Old Macdonald Voted Best of Bandon

[Terry Lavin]

Joe,

I also favor Pacific Dunes, but I have only played Old Mac once, so I don't think it's all that informed of a preference.  As a group how would you compare the 3's on PD to OM, the 4's on PD to OM and the 5's on PD to OM?  I know that isn't a perfect method of comparison either because there is some imbalance in distribution but it seems to me that PD would come out slightly ahead in this mode of comparison as well.  But, again, it's not all that fair to compare after a single play.

[Tom Jefferson]

Joe;

Enjoyed your post and esp the comments you offered after you finished your goofy head to head stuff!  BTW I agree with your comparison with the exception of hole #11, which I have to give to OM because of the brillliance of the green complex as well as the immensely deep historical context of that hole.  So in my book Pac wins 1 up.

Jim F........We do not aerate in the summer, so you are relieved of that fear!  Additionally, our aeration practices are far different than what you might be used to, as we strive for minimal surface disruption, with smaller solid tines, or more recently slit tines.  Barely noticeable by the next day.

Beautiful spring conditions here!

Tom

[Tom_Doak]

I played in the just completed Macdonald Cup, or was it the "Old Macdonald Cup"?   The event was won by Piping Rock.  At the dinner Friday night, after most attendees had played Old Mcdonald three times, Mike Keiser asked informally about the preferred course at the resort and received a response similiar to that of Terry's group.

That is a very well-traveled group, but as everyone is a member of one (or more) Macdonald courses, I don't think they are the most neutral group of well-traveled golfers you could find. 

[Terry Lavin]

I played in the just completed Macdonald Cup, or was it the "Old Macdonald Cup"?   The event was won by Piping Rock.  At the dinner Friday night, after most attendees had played Old Mcdonald three times, Mike Keiser asked informally about the preferred course at the resort and received a response similiar to that of Terry's group.

That is a very well-traveled group, but as everyone is a member of one (or more) Macdonald courses, I don't think they are the most neutral group of well-traveled golfers you could find. 

So, they may not be the best jurors on this "trial", eh?

[Tom_Doak]

If I were the defense lawyer for Pacific Dunes, I'd sure argue for a mistrial.

[Terry Lavin]

I'd uphold that one on appeal!

[Kevin Pallier]

Obviously early days - but could OM be considered potential Doak 10 material ?

[David_Elvins]

Obviously early days - but could OM be considered potential Doak 10 material ?

Would not be surprised if they have to make the Doak Scale go up to 11. 

[Jonathan Cummings]

Just had two very informed women players including a top Oregon amateur and a former senior caddie at Bandon both say they prefer Pacific over Mac.....

[Tom_Doak]

Jonathan:

Women are probably the opposite extreme in this poll.  I suspect that the vast majority of women would prefer Pacific Dunes, because it's much prettier, and the tighter corridors don't bother women at all since most of them hit it so straight.  Whereas, in the huge scale of Old Macdonald, some might feel lost in all the space.

Men might prefer Old Mac for the opposite reasons.

[Keith OHalloran]

Wow, Jonathan, I admire your guts!  Get ready for the full on investigation to reveal and discredit your sources.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Just had two very informed women players including a top Oregon amateur and a former senior caddie at Bandon both say they prefer Pacific over Mac.....

Good players can be the worst judges of good architecture.

Many tend to be myopic.

[Peter Pallotta]

I might have trouble at OM.  I think I have a split personality, or some such disorder. I'm disconnected, of two-minds. Aesthetically, I want space and little definition. Playing wise, I'm a mid-handicapper who can hit a narrow target with some (surprising) regularity, but who tends to miss the entire planet when it's offered me. Choice - the freedom to choose...a rarely mentioned bit of arsenal in the diabolical architect's tool kit. But maybe it's just me.

No, as I think about it, maybe choice isn't the right word. Maybe it's an inverse kind of visual intimidation where, instead of having rough and hazards flling the mind's eye, you have nothing at all - wind and sea and space being one great big OTHER that fills everything with...nothing!!  It's a show, in other words, about nothing....

Peter  

[Rob Rigg]

What are the initial thoughts on the 18th green complex at OM?

When I was wondering around the course in Feb it really caught my eye - looks like SO much fun to play into and a great way to finish up the round.

Joe - Looks like you gave 18 to Pac in the match - would be interested to hear you reasons?

Can't wait for Opening Day . . . and then the day after - back to back at OM after knocking off the other three at the start of the trip.

Hoping for 15 to 20 winds - but nothing too crazy (wimpus - I know).

[JC Jones]

Obviously early days - but could OM be considered potential Doak 10 material ?

