[Richard Choi]

So one out of a few hundred and you decide to paint them all as serial cheaters because they're powerful?  OK... 

And if you read Warren Buffett's bio, you know that he had a very complicated relationship with his wife and Warren recently married his mistress.

I only know very few members and that is 2 out of those few. I would say the hit rate is pretty high.

[Richard Choi]

I forgot, Jack Welch is also an Augusta Member, and he went through a very PUBLIC and messy divorce. I don't remember Payne admonishing him either.

Should I keep going down the list?

[David_Elvins]

Dschmidt,

do you think the chairman of augusta national would have talked down to the world's number 1 golfer in the same way if he was white?    

Or is there still a culture there where it is more acceptable to tell off a black (or blackish)  man?

[Richard Choi]

Richard, I respect defense of the indefensible as much as anybody, but you might want to just admit that your sample is too small to draw conclusions from.  A black kid stole my bike once.  That doesn't make them all criminals.

I really can go down the list and bring more, but I don't think that is going to mean much to you.

But let say for your argument, the sample is too small. But if there are only 3 known examples of bad behavior. Why single out just one? Why not treat all the members the same way?

[Bob_Huntley]

So one out of a few hundred and you decide to paint them all as serial cheaters because they're powerful?  OK... 

And if you read Warren Buffett's bio, you know that he had a very complicated relationship with his wife and Warren recently married his mistress.

I only know very few members and that is 2 out of those few. I would say the hit rate is pretty high.

Richard what is the over and under on the number of our gallant 1500 who  have not had an extra-marital affair in the distant, or recent past?

Bob

[Jud_T]

Richard what is the over and under on the number of our gallant 1500 who  have not had an extra-marital affair in the distant, or recent past?

Bob

Richard, while you're at it:  how many of our gallant 1500 have had north of 50 or whatever Tiger's real number is?  

Shiv,

The real question is how many of our 1500 if they were the best, most recognizable athlete on the planet, had more money than god and had beautiful, available women throwing themselves at him at every available opportunity would be able to abstain completely from temptation....

[Richard Choi]

Richard what is the over and under on the number of our gallant 1500 who  have not had an extra-marital affair in the distant, or recent past?

Bob

Richard, while you're at it:  how many of our gallant 1500 have had north of 50 or whatever Tiger's real number is?  

My over/under would be 12!!!

[Carl Johnson]

I forgot, Jack Welch is also an Augusta Member, and he went through a very PUBLIC and messy divorce. I don't remember Payne admonishing him either.

Should I keep going down the list?

Please do.

[JC Jones]

I think you are all missing the point entirely.  Tiger's philandering and subsequent "treatment" and come back have become more important than the tournament itself.  When it is Masters week, the Masters is the most important story, period.  Now, the tournament has become the Honda Classic because everything is about Tiger.  Mr. Payne, I'm sure, was trying to make the point that Tiger is there because Augusta National invites him there and therefore, the tournament and the club are more important and bigger than he is.

[Carl Johnson]

I think you are all missing the point entirely.  Tiger's philandering and subsequent "treatment" and come back have become more important than the tournament itself.  When it is Masters week, the Masters is the most important story, period.  Now, the tournament has become the Honda Classic because everything is about Tiger.  Mr. Payne, I'm sure, was trying to make the point that Tiger is there because Augusta National invites him there and therefore, the tournament and the club are more important and bigger than he is.

I think you are right about this.  There is no doubt but that Augusta National, the Masters and Mr. Payne are the most important things in golf.  They (including the entire club membership) can do no wrong.  Without Augusta National and the Masters, golf, as we know it, would cease to exist.  On the other hand, sure, they did not have to invite Tiger.  However, having invited him, then shouldn't Mr. Payne have treated him with more respect?  That's just not a classy way to treat a guest.  Maybe Mr. Payne has the Tiger syndrome himself -- thinking that he's so important that no one could possibly question anything he does.

[Jud_T]

I'd love to see how much esteem their little tournament would have if they didn't invite the best golfer in the world for several years running....

