely will.   I also think there are some parallels here that will be very beneficial to our own efforts as relates to tax base, zoning, historic trust preservation, etc.

Thanks again..
« Last Edit: June 24, 2010, 06:26:51 AM by Mike_Cirba »

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2010, 06:52:42 AM »
Phil,

How highly regarded were Brackenridge Park and Cedar Crest during this period?   I've played both of them, and although both were somewhat compromised from their original routings, I'm not quite sure they were ever top tier, even in their heyday?

Thoiughts?-

Tom MacWood

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Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2010, 07:35:14 AM »

Tom MacWood,

Any suggestions?


I suggest you stick with your original claim and change the date to 1936.

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2010, 07:45:28 AM »
Tom,

C'mon...what good ones are we missing?

We can cober the "best of the 30s" later if interest is high.  That's almost an era in and of itself in public golf.

Mike Cirba

Re: Most HIghly Regarded Public Golf Courses 1895 - 1930
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2010, 07:48:32 AM »
Did Bayside open before 1930?

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