[TEPaul]

"Was Sharp Park constructed as part of a public works program?"


Tom MacWood:

I wouldn't think so since Sharp Park GC was created between 1931-32 and the federal public works program did not even begin until June of 1933 and I doubt California had a public works program before the federal governement did. I think Sharp Park was created by the town of Pacifica and I believe the site had been used for something like onion farming. I was given a book while there recently about the history of Sharp Park and Pacifica but at the moment I can't find it.

[Tom MacWood]

Here are a couple of early views of Lawsonia - holes #10 and #14.

[Tom MacWood]

Here is Daniel Wexler's rendering of Jacksonville Municipal, and a view of one of the greens.

[Carl Johnson]

Tom,

Not sure exactly what is going on with this thread, but I'd suggest adding Carolina Golf Club (1929) - Ross (Charlotte, NC) to your list if you find that it qualifies.  The course was opened for public play in 1929 as a daily fee course, not a "club" inspite of the name.  It was not municipal, but rather privately (family) owned.  Anyone could walk up, pay their money, and play, assuming the "right" color of the skin.  Other than the Ross architecture, probably its greatest claim to historical fame is that it is where Charlie Sifford caddied and learned to play the game. Reference: http://www.answers.com/topic/charlie-sifford. In the late 1950s the owners decided to get out of the golf course business and sold the course to a group who turned it into a private golf club, which it remains today.

Now, that's the story I know.

[Dan Herrmann]

Tom M - Did Sharp Park involve reclaiming some land from the sea?

[Mike Cirba]

Was Sharp Park constructed as part of a public works program?

Tom,

Yes.   Sharp Park was constructed IN ENTIRETY as part of a public works program.

There is a very good and valid reason that I stated “until the Depression”, when I made my comparison, as I’ve explained repeatedly, and which has been repeatedly and inexplicably ignored by you and David.

After the Stock Market Crash of 1929, the impact was almost immediate, and in the ensuing years through WWII a lot of things happened to public golf courses, some very good and some very bad.

When all was said and done, and peace was restored in the mid-1940s, Bethpage Black emerged as the best and most demanding public course in the land.

Following please find the story of the creation of Sharp Park as documented as it happened.   Although some may contend that it was the “best” public course in the country when it opened in 1932, it’s tougher to argue that it was the most demanding, because even though Cobb’s Creek was criticized here earlier as too short at 6400 yards, par 71 when it hosted the 1928 US Publinks, Sharp Park was just over 6,100 yards, also par 71 and low scores of 73 and 74 were fired already on opening day with just local play.   Compared against a 1928 US Public Links medal score of 152 at Cobb’s in perfect weather, these were low scores indeed.

Perhaps this is why when the US Public Links tournament came to San Francisco in 1937, it was held at Harding Park, and not Sharp Park?

Nevertheless, the course from aerials and diagrams looks very intriguing indeed, and I hope you enjoy reading about the true story of the creation of Sharp Park.

11/21/1929



11/27/1929



03/09/1930



05/17/1930

 

09/29/1930



07/31/1931



04/16/1932



04/18/1932



03/28/1935



10/07/1936



01/23/1941

[Mike Cirba]

After reading the articles above, I wonder how the rumor started that Sharp Park lost so many original holes a few months after opening?

It almost had a decade long run in its original Mackenzie/Egan configuration.

[Tom MacWood]

After reading the articles above, I wonder how the rumor started that Sharp Park lost so many original holes a few months after opening?

It almost had a decade long run in its original Mackenzie/Egan configuration.

You mean the rumor you started earlier on this thread?

[Mike Cirba]

No Tom, the rumor that appears in Tom Doak's Mackenzie book,

What does Dan Wexler's book say?

[Tom MacWood]

No Tom, the rumor that appears in Tom Doak's Mackenzie book,

What does Dan Wexler's book say?

I thought you said the course fell into the sea earlier on this thread. Its kind of hard for a course at sea level to fall anywhere. You had SP confused with Olympic.

By the way the first mention of the public works program is 7.31.1931, when funds were used to complete the golf course. The golf course was proposed, planned and designed in 1929-30; and it had nothing to do with a work program. Nice try though.

[Mike Cirba]

Tom,

The only thing taking on water and falling off a cliff faster than Sharp Park is your argument for including courses after 1929!  

You asked me,
Was Sharp Park constructed as part of a public works program?

