Dual Tee Box With Holes Playing at 90 Degrees

[Jerry Kluger]

I went to a US Open Sectional Qualifier yesterday and the course has a tee box which is used for the back tees on the par 3 6th hole, which BTW is a really good Redan, and the par 4 9th hole. The par 3 places to the north while the par 4 plays to the east and it is not a very large tee box.  While it could slow play down a bit it also can be fun at a member club where groups can watch each other play.  If the par 4 was first it might not work as well since those players could get a preview of club selection, etc., on the par 3.  Your thoughts?

[Steve Lang]

   one hole with nearly 90 degrees at Strantz's Tobacco Road .. but i misread your intent..

[Jerry Kluger]

Steve: Does it work well at a public course - is it a big tee box?

[Pete_Pittock]

Can't think of any that I have played which run at 90 degree angles. Less popular than double greens. If the shared tee holes were of the same par it may lead to someone playing the wrong hole. Broken Top (Weiskopf/Morrish) in Bend, OR has the par 4 11th and par 3 16th heading in opposite directions from a hillcrest.

[Bill_McBride]

I went to a US Open Sectional Qualifier yesterday and the course has a tee box which is used for the back tees on the par 3 6th hole, which BTW is a really good Redan, and the par 4 9th hole. The par 3 places to the north while the par 4 plays to the east and it is not a very large tee box.  While it could slow play down a bit it also can be fun at a member club where groups can watch each other play.  If the par 4 was first it might not work as well since those players could get a preview of club selection, etc., on the par 3.  Your thoughts?

We have a couple of them at our club and it is fun.  Neither pair includes a par 3!

[Jerry Kluger]

I wonder what the order of play is when both groups reach the tee at the same time?

[James Boon]

Jerry,

The 12th and 18th (both longish par 4s) at Kyle Phillips The Grove share a tee, which seemed a quirky feature for a new course. Also at Wentworth West the 8th and 11th (both medium 4s) share a tee (or they used too, not sure about after the recent work there?)

I was suprised to see it at The Grove as I thought it would have been more likely at holes that have been lengthened over time?

Cheers,

James

[Jerry Kluger]

I just thought it was interesting and wondered if it was something that an architect would intentionally put in his routing.

[Bill_McBride]

I wonder what the order of play is when both groups reach the tee at the same time?

We go first come first served, dunno what you'd if arrivals were exactly the same!  I'm sure cooler heads would prevail.

[Kyle Harris]

Lancaster Country Club's 11th, 14th and 18th tees are all in the same general vicinity - though I don't think any share a tee box.

One still must defer to the groups on other tees though.

Very neat atmosphere and spot.

[Bill Seitz]

At Point O Woods, the 15th and 17th sort of share a tee box, as do the 8th and 18th.  They don't really cross each other at all, but it's one contiguous mowed piece of ground, set in a V shape, such that the back tees on each hole could conceivably be set pretty close to one another.

At Ridge Country Club in Chicago, the 15th hole plays to the north, and the 5th hole plays to the east.  These tees are in the same spot and actually cross each other if I remember correctly.  Such that if you were teeing off on the fifth hole, a short par four (even by Ridge's standards), and someone was teeing off on 15, the person on 15 would be hitting over your head (it's slightly elevated about the 5th tee).  I don't suggest teeing off on 5 if someone is teeing off on 15. 

[Steve Lang]

  Jerry,

I checked the routing print i have of Tobacco road and the 6th hole there i was thinkinjg about really is more like 45 degrees not 90.. anyway the sandhills setting has tees separated by sandy areas .. it seems to work, never had any propblems there in about a dozen plays

[Brian Joines]

The 4th and 18th holes at South Bend CC share the same tee. I agree that they are a fun addition to the round. The 4th is a par 3 and the 18th a par 5.

[Brian Joines]

The Back tees on #11 and #13 at Lost Dunes are also on a shared tee box. In this case, you could get some yardage hints for the par three #13 while teeing off on #11 (Par 4).  I doubt it will help much as our group always seems to have the place to ourselves when we get out there.

[Pete_Pittock]

I've always held that the group further along in their round has the right of way. It is a corollary of the same theory I hold that you are holding up your own group in a shotgun start in a too-crowded field.

[Steve_ Shaffer]

LuLu's 13th, a par4@438y shares a tee box with the 16th,a short par4@333y.

[Mike Benham]

In a few weeks, we should an example on the telly, the 4th and 17th tees at Pebble Beach ...

[Patrick Hodgdon]

It's more of a 45-degree angle but Interlachen Country Club has a split tee with the par-4 #2 and the par-5 #9 (11+18 for the '08 US Women's Open).

The member's seem to like it a lot as you get to see other groups while playing and they usually take turns hitting shots when they get there at the same time.

[Matthew Runde]

I wonder what the order of play is when both groups reach the tee at the same time?

I imagine you would use the same incoming-has-the-right-of-way order as on holes with crossing fairways, such as the High Out and High In of St. Andrews.

[Doug Braunsdorf]

Jerry, IIRC, Merion West has this on at least one hole.  I can't recall exactly which.  I believe Gulph Mills may have the same thing, I believe here it's the tees for 11 and 18.  Tom Paul, are you reading this?

[Jerry Kluger]

I just wonder if architects like this or not when deciding the routing of a course.

[Jon Wiggett]

Ascona in the Italian speaking part of Switzerland has two such sets. The 2 and 9 tees which are a par 3 and 4 respectively form a lobsided cross. The second set is the 12th and the 17th which are a par 5 and par 3.

Jon

[Bruce Katona]

If a par 3 and par 4/5 hole a re sharing a tee box, it would be neat.  the tee box will need to be large enough to allow for the wear and tear tee boxes take, especially par 3's

Next time playing, take note of the wear on the teeing area of par 3 and short par 4 holes. 

I always got a chuckle out of divots taken out of the teeing goround on long par 4 and par 5's, where the tee shot is not a lay-up.  Big oops by someone !!

[D_Malley]

philly cricket hole 3 (par 3) and hole 11 (par 4) share a tee box.  with the back tee for #11 playing off the back of the tee for hole # 3.

I think they should also consider doing the same thing for holes 13 (par 4) and 15 (par 3).

putting the back tee for 13 on the back of the lower tee of #15 would make for a cool angle for the tee shot on 13.

[Jerry Kluger]

It appeared to me at the course I saw that the tee box was being used for the par 3 to allow for a longer shot and a better angle to the Redan - the only problem was it definitely was in need of some trees being cut back.