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George Pazin

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Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #50 on: April 05, 2010, 11:47:57 AM »
It seems people are just hung up on the semantics. No one (other than me... :)) has attempted to define vastly inferior.

Look at it this way: If you go from having to beat 20 guys while playing your best to having to beat 2 or 3 guys while playing your best, to me, that's a pretty significant drop-off in the level of competition. As I said earlier, it's not saying these guys aren't great golfers, they're just not the top of the top of the top. Almost every year some new 50 year old comes out and starts winning a lot, at least in comparison to his time immediately prior on the regular tour - that's meaningless to you guys?

If one is hung up on the term vastly inferior and prefer to say the fields are less competitive, well, have at it, have fun, congrats, I've never been a fan of semantic arguments, but the meanings are essentially the same.

As for when Freddie loses, that's just the nature of golf: No one (other than Tiger) is competitive all the time. It's not tennis, where the best guy wins the overwhelming majority of the time. Even Tiger, arguably the best ever, unarguably the best of the last 20 years, only wins 25% of his events. (But I bet he'd win a helluva lot more against the seniors....)
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Andy Hodson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #51 on: April 05, 2010, 12:54:50 PM »
George, Garland

Maybe we can let this topic slide off the first page with this: I don't think its entirely semantics here. Depth of good players in a field does not mean, by definition, that the best in the field are not quality players. My argument is that the guys Couples has beaten are quality players (and have been their whole career) and/or played to a very high level that week. He's not beating chumps, or winning by 10 each time.

As with most good discussions, the main point has morphed into another topic. But my main point was that Couples was winning because of different reasons than "vastly inferior" competition.

So, Butler or Duke?  ;)

George Pazin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #52 on: April 05, 2010, 01:07:31 PM »
Duke, that was easy. If the two teams play anything like Saturday, it will be one of the bigger blowouts in recent years. But hey, that's why they play the game!

The reason I see it as a semantic argument is that your comment about relative lack of depth in fields equates to vastly inferior competition to me, due to the nature of the sport of golf. Sure you have some tremendously gifted golfers on the senior tour, but the nature of golf is that success is only fleeting. When the fields are so much less deep, you will by definition have fewer competitive guys. This results in domination for a few guys. It's not because the players themselves are vastly inferior, but the end result is the same.

I'll be happy to let you have the last word, if you choose, or let it slide to page 2, if you prefer. :)
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Andy Hodson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #53 on: April 05, 2010, 01:20:32 PM »
Duke? Duke???

Are you saying that Butler is vastly inferior?

I say if Duke wins, its because they only have to beat one, ONE, other team! ;D

Enough...let's find another thread of interest....

Peace

George Pazin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #54 on: April 05, 2010, 01:21:21 PM »
Define vastly inferior...

Peace out.
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

Joe Bausch

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #55 on: April 05, 2010, 01:25:46 PM »
What is the key to Freddie Couples year?

Making sure to stay on good terms with the receptionists at his bank.  They might start getting tired of all those big cardboard checks he'll be depositing all season long!   ;)
@jwbausch (for new photo albums)
The site for the Cobb's Creek project:  https://cobbscreek.org/
Nearly all Delaware Valley golf courses in photo albums: Bausch Collection

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #56 on: April 05, 2010, 02:50:46 PM »
How is this for a definition of vast? Last year Freddie played on the regular tour. There were a vast number of golfers that finished above him in the events he entered. Take that vast number of golfers and put them on the senior tour. Guess what happens! Freddie does not win on the senior tour either.

Over and out.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Andy Hodson

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Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #57 on: April 05, 2010, 04:32:25 PM »
Garland, Garland, Garland,

Now you know that argument doesn't hold water. All those vast golfers are not the same week in and week out. And all of them finished a tournament where there was a vast number of players who finished ahead of them, and so on and so on and.....

The original question was, ''what is the key to Couples' year''. I happen to think he is playing better due to better putting, shorter courses, lower rough, etc., not because of the competition. Is that so hard to take in......

i guess so.

Andy Hodson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #58 on: April 08, 2010, 10:08:49 AM »
Its early, yes.....

But I like how the vastly inferior players are faring at Augusta so far ;D

Steve Strasheim

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #59 on: April 08, 2010, 01:56:59 PM »
Holy crap!

