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Tim Gavrich

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Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #25 on: May 17, 2010, 02:10:05 AM »
Color me opposed to the use of rangefinders during tournament play.  I am bummed that they are allowed in college tournaments and I do not for a moment buy the notion that they speed up play enough to compensate for the powers of judgment that they take away from the game.  Many a time have I seen a player fiddle around with his rangefinder trying to find a steady target rather than looking at the nearest sprinkler head and going from there.  I am confident enough in my own two eyes that I do not feel like I need one of those rangefinders.

I love having a caddy, though.  The presence of a "teammate" heightens the thrill of each shot and the ability to walk without lugging the bag around is liberating.  It's a rare but a fine pleasure of the game.  I should add also that I have enjoyed caddying for people in the past for similar reasons.  I'm looking forward to doing some looping at Hartford GC this summer.
Senior Writer, GolfPass

Tony_Muldoon

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Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #26 on: May 17, 2010, 02:13:26 AM »



Bill, I see that point, and the only place the devices might be needed is when one's ball is off the beaten path, in odd locations a caddie may have never been to before.  


I believe this exchange took place at a Ryder Cup in the USA. 17th Par 3 over water.

Monty tees off.               SPLASH
Together with his caddy they make their way down to the water’s edge.
Monty “What yardage do you have?”
Caddy (Silent)
Monty    “I asked what yardage you have?”
Caddy very quietly.  “I don’t, I never expected to be here”.




Does anyone else feel when you hit a piss poor shot ,like spraying it to an adjacent fairway, the last thing you deserve is an accurate  read on EXACTLY how far it is to carry the bunker etc?
Let's make GCA grate again!

Michael Whitaker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #27 on: May 17, 2010, 02:57:46 AM »
I'm kind of worried.
I've checked in to this thread earlier today, and now after 9:30pm  PST
Not ONE coment from Melvyn!?!? ???

Somebody needs to call him, and make sure he feels okay ;)

Pat - you will be happy to know that Melvyn is alive and in good form. He has written to me via email with his thoughts on this subject and they fall along the lines you would expect. The following quote fairly well sums up his thoughts:

" All I see is that we have sunk to the depths of the lowest common denominator, leaving very little room for honour and the Spirit of The Game."

Melvyn said he has chosen not to post on this thread to avoid the "nutters" attacking him.
"Solving the paradox of proportionality is the heart of golf architecture."  - Tom Doak (11/20/05)

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #28 on: May 17, 2010, 03:03:51 AM »
"Does anyone else feel when you hit a piss poor shot ,like spraying it to an adjacent fairway, the last thing you deserve is an accurate  read on EXACTLY how far it is to carry the bunker etc?"

Tony, huh, yes, why not?  

It really has become something in how such a simple game can require so many gadgets, endless lessons and expensive equipment.

Ciao
« Last Edit: May 17, 2010, 03:43:31 AM by Sean Arble »
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Rob Rigg

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #29 on: May 17, 2010, 03:13:05 AM »
How much does accurate yardage help on a links course - with a 30 mph "breeze"? :)

Aesthetically - range finders are awful, snipers on the golf course? I was sent one by a company and used it for a couple of weeks - yuck. Really not that helpful because you hit to a yardage instead of feeling a yardage.

How far? About 160ish, left to right wind a bit into us, feels like a X iron?

How far? Exactly 157 yards, left to right wind a bit into us, must be a X iron?

A range finder removes the subconscious ability to feel a shot for many (not ALL) golfers - seeing people dunk a ball when they hit their 150 club into the water having forgotten about the 15 mph wind in their face is hilarious. Put down the range finder son and use your melon.

A senior caddie looks like a hack - just IMO - if he has to pull a range finder on his home course. That is ridiculous.

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #30 on: May 17, 2010, 06:36:42 AM »


Michael

Why not just publish my complete e-mail, in fact I will save you the bother I will do it myself.

Hi Michael

Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids – No Michael, I have no problem with my caddy using a range finder as I do not use Caddies.

I care not what modern players use to help them beat the field, win or get a good score. I know that unless they do it on their own ability they are not playing a Game called Golf. Nevertheless, you and others enjoy whatever it is you believe you are playing and if money in involved, then good luck.