[George Pazin]

I think you are all missing the point entirely.  Tiger's philandering and subsequent "treatment" and come back have become more important than the tournament itself.  When it is Masters week, the Masters is the most important story, period.  Now, the tournament has become the Honda Classic because everything is about Tiger.  Mr. Payne, I'm sure, was trying to make the point that Tiger is there because Augusta National invites him there and therefore, the tournament and the club are more important and bigger than he is.

If so, wouldn't it have been more effective to simply say, I'm only discussing golf and The Masters, rather than bringing up Tiger's personal life? Seems to me he made Tiger's problems as big or bigger than the tourney.

[TEPaul]

Actually to me the most interesting facet of this Payne statement thing and the uproar it created is how much Tiger Woods probably limited a much larger uproar in the way he responded to the two questions about it yesterday after his round (one from Mike Terico in Butler Cabin and the other in Wood's post round press conference).

He simply said (when asked if he had spokent to Payne) that he had spoken with Payne and he was very disappointed in himself as well and just left it at that and went to the next question!  

[Patrick_Mucci]

I'd love to see how much esteem their little tournament would have if they didn't invite the best golfer in the world for several years running....

Jud,

The Masters doesn't need Tiger Woods.

Is it better with him ?   Absolutely, but, the game and The Masters is bigger than any one golfer who plays it.

The Masters isn't a "little tournament"  it's a MAJOR, and the best major when it comes to production to the public.

The Masters was prominent, a major before Tiger and it will be prominent and a major after Tiger.

Unfortunately, the media created this frenzy and is perpetuating this frenzy

[JMEvensky]

I'd love to see how much esteem their little tournament would have if they didn't invite the best golfer in the world for several years running....

The Masters was prominent, a major before Tiger and it will be prominent and a major after Tiger.

This.

[Bill Brightly]

Yet Tiger's "indiscretions" have turned out to be so indiscreet that they are the 500-pound elephant in the room. No CEO or former Masters champ has ever been outed in such an embarrassing way. Payne almost had to comment, and the unspoken message to Tiger was, "We don't do loose-lipped pancake waitresses, porn stars, hookers and party hostesses who will go to the National Enquirer for $10,000."

Yep, if he had just kept it to Rachel Uchitel...

[Bob_Huntley]

I forgot, Jack Welch is also an Augusta Member, and he went through a very PUBLIC and messy divorce. I don't remember Payne admonishing him either.

Should I keep going down the list?

Please do.

I forgot, Jack Welch is also an Augusta Member, and he went through a very PUBLIC and messy divorce. I don't remember Payne admonishing him either.

Should I keep going down the list?

Please do.

Richard,

What happened in Jack Welch's case could have happened to any one of us. It wasn't necessarily about extra-marital sex it was about money, big money. His soon to be ex-wife knew all about the hidden perks and humungous chunks of money to be had and exposed it in discovery.

God help us all if a divorce, because of single dalliance, becomes "messy" because of a disagreement over alimony. Acrimonious yes, "messy" no.


Bob

[Patrick_Mucci]

Bill Brightly,

If that was the case, then they'd have to disqualify a good number of former winners.

PLEASE, stop with this nonsense.

These guys are YOUNG world class athletes, away from home every weekend, and the target of a zillioin women.

Just travel with a Professional team for one weekend and you'll understand what goes on in the world.

When Vince Lombardi was appointed coach of the Redskins he called a team meeting and told the players to bring their wives/girlfriends.

They thought this was nice.

They brought their wives/girlfriends and Lombardi snookered them all by announcing that he would NEVER hold a team meeting/function/practice the NIGHT before a home game, and that he would NO LONGER sequester the players at a Hotel the night before a home game, and that he wanted all the players to spend the evening at home with their families.

He was smart, he knew he couldn't police the entire team, so he ceded that responsibility to the wives/girlfriends.

Prior to Lombardi's switcheroo, Saturday nights before home games were party nights/mornings for the players.
I know, I was at a good number of them.
Good times were had by all.
Having a wife or a girlfriend, or both, meant nothing in a target rich environment.

If a player/golfer isn't breaking the law or endangering anyone, it's NO ONE's business what he does with his time away from an event, whether anyone likes it or not.

[TEPaul]

"Re: Payne's Comments Today !!!
« Reply #44 on: Yesterday at 10:38:47 AM » Quote  

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yet Tiger's "indiscretions" have turned out to be so indiscreet that they are the 500-pound elephant in the room. No CEO or former Masters champ has ever been outed in such an embarrassing way. Payne almost had to comment, and the unspoken message to Tiger was, "We don't do loose-lipped pancake waitresses, porn stars, hookers and party hostesses who will go to the National Enquirer for $10,000."

Maybe he could have told Tiger that in private, but now he's on the record. I'm sure the case is now closed, unless Tiger chooses to re-open it."



Rich Shefchik:

You're right, if Chairman Payne was so concerned just about Tiger Woods' egregious personal indiscretions that the whole world has known about for months and its affect on our children and grandchildren and all that type of public "family value" baloney, he sure could have told that to Tiger Woods in private!

So why didn't he?

It's probably not that hard for the Chairman of ANGC to find Tiger on the property on Tuesday or Wednesday and have a private chat with him. For Christ Sakes, if ANGC's Chairman Payne felt that way why didn't he just call up Woods months ago and have that conversation with him in private then? It's not as if they don't know each other and it's not that he didn't realize Woods would return to The Masters.

Sometimes I think all these people need to hire themselves some sensible public relations outfit (if one actually exists today) who might teach them the microphone is not always the best way to deliver a message to the person in question.

Or they could all just find themselves a good old fashioned MOTHER imbued with a traditional sense of manners and discretion who could explain to them all the right and wrong thing to do in a medium sized sentence.

[JC Jones]

Tom,

The reports say that Tiger and Mr. Payne had a conversation on Sunday afternoon.  My guess is that Tiger was not surprised when Mr. Payne made his comments.  So it is likely this was all hashed out days before.

[TEPaul]

"Tom,
The reports say that Tiger and Mr. Payne had a conversation on Sunday afternoon.  My guess is that Tiger was not surprised when Mr. Payne made his comments.  So it is likely this was all hashed out days before."


JC:

I had no heard that but I hope so. If that was the case and the catechism Woods knew before the fact that he was going to have to go through this week with that public statement of Chairman Payne's then I am a bit more OK with Chairman Payne's "public" statement about Woods.

[Matt_Ward]

I find it so amusing that a place like ANGC - which embodies the same "control freak" tendencies that Tiger is accused of being then decides to play Moses from the top of the mountain and proclaim what should be done.

Tiger has certainly demonstrated his failings but for Payne and his cohorts to believe they are the owners of the moral compass is comical given all the pratfalls so many of the upper echelon crust types routinely commit.

[JESII]

Matt,

Payne would have been speaking for himself and the club...not each club member's personal lives, nor the "upper echelon crust types" in total. In that context he did what you and your's have failed to do. Recognize and address the problem and set a course going forward.

No hero worship, and no condecension in my view...just direct commentary that's been lacking.

[George Pazin]

Matt,

Payne would have been speaking for himself and the club...not each club member's personal lives, nor the "upper echelon crust types" in total. In that context he did what you and your's have failed to do. Recognize and address the problem and set a course going forward.

No hero worship, and no condecension in my view...just direct commentary that's been lacking.

That's where I disagree. I think more people need to learn the phrase "That's none of my business" and have that be the course going forward. If Tiger wants to address it, that's fine; I don't see where anyone else needs to address another's private life  - failings or successes - to set the course going forward.

[Niall C]

George

Thats fine as far as it goes but what seems to have got a lot of people on here upset is being sold a lie. If its none of our business then why did we get the family man thing thrown at us, and why the new Nike ad with his dad ?

Niall

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