Would not be surprised if they have to make the Doak Scale go up to 11. 

that's one more higher.

[Wyatt Halliday]

Given all the pre-opening love for Old Mac, am I the only one that's curious about which RGD course will knocked out of its own Top 10? Maybe Top 5?

[Terry Lavin]

Just had two very informed women players including a top Oregon amateur and a former senior caddie at Bandon both say they prefer Pacific over Mac.....

Good players can be the worst judges of good architecture.

Many tend to be myopic.

Truer words are seldom spoken.

[Jonathan Cummings]

Jonathan:

Women are probably the opposite extreme in this poll.  I suspect that the vast majority of women would prefer Pacific Dunes, because it's much prettier, and the tighter corridors don't bother women at all since most of them hit it so straight.  Whereas, in the huge scale of Old Macdonald, some might feel lost in all the space.

Men might prefer Old Mac for the opposite reasons.

Thomas - should we start giving your courses gender?  Maybe we could borrow from the French...

Le PacDunes
La Old Mac

 

Will be there tonight.  Can't wait to see Mac for the first time and the others again.

The only intriguing question in my mind is will Old Mac surplant Sand Hills as GW's #1 modern.  It could well happen.

JC

[Jud_T]

.

The only intriguing question in my mind is will Old Mac surplant Sand Hills as GW's #1 modern.  It could well happen.[i]



[/quote]

Wow,  I'm as much of a Doak fan as the rest of the peanut gallery here and can't wait to experience OM, but aren't we setting the bar a TAD high for a course that hasn't officially opened?

[Terry Lavin]

Yes, I'll try to be the voice of reason and suggest that any such discussion is EXTREMELY premature.  Sand Hills has stood the test of time as a standard bearer of sorts and I would think it would be a stretch to say that Old Mac could threaten its spot on the perch.  I've played both and I love both, I think I love Sand Hills more, but gee whiz, isn't that a good problem to have!

I did hear one complaint about Sand Hills from an educated sort while playing Old MacDonald.  This guy told me that he greatly preferred Ballyneal to Sand Hills and that his principal problem with Sand Hills was that they didn't use fescue as the turfgrass of choice and instead used bent.  I have to say that I didn't notice that difference and I'm not sure that I'd give the course excessive demerits just because of that.  The turf at Bandon is a neat, gnarly surface with real linksy coloring that you get when you plant fescue, but I had no problems with the turfgrass at Sand Hills.  C'est la vie!

[Steve Lang]

  Jonathan,

I'd call it La PacD and Le O'MAC  (more bitch and bastard respectively)  .. Yes PD is more photo op with the ocean holes and those precarious green complexes and bunkering, but OM seemed to present less redundant challenges and more shot types out of the bag..

Ms Sheila and I both rate OM as the main reason to return to Bandon..  we didn't get to play BD, but played BTrails, Old Mac, & PD in that order.

There may be immense visual scale at OM to contend with, but there are some very narrow targets if you choose your path.. like left of that dead tree going over the dune or even left around Hell Bunker.. or down the  right on the Road Hole

OM's 18th green was a blast, we spent an extra 10 minutes there.. I think the upper short left bowl is the more challenging pin location

p.s. Guess which club won the inaugural Old Mac Cup?   

[Terry Lavin]

Jonathan,

OM seemed to present less redundant challenges and more shot types out of the bag..

There may be immense visual scale at OM to contend with, but there are some very narrow targets if you choose your path.. like left of that dead tree going over the dune or even left around Hell Bunker.. or down the  right on the Road Hole

These statements may seem inconsistent, but I think Steve's spot on here, especially about the appearance of narrow targets on the vast meadow landscape.  There are safe places available on most of the wide fairways, but there are plenty of narrow apertures to try to shoot through to gain a yardage or angular advantage. 

Maybe I'm a sucker for eye candy and give the early edge to PD in this "everybody's a winner" battle, but there's no doubt that there's plenty of fun AND challenge to be had on the duney meadow that is Old Macdonald.

[Jerry Kluger]

How important is local knowledge when playing Old Mac or Pac Dunes?  If you were going out without a caddy to play the courses how much would you miss that insight when playing the course? 

[Steve_Roths]

I am going to guess and say that STLCC won the Old Mac cup.

Also, I was looking for some images and found the losing logo for Old Mac.  I like the golf club being clutched by the rooster:

http://www.froeterdesign.com/ourwork/identity/oldmacdonald.html?id=528

[corey miller]

Piping Rock-13
Creek-11.5
Chicago-7.5
SLCC-7
Yale-7
MOC-6.5
NGLA-6
Sleepy-5.5