I feel that posts like your show how weak the modern game has become, how individuals con themselves into believing that cheating oneself is the honourable way for a game called Golf. All I see is that we have sunk to the depths of the lowest common denominator, leaving very little room for honour and the Spirit of The Game. We have forsaken the game’s traditions and virtues in preference of make the life of the modern player easy, not forgetting the pressure money is also putting upon the game

I am not worried about Golf as it is still played in the correct manner in many parts of Scotland including places like St Andrews. The old attitudes including respect for the game as well as others on the course still apply and will echo down the ages to the true traditional Golfer.  The game as once reported in 1890 only requires the player to have “A good eye, lasting power as a walker, nicety of calculation, and, above all, good temper”  to enable it to be called Golf.

Once you have tasted the apple from the Garden of Eden or used a cart and distance aids on many occasions you have crossed the line in the sand. Now Caddies are of such poor quality that they feel the need to use aids explains just how inept and corrupt the game has become IMHO. I keep coming back to those lines “A good eye, lasting power as a walker, nicety of calculation, and, above all, good temper”   written so long ago yet uphold the honour and real Sprit of the Game and Golfer.

Michael, please play the game you wish and want, that is your choice now that our Governing bodies allow aids, as for my opinion you are a Player and I look upon myself as a Golfer still true to its original concepts and teachings.

We have been in the Golfing Dark Ages for over half a Century, yet very few have noticed preferring to do their own thing, thus allowing the slow trickle of what once made Golf so popular to be washed away with the top soil of some of our modern courses, leaving a toxic waste of undiluted confusion facing the next generation of players.

RIP Golf or as I suspect Golf will go underground being as numerous as the old drinking dens during the prohibition days. Just waiting for the world to rediscover a game called Gold as played on the small hidden course of Scotland.   

Please excuse me for not posting on your topic as I feel it will just direct the ‘Nutters’ to attack me rather than debate your topic.

Your post has actually sadden me, its seems the modern Caddie is reflecting the state of the modern game all to well.

Kind regards

Melvyn     


               


As I mentioned to Michael, his post has really sadden me. The Game of Golf is not difficult at the best of times, challenging, yes but not difficult. As per the article from 1890 its explained so well the simple approach one needs to play golf “A good eye, lasting power as a walker, nicety of calculation, and, above all, good temper”. So why would any able bodied golfer prefer to us aids instead of God’s gifts. At a stroke you have removed the first three requirements in how to enjoy and play the game. I suppose many will also soon surrender the final item (good temper) once the game has started.

For me the underlining problem is how many have the nerve let alone think they can justify using aids when playing Golf.  Is the need to win so strong that one is willing to sell ones self-respect and soul for the sake of a stroke or two (or should I call it a lie, perhaps even cheating but that sounds so unfair when a weak governing body have agreed to them). OK the Governing Bodies say its legal, but clearly one has to wonder what they were on when they came to that conclusion. Am I ranting, of course I am, well certainly in the eyes of those I am challenging, yet is there not an easy way to prove me wrong. Perhaps record a round with all your outside aids then another devoid of said aids, letting ones eyes judge distance, legs do the walking. Compare the two scores. If identical or very close, why would you want these toys, if the aids do enhance your game and you achieve a better score then you have proved they are aids so should surely be made illegal. Whatever, perhaps one thing that may come out of your experiment is that you will remember why you took up golf in the first place, maybe for that extra fun and challenge, self generated without the need for outside aids.

Reading through many of the previous comments I am brought very low by how many people believe that Range Finders and/or distance aids are acceptable. One reason I suppose is that I cannot understand why so many are willing to forego the pleasure of working out distance and club selection by information calculated whilst walking to the ball. I feel that’s the closeness one will get to understand the designer and GCA. I will not willing surrender or give up that pleasure as easily as many on this site. For me its all part of the joy the game of golf gives to the golfer or are you just a player?

I wonder why so many are willing to sell their golfing souls.  Is it really only about winning or making life that little bit easier or perhaps just plain embarrassed that you are not as good as you think you are without your toys.

As for Caddies and Range Finders is that not a contradiction, perhaps a rather expensive one but then we are talking about the lowest common denominator, so should not expect that much for our money. A Caddie with a Range Finder, describes the depth to which the modern game has sunk.

We each answer to our own Gods, so I presume that also applies to our Golfing Gods.

If one is going to post comments from another’s e-mail then I feel it best that the whole conversation should be posted if nothing more than to give context.

Melvyn     



Colin Macqueen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #31 on: May 17, 2010, 06:59:40 AM »
Melvyn,

The Scots - ranters? Nah, never. Purists - och aye.

The Hielander
"Golf, thou art a gentle sprite, I owe thee much"
The Hielander

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #32 on: May 17, 2010, 10:04:57 AM »
How much does accurate yardage help on a links course - with a 30 mph "breeze"? :)

Aesthetically - range finders are awful, snipers on the golf course? I was sent one by a company and used it for a couple of weeks - yuck. Really not that helpful because you hit to a yardage instead of feeling a yardage.

How far? About 160ish, left to right wind a bit into us, feels like a X iron?

How far? Exactly 157 yards, left to right wind a bit into us, must be a X iron?

A range finder removes the subconscious ability to feel a shot for many (not ALL) golfers - seeing people dunk a ball when they hit their 150 club into the water having forgotten about the 15 mph wind in their face is hilarious. Put down the range finder son and use your melon.

A senior caddie looks like a hack - just IMO - if he has to pull a range finder on his home course. That is ridiculous.

Rob, we are in 100% complete accord!  (I have made a note)

Brent Hutto

Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #33 on: May 17, 2010, 10:13:22 AM »
I'll simply repeat yet again my obligatory point that there's a lot of difference between trying to hit a shot to an exact yardage (i.e. "157") and what my eye will tell me (often plus or minus 15 yards or more). There are greens on my home course that my eye can't tell any difference at all between front and back hole locations.

If you want to choose your club based on your eye telling you "Maybe on the front about 150, maybe middle about 160, maybe back about 175) then by all means do so. Me, I'd rather know whether it's a 6-iron, 5-iron or maybe even a full swing with a hybrid to get the ball to the hole. And there are plenty of hole locations where if I hit it 175 to the back of the green and the hole is really on the front I'm well and truly screwed.

But no, I don't look at the "157" in the rangefinder and say "Hmmm, that would be a 5-iron if it were 160 but I'll choke by 3/4" since it's just 157. If the rangefinder rounded off to the nearest five yards that would be fine by me. But it doesn't.

JeffTodd

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #34 on: May 17, 2010, 10:34:40 AM »
I had a caddy at Essex County (NJ) last year. We were on #18. He looked at my position, looked at the flag, and said "143". Then he pulled his rangefinder and corrected himself, "142". I chuckled, and he said "I don't really need this thing, but people don't trust me unless I use it."

It seems to me that this caddy, at the very least, had learned that the typical client prefers machine to man. I can't say I'm surprised.

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #35 on: May 17, 2010, 10:53:09 AM »
I'll simply repeat yet again my obligatory point that there's a lot of difference between trying to hit a shot to an exact yardage (i.e. "157") and what my eye will tell me (often plus or minus 15 yards or more). There are greens on my home course that my eye can't tell any difference at all between front and back hole locations.

If you want to choose your club based on your eye telling you "Maybe on the front about 150, maybe middle about 160, maybe back about 175) then by all means do so. Me, I'd rather know whether it's a 6-iron, 5-iron or maybe even a full swing with a hybrid to get the ball to the hole. And there are plenty of hole locations where if I hit it 175 to the back of the green and the hole is really on the front I'm well and truly screwed.

But no, I don't look at the "157" in the rangefinder and say "Hmmm, that would be a 5-iron if it were 160 but I'll choke by 3/4" since it's just 157. If the rangefinder rounded off to the nearest five yards that would be fine by me. But it doesn't.

Brent

You use yardage crap at your home course?  How many times do you need to play it before learning the shots?  Even the greatest courses can't deceive members forever. 

Melvyn

I admire your crusade even though it doesn't worry me if others want to use yardage guns.  I figure its up to them how they want to play the game even if I think its silly to use a gun.  Its almost as if folks are trying their best to take the "game" part out of the game.  Between this lot and dopey archies designing to some piece of paper with the mantras of fairness and safety, it really does make me wonder about the future of the game. 