Did Freddie really start birdie, eagle, eagle?

Sean Leary

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #60 on: April 08, 2010, 02:13:41 PM »
I think it was wrong...

Steve Strasheim

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #61 on: April 08, 2010, 03:05:41 PM »
I think it was wrong...

LOL, yep pgatour.com had him with a 3-3-2 start atop the leaderboard at -5 when I checked.

They've since corrected to a 3-4-4 start.

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #62 on: April 08, 2010, 04:25:14 PM »
Why are you guys watching old data at pgatour.com when you could watch the most up to date data at masters.com?
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #63 on: April 08, 2010, 06:20:24 PM »
I see how this is going. Freddie will be there on Sunday to keep Tom loose for the win.
 :D
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Carl Nichols

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #64 on: April 08, 2010, 06:21:08 PM »
he didn't start birdie, eagle, eagle, but he's still winning.  so the current leader and one of the guys right behind him are on the Senior Tour. :o

Matthew Petersen

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #65 on: April 08, 2010, 06:29:04 PM »
Yawn. This Masters leaderboard looks just like the Champions Tour event at Hualalai.

Chris Flamion

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #66 on: April 08, 2010, 06:40:21 PM »
Freddie's secret has to be the shoes.  That and the massive amount of confidence that comes from making every putt he steps over.


Andy Hodson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #67 on: April 08, 2010, 07:45:06 PM »
What is wrong with the Masters...

This is the most vastly inferior field I've ever seen  :o ;D


David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #68 on: April 08, 2010, 09:47:06 PM »
Chris Flamion hit the nail on the head. The key to Freddie's success is his funky, spikeless ECCO shoes!  :D

Bill_McBride

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #69 on: April 08, 2010, 09:54:24 PM »
Garland, Garland, Garland,

Now you know that argument doesn't hold water. All those vast golfers are not the same week in and week out. And all of them finished a tournament where there was a vast number of players who finished ahead of them, and so on and so on and.....

The original question was, ''what is the key to Couples' year''. I happen to think he is playing better due to better putting, shorter courses, lower rough, etc., not because of the competition. Is that so hard to take in......

i guess so.

IF his back is okay - BIG IF - and makes some putts - another BIG IF - Freddie can beat the field.  Any level, any time.

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #70 on: April 08, 2010, 10:53:24 PM »
I am proud to say that I own a pair of Freddie's ECCO shoes. They are very comfortable but I'm not in contention at The Masters.  ;D
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Garland Bayley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #71 on: April 09, 2010, 12:51:35 AM »
The shoes, the shoes, I've been thinking about the shoes for some time. Last year Rob Rigg came to my course, played with me, and shot about a gazillion. His next round, he forgot his shoes, went out and shot 74 at PRGC. He credited the shoes. My primary reference on how to play the game is Sam Snead's book, who preaches it all comes to your connection with the ground. I had been thinking the modern golf shoe removes you too far from the ground. Therefore, after Rob's report I went out and bought a pair of Sketchers with a tread on the bottom that I thought might work on the golf course. Unfortunately, being regular street shoes, I have not taken them out on the course in the wet fall through spring here in the PNW. I am itching to try them on the course once it dries out. I grew up wearing shoes, but often played barefoot just to feel the grass and the ground with my feet. I felt I played pretty well barefoot, but didn't make any controlled measurements.

And Andy, I predict Freddie will not win the Masters.
"I enjoy a course where the challenges are contained WITHIN it, and recovery is part of the game  not a course where the challenge is to stay ON it." Jeff Warne

Andy Hodson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #72 on: April 09, 2010, 09:40:43 AM »
I don't think Fred will win either, although what a story that would be.

My defense was not of Fred, but of his competition. In some sort of way, after yesterday, I feel stronger in my argument. The over 50 set played pretty well, no?

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #73 on: April 09, 2010, 09:48:23 AM »
I would not wear those shoes on wet grass. They are great on the desert courses or any fast and firm course.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2010, 10:01:19 AM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: What is the key to Freddie Couples year?
« Reply #74 on: April 09, 2010, 09:59:35 AM »
Winning. That might sound like the cart before the horse, but it's not like he hasn't tasted victory in the past, and being the top gun on the Senior Tour is good for his pysche.



 
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon