[Matt_Ward]

First, the rate increase: a full 25 percent more for New York residents and non-residents alike to play Bethpage Black Golf Course.

This means NY residents will now pay $65 on weekdays and $75 on weekends (a $15 increase in both cases).

Non-residents must now pay $130 on weekdays and $150 on weekends (a $30 increase in both cases). 

By the way, the fee to reserve a tee time went up, too, from $4 to $5.

No doubt the outsiders will be feeling the pinch.

[Mac Plumart]

Matt isn't this very affordable, all things considered?

New York City area, correct?  One of the most highly regarded courses in the world.  Less than a $100 for weekend play for residents and $150 for out of staters.

For a walk up and play at TPC Sawgrass it is $400, same for Pinehurst.   Both Top 100 courses.  What is the cost to play the Bandon Dunes courses?  Pebble $500, right?

I get prices are going up...but isn't this a great treat for New York residents to play such a well-regarded course for relatively cheap prices?

 

[Matt_Ward]

Mac:

The reservation system is weighed to NYers. If you live outside NY and wish to get a tee time for a complete foursome on a weekend morning time frame -- your better bet is to place a dollar down on Mega Ball.

The USGA and NY State made a commitment to keep rates affordable -- it appears David Patterson is bumping up fees to cover the shortfall of ideas and $$ that is part and parcel of Albany.

[Alex Miller]

They did the same thing this past year at Torrey Pines, not Bethpage Black but still a good value.

I think when city owned courses agree to an Open often part of the deal is that after a year they can raise their rates by some percentage.

[John Moore II]

Matt isn't this very affordable, all things considered?

New York City area, correct?  One of the most highly regarded courses in the world.  Less than a $100 for weekend play for residents and $150 for out of staters.

For a walk up and play at TPC Sawgrass it is $400, same for Pinehurst.   Both Top 100 courses.  What is the cost to play the Bandon Dunes courses?  Pebble $500, right?

I get prices are going up...but isn't this a great treat for New York residents to play such a well-regarded course for relatively cheap prices?

I thought the same thing. I mean, maybe since residents were used to the prices being so low for so long, its a shock, but those rates are not the high considering the quality of the course. The walk-up rate for Bandon is $275 in season.

I mean, according to Golf Digest, the Black is the 5th ranked public course in America and according to Tom Doak, its an 8. That puts the Black in some elite company. I think its well worth those published rates during the high season. As best I can tell, those rates still keep the Black as the cheapest course in the GD top 10.


***Matt-I tell you what, once I get back from this next overseas deployment (that would be in July) you make a tee time for a weekday mid-morning, I'll be there, I'll pay the booking fee and pay the extra $15 on your fee, in addition to mine...Even then, its still a great deal to play that course.

[Matt_Ward]

Guys, guys -- wake up.

We are talking about a state-owned facility -- not lumping it against privately run facilities -- such as Pinehurst #2, bandon, WS, PB, et al.

Bethpage Black is a benefit for NYers -- the issue will be access to outsiders and frankly the rates impact those at the lower half of the socio-economic divide. Those with the Golf Card from AMEX will not be impacted -- agreed.

[Joe Bausch]

If you have the new rates for the Red course, can you please post those too, Matt?  Thanks.

[John Moore II]

Matt-I am awake. $50 or $65 doesn't really matter for those at the lower end of the economic divide. Even now, with a really good, stable job, I find it kind of hard to come off of $50 for a round of golf. And to tell the truth, thats probably the most I've ever paid for a round. The $15 difference won't amount to anything for the course, I doubt they will lose any business. Even for a muni, they are still way, WAY below the market rate for a course of that caliber. Holy crap man, I have to pay around $40 to play a real dump muni here in Newport News, VA. And you think $65 to play one of the best courses in America is bad? You need to wake up friend.

[Mac Plumart]

John...

that was my point as well.  For the quality of the course, it is a great deal.

I am curious as to how much it costs to play elsewhere but in the Atlanta area, I played a nice Nicklaus course (Achasta) a lot...$80 on the weekends.  Cuscowilla is $100ish per round.  Longshadow is $25 for a walk...the biggest bargain I have ever seen and the prices need to be doubled in my opinion.  Bears Best is $115 on the weekends.  And not one of these courses is regarded anywhere nearly as high as Bethpage Black.

But Matt...I get your point.  Costs are going up by a pretty good clip.

[Matt_Ward]

Mac:

You keep missing the point -- we are talking about a publicly owned facility -- when you throw in CCFAD's for comparison purposes it's not even apples to oranges.

John:

Please do -- smell the coffee and come out of the self-induced slumber partner.

The issue is not the in-state rate. The issue is the access to those outside NY. Not only has the rate jumped significantly -- but the access was also the issue. Getting a preferred tee time for those not privy to the dial availabilty for NY residents makes a vast difference -- throw in the higher rate and it will have an impact. For those who are New Yorkers they could care a rats ass about that.

[Michael Blake]

Matt,

I agree with you.

Tough to get a tee-time as an out-of-stater, cost too much, round too long.  If it was a fun course then it wouldn't matter.  But BPB isn't a fun enough course (or at all for that matter) for me to bother with.  

[Matt_Ward]

Michael:

You are right to mention the other item -- the zombie-like crawl when playing the Black. Years ago most people avoided the Black because of the demands -- now you have choppers who have $$ and believe they can "handle" the Black. Six plus hours later they finally make it to the clubhouse.

[John Moore II]

Matt-From what I have heard about the Black, even access to the phone tee times would not help out of state golfers get on the course all that readily. I would say that as of now, the access to the Black, for out of state people, is pretty much the same as access to any of the other top end clubs.

And you are right, its not really correct to compare the Black to CCFAD's, but the Black is unique. There are no publicly owned courses that are nearly as good as the Black, as best I can tell. So, there is really no way to compare it to other courses as far as fees go. I know Pound Ridge and Saratoga National are reputed by some to be very good courses, and they both charge more than the black, but again, those are not municipal courses. There is no way to compare the Black to other courses, its in a category of its own.

[Mac Plumart]

Matt, I don't think I am missing the point.  In fact, I asked what it costs elsewhere to play.  To start the discussion, I used local area public courses as that is what I know.  But since you didn't answer and/or respond with prices, I'll post...

Torrey Pines South...$73 for San Diego resident; $218 non-resident

Chambers Bay...$109 resident weekend, $175 non-resident weekend

Indian Wells...$35 resident, $100 non-resident

I believe these are apples to apples as they are all muni's.

Again, I think Bethpage is a pretty good deal price-wise.  But, again, I see your point...prices are going up.  However, my understanding is the course is always packed...so business 101 says raises prices even more.  But it is a muni, so they won't.  That is my point.

You seem to want to simply argue rather than discuss.  Have at it.  I am done.  

[PCCraig]

Matt-

I have no idea why you find this to be a big deal. How often do the "locals" even play the course? Once a week tops? $75 for a top 50 golf course on a weekend is a steal in any part of the country, esp. NYC where you can't even have decent italian and a bottle of wine for two for less than that.

As for the out of State guys, $150 is still cheap. Those players probably come in to play the course once a year at the most, most times it's a once a decade kind of thing.

[Matt_Ward]

Pat:

I'll say this again -- for those who are NYers the rates will not impacy them that much. It was a political and financial move to place the onus on those who are outsiders and not NY residents. Try calling the line when outsiders can for a tee time -- good luck. Play Mega ball for better results. Throw in the higher fee and then combine that with the six hour zombie crawl and it makes perfect sense to me to avoid the place.

Mac:

Lose the sand box routine -- when things don't work out your way you then pronouce to people you're out of here.

Rabbits ears don't belong on a blog site. I have discussed -- you have interpreteted disagreement with your original take as just being argumentative for argumentative sake. That's not the case.

Here's what you don't know about Bethpage -- the '02 decision to keep rates affordable was part of the decision for the USGA to pump in the $$ they did. The rates have gone up -- comparing them to CCFAD's which you did initially with Pinehurst #2, Bandon,PB and TPC/Sawgrass is night and day.

You also mentioned a few other CCFAD courses as well in the GA area. I'm glad other courses have lower rates -- hats of to them.

Bethpage raised its rates and frankly the place is not worth the effort when you factor in the six hour predictable crawl. You also can't get through for a decent tee time after NYers have had their fill. So you hit two ways -- limited access and much higher rates. For those of limited means it essentially makes the Black a de facto private course.

Hope the further info I have provided helps.

[Richard Hetzel]

The thought of sleeping in my car overnight in June does not seem too pleasing, and to pay more for it. Any NY'er want to secure a tee time for me and my buddy?

I will still go anyway, sleeping the car is a part of the experience. Did they raise the prices on the other courses there as well? It still beats what Pound Ridge wants...

PS: $150 might be a steal considering I just paid $197 to play Caledonia and was forced to ride.

[John Moore II]

Matt-My offer still stands. Make a morning tee time during the week, sometime in July or August, and I'll pay your extra fee over last years, the booking fee, and my fee. And I'll be glad to meet you and play 18 with you.

[Matt_Ward]

John:

Thanks for the offer -- just tell me how we move away the sheep (excuse me the golfers) who simply clog up the place and debate whether the 4th or 5th ball they hit off the tee is the one in play !

The Black has been overriden with players -- save for the early morning groups -- who play golf there because of the fanfare tied to the place. Mgmt has longed talked about the crawl from mid-morning on but little is done. Even weekdays are not that much better if at all.

[Mark Woodger]

i am an NYC resident and getting a weekend tee time is a nightmare if not impossible. I understand why its that way its just frustrating.

Personally i hope the higher rates put some people off and it makes it easier for me. I doubt it will but one can hope.

[Matthew Petersen]

I still don't understand how raising prices makes it less likely that non-NYers can get tee times. Everyone seems to agree it was all but impossible for non-NYers to get tee times before the rates went up.

And, as to the rate increase itself, it's hard for me to feel too bad for you. Here in Arizona the majority of our state parks are now closed more often than not and I have to par $45 to play the local muni that was built on a landfill.

[Jeff Evagues]

I live 30 minutes away and I have better things to do with 6 hours of my time. (like play 2 rounds out east)

[John Moore II]

John:

Thanks for the offer -- just tell me how we move away the sheep (excuse me the golfers) who simply clog up the place and debate whether the 4th or 5th ball they hit off the tee is the one in play !

The Black has been overriden with players -- save for the early morning groups -- who play golf there because of the fanfare tied to the place. Mgmt has longed talked about the crawl from mid-morning on but little is done. Even weekdays are not that much better if at all.

So make the tee time at about 730 or 8 am and we won't have to worry as much about the sheep.

[Matt_Ward]

John:

Sad to say the sheep have infected so many days / times at the Black that there is no guarantee. Unfortunately much of the problem comes from the courses et-up -- the fairways are too narrow for Joe Sixpack and company and the rough is kept too long and overly dense.

The Black's terrain is more than sufficient to weed out ineffectual players but when combined with the elements I just mentioned and almost no oversight by course personnel on how the pace is proceeding you get the final result of six hours -- plus the addd $$ to pay.

John, how bout this -- we play the Red as our alternative. Maybe we can get a few other GCAers to join us !

[John Moore II]

Matt: I'd be happy to play the Red as well. But NYC is too long a drive for me to not play the Black. Its roughly an 8 hour drive for me. The Red just isn't worth that by itself, get what I am saying? But hey, even at a 6 hour pace, we could play both in a single day during the summer.

[Tags:]

Tags:

[Tags:]

Tags:

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()