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Brent Hutto

Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2010, 11:10:35 AM »
I have a few specific holes with certain pin placements where I use it. Absolutely.

As I was saying, if there's a ridge through the middle of the green it can be a 6-iron to a hole short of the ridge and 5-iron to a hole over the ridge and my eye can not distinguish which one of those is the actual hole location. Why would I want to guess wrong and be absolutely screwed by making a good swing with the wrong club?

More often I just look at a sprinkler head to know how far it is to the middle of the green. Nine times out of ten that's all I really need to know but on deep greens with false fronts and/or contours internally the hole location matters a lot on at least a hole or two per round. Of course it's usually pretty clear when it back or front but not always. It's not helped by the fact that I don't wear my glasses when I play golf. A few years ago most of those flag locations would have been visible but I can't typically pick out the flagstick from the green surface even 140 or so yards out.

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #37 on: May 17, 2010, 11:18:23 AM »
A Caddy of the Old School – hand inside his coat waiting to see if you want to play Golf or just want yardage. One wonders if he has a Range Finder inside his coat or he is just happy to see you, yes apparently that was one of his happy faces.

                           

My understanding is that this photo (courtesy of the Uni of St Andrews) was used to promote his Caddy Service.  I feel I might be a bit nervous to decline his offer, may find a horses head in my bed in the morning if I did not follow his instructions. Perhaps you now see why I do not use Caddies, it’s the “Godfather” thing. Mind you it would be the only time I would be please to see a Range Finder instead of a Colt 45 being pulled out from his coat.

Melvyn

PS Do you really think these old time Caddies would ever have considered a Range Finder, I feel they would regard it as an insult to their profession and their ability. Why do we have to demean the skills of individuals including Caddies for the sake of yardage. Those cretins that thought that Caddies should be required to use Range Finders should IMHO be banned from setting foot on a golf course for life. They do golf and caddies a disservice.

« Last Edit: May 17, 2010, 11:23:41 AM by Melvyn Hunter Morrow »

Bill Hyde

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #38 on: May 17, 2010, 01:03:51 PM »
Apparently many of you have caddies at your clubs who are veteran loopers. At my place, we have a lot of kids who are trying to make a few extra bucks and hopefully win an Evans Scholarship. So I always have them carry my rangefinder in their pocket, They simply don't know the game or the course that well and I always get nervous when a 15 year-old paces off the yardage from a sprinkler head on the opposite side of the fairway, runs over, does a double-take and then gives me an "guesstimate" distance.

Let's use the computer as an analogy...how many of you still write everything out longhand and then transcribe it to your word processor? My guess is not that many and we don't hear the lament over the loss of pen and paper (or stone tablets for that matter) as an insult to the art of writing. The fact is, yardage measurement devices speed up play and give us all a false sense of security before we fade one right into a bunker.

Dan Herrmann

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #39 on: May 17, 2010, 02:41:04 PM »
Wild idea - Why would a caddy be permitted, but a rangefinder not?  Wouldn't the caddy be significantly more helpful than a rangefinder?  He carries your clubs, cleans them, is a good sounding board, gives advice, rakes bunkers, reads greens, and gives distance.  The rangefinder just gives yardages.

I say, "Ban the Caddy!"  ;)

Pat Burke

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #40 on: May 17, 2010, 02:47:03 PM »
Melvyn,
Not sure if I'm one of the nutters, but if so, please understand that I know and understand
your beliefs in aids and the like.
This thread offered far too good an opportunity to have fun, in a topic that too often tumbles
in to an argument here.  Guess I just fed that, sorry

Sven Nilsen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #41 on: May 17, 2010, 05:56:34 PM »
I had a caddy at Essex County (NJ) last year. We were on #18. He looked at my position, looked at the flag, and said "143". Then he pulled his rangefinder and corrected himself, "142". I chuckled, and he said "I don't really need this thing, but people don't trust me unless I use it."

It seems to me that this caddy, at the very least, had learned that the typical client prefers machine to man. I can't say I'm surprised.


Jeff -

Good thing you hit your 142 club and not your 143 club.
"As much as we have learned about the history of golf architecture in the last ten plus years, I'm convinced we have only scratched the surface."  A GCA Poster

"There's the golf hole; play it any way you please." Donald Ross

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #42 on: May 17, 2010, 06:16:54 PM »
Wild idea - Why would a caddy be permitted, but a rangefinder not?  Wouldn't the caddy be significantly more helpful than a rangefinder?  He carries your clubs, cleans them, is a good sounding board, gives advice, rakes bunkers, reads greens, and gives distance.  The rangefinder just gives yardages.

I say, "Ban the Caddy!"  ;)

Dan re read the thread.  Yes in theory a Caddy does so much more, but in each of the posts above with a Caddy there's always that human element called doubt.  With technology on the course you  get certainty, even from the far side of the woods. it may be an insignificant difference to you and I can laccept others usimg them, but if I wanted to play computer games I'd do it at home.

http://www.topgolf.co.uk/Locations/US/Chicago/Default.aspx
Let's make GCA grate again!

Richard Choi

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #43 on: May 17, 2010, 06:20:26 PM »
Dan re read the thread.  Yes in theory a Caddy does so much more, but in each of the posts above with a Caddy there's always that human element called doubt.  With technology on the course you  get certainty, even from the far side of the woods. it may be an insignificant difference to you and I can laccept others usimg them, but if I wanted to play computer games I'd do it at home.

I don't care how accurate or advanced a gadget is, as long as it is operated by a human, it too has human element called doubt.

Keith OHalloran

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #44 on: May 17, 2010, 06:44:52 PM »
I recently played a course that is well loved on this site. It has no yardage markers anywhere on the course. The caddy carried a laser and told me that although he knows the yardages, he uses the rangefinder so that the members will stop constantly arguing with his number.

A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #45 on: May 17, 2010, 07:07:51 PM »
Jeez, this crap again. 

Rangefinders speed up the game; they're a faster way to get the exact same information that golfers have wanted and gotten for eons.  Some of you guys really, REALLY need to get over yourselves.  If you don't want to use one, great.  But quit the "good old days" rants, please!  It is really getting tiresome, and you sound just plain silly.
"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

Melvyn Morrow

Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #46 on: May 17, 2010, 08:26:29 PM »

I would willing bet that a Rang Finder does not speed thing up – how can you improve or speed up the way the games has been played not ‘for eons’ but for centuries. My game and that of my friends and family do not stop to consider yardage of any sort, it’s the big modern con and boy have millions fallen for it.

The quickest way is to work out what club is required as you walk to your ball, as for distance many are more than capable of judging distance, have done so all their lives, again as they approach their ball. Its this modern need or to be honest I think its becoming a sickness to be told yardage  - as if the average golfer can be that consistent.

My point all along is that you, the golfer do not need outside aids to play the game, they just slow down the game and you concentrate on the wrong element of the game, but then what do I know, you would think that by my comments, my family having been playing golf for at least 180 years or should I say closer to 250 years.

It’s never been about the game, its how you play it that counts, in time some might come to understand that. But for the record the fastest way to play golf is to ignore yardage altogether and let your eyes and legs do the work for you – you may even find it can be fun.

To the closed mind anything that you do not agree with is a rant, that my friend is because you are just blood ignorant when it comes to golf.

 I agree with the comment “Some of you guys really, REALLY need to get over yourselves” and start realising that yardage is relative new concept that is cluttering up your minds when playing golf. Its not needed or required and your own God given talents are just as effective, perhaps more as you are in total control of the whole process.

But ‘Rant on’ – if its important to you  - sounds like a Buddy Holly song

Melvyn

Rob Rigg

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #47 on: May 17, 2010, 11:58:50 PM »
AG,

In terms of pace of play - like anything I think it depends on the golfer as to whether they will play faster or not.

In certainly does help solve the chickens running around the fairways looking for sprinkler heads issue. But if someone looks at yardage while walking past sprinkler heads, reaches their ball, looks at where the pin is on the green, pulls their stick and hits, then a range finder will not speed up their play.

On a links course, knowing your exact yardage absolutely does not matter - hence my comment about wind - to which we can add turf, etc.

Brent,

I understand why you use a Range Finder - I am just playing devils advocate in mentioning how people can become too dependent on one and stop thinking for themselves.

If we all agree that golf is an experience - taking certain things away from the experience CAN make it less enjoyable - at least for some.

I do believe that feel is a part of the game and a great way to work on feel is to challenge yourself to play without yardage (which usually works best on a course that you know well). Not all the time, but sometimes, it is fun.

The discussion started about caddies - it is sad that some people make caddies pull a range finder to support what they 1) already know and 2) what likely won't make a difference to the shot that is hit by the person asking for said yardage anyways.

"143 to the pin, excellent, I'll hit my 8 iron 134 into the middle of the pond." :)

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #48 on: May 18, 2010, 02:43:06 AM »
This is a never ending debate, but one with a correct solution - tee hee.  To me, the real divide is between those who are willing to spend a fairly large sums of money on equipment (I bet those with yardage guns on average spend considerably more on equipment than eye-ballers) and those that are not.  This difference could go to the heart of how the differing groups treat the game - I don't know.  While I profoundly disagree with the USGA/R&A for allowing outside agencies as an advice aid (including caddies), it would seem this sort of thinking is the way of the world.  Perhaps if these guns really catch on, maybe yardage markers can be eliminated.  At least for us Luddites that would help ease the anguish of seeing the continued advancement of mechanical golf.  

I recently hurt my left ankle which has made it difficult to shift my weight forward on the down swing/follow through.  The feeling of not having power through my swing is horrible - all the shots feel weak.  I feel much the same about yardage aids - I am powerless to play my own game and it does take something away from my enjoyment.  I am not sure folks fully comprehend the difference in the two attitudes and how pervasive and invasive yardage aids are for those that don't care for them.  Okay, the gun is merely an extension of the caddy and markers, but I do cringe when seeing these machines pulled out.  To me, there is a definite incongruity between trying to intellectually conquer the architecture and using aids to solve aspects of the puzzle.  For lack of a better word, I would call it lazy, but perhaps that is too harsh.  

At least with the old markers or stroke savers, guys looked around for highlight features as a marker.  Perhaps, just perhaps, these additional looks are part of why some archies feel the need pay attention to details - they know golfers will be looking.  I fear that guns will make golfers even more myopic and perhaps, just perhaps, this tunnel vision will lead to archies not building the features they can because they don't need to in order to satisfy the customer.  In essence, features may become obsolete in the same way that run-up approach areas were not incorporated into designs as much with the coming of the watering age.  In some way which I find difficult to explain, I do believe architecture is linked to how we play the game.  The player and the archie is a two-way street which requires some degree of an understanding between the two.  The balance of that understanding is different depending on the archie and the player.  Certain players lean toward certain archies for reasons due to this understanding.  In other words, they understand each other better and therefore the balance between the player's needs and wants and the archie's creativeness is better.  To me, guns are an added element in that understanding/balance which is unnecessary and likely harmful to the craft of architecture.  So yes, I do believe the use of yardage aids can potentially dumb down architecture like we have seen the use of water, housing courses and carts dumb down architecture.  I know most won't agree and that is fair enough.  But do give it some thought.

Ciao    
« Last Edit: May 18, 2010, 06:13:04 AM by Sean Arble »
New plays planned for 2024: Nothing

Simon Holt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Caddies, Range Finders & Directional Aids
« Reply #49 on: May 18, 2010, 05:59:25 AM »
Sean,

You have 95% convinced me.  I received a laser as a gift this year and have become a little reliant on it at courses other than my home course.

Does it take some of the romance out of the game? Yes, I would say so.

Does it improve the enjoyment of a more score orientated golfer?  Yes, definitely. (by no means are all laser users score orientated)

Does it matter either way?  Totally down to the individual.

So Sean, you have one golfer willng to give up his laser for a while at least.  Lets hope I dont fall off the wagon next week....

Simon
2011 highlights- Royal Aberdeen, Loch Lomond, Moray Old, NGLA (always a pleasure), Muirfield Village, Saucon Valley, watching the new holes coming along at The Renaissance Club.