You really need to read more carefully.  The ENTIRE construction, start to finish of the Sharp Park Municipal Golf Course was a PUBLIC WORKS PROJECT funded to combat the effects of the Great Depression
.

October 29th, 1929 - The Stock Market Crashes

November 29th, 1929 - Perhaps in denial, or perhaps not yet feeling the effects of the oncoming economic storm, after discussions for the past year the good folks in the San Francisco govt. proposes to spend $100,000 to build the "Best Course in the World" at Sharp Park.

March 9th, 1930, - H. Chandler Egan, perhaps sensing this thing slipping away, boasts in a story covered nationally that the course will be a "Second St. Andrews".

May 17th, 1930, - The city of San Francisco proposes a budget with a tax increase to cover, among other things, proposed spending of now $125,000 to build the golf course at Sharp Park.

July 1931 - To combat the effects of the Great Depression, and to employ people the San Francisco government announces an aggressive list of PUBLIC WORKS PROGRAMS that now includes $200,000 to build the golf course at Sharp Park.

April 16th, 1932 - After being in construction for the past year, the new golf course at Sharp Park opens at a cost now over $300,000.

March, 1935 - An additional $250,000 will be expended in a PUBLIC WORKS PROGRAM at Sharp Park to "reconstruct.. it into a model golfing layout".

For comparison purposes, Cobb's Creek was built for $30,000, which included construction of the two large, two-story clubhouse locker facilities for men and women.


Now, about what happened to Sharp Park, and when.

Tom Doak's excellent and seminal book, "The Life and Work of Dr. Alister Mackenzie", reports;

"Sharp Park was a municipal project located just south of San Francisco in Pacifica at the edge of the ocean.   Jack Fleming was assigned the construction of this course, which involved a considerable amount of earthmoving in order to create artificial dune features, similar to what C.B. Macdonald did at the Lido.   Sharp Park opened in 1931 to substantial acclaim.   A few months later, unfortunately, ocean storms (perhaps an early El Nino) swept over part of the course and wiped out several of the holes.  Today, only the inland greens remain true to Mackenzie's design, and the seaside ambiance was sacrificed when a large dyke was erected to keep the ocean back."

What does Daniel Wexler's book say happened?

[Garland Bayley]

Thanks for the articles on Sharp Park. They only mention Egan. What is MacKenzie's contribution? Documented?

[Mike Cirba]

Garland,

At this time, Egan was a partner in Mackenzie's firm.   I suspect he was the primary architect, although I may be wrong and it's generally best to credit both partners as a matter of course.


p.s.   It's sort of ironic that Mackenzie, who railed against the evils of Socialism, would have one of his final courses built entirely through a government-funded public "make-work" program.  

[Garland Bayley]

...
p.s.   It's sort of ironic that Mackenzie, who railed against the evils of Socialism, would have one of his final courses built entirely through a government-funded public works program.   

That conflicts with what TEP wrote above about it not being public works. Resolution?

[Mike Cirba]

Garland,

Tom Paul was referring to Federal Public Works Programs, like the WPA and CCC.

This was a Public Works Program initiated and funded by the City of San Francisco to combat the Depression.

[Garland Bayley]

Thanks Mike

[DMoriarty]

Mike,

This may come as a surprise to you, but municipal golf courses are generally funded with public funds.  And anything built by the government for the use and enjoyment of the public is considered "public works" whether or not they are built during economic downturns.  For example, Cobbs was a public works project.

The 1935 article that mentions improvements to the buildings, roads, and the planting of trees, and the encampment of 500 unemployed men to do the work;  that sounds like the kind of safety net or "relief" project I think Tom was referring to.  

As for the 1931 article, please point out to me the part where it says that was a program "initiated and funded to combat the Depression." Because I think you just made that part up.   In fact the writer notes that "apparently confidence among public officials and developers of the city has not been impared . . . ." and this hardly sounds like language used to launch a safety net program for the unemployed of San Francisco.

[Mike Cirba]

David,

Tom asked me whether Sharp Park was funded as a Public Works Program, and it's very clear it was.

In fact, not only was it funded as a result of the Great Depression, but with initial cost estimations and construction overruns in the 3-5 hundred%-fold, one could rightfully argue that the entire project was a boondoggle!

Even as late as 1937 the course was taking a loss for the year, economically, and the city had to cover those losses on the books with more tax monies.

Initial proposed monies of $100K in late 1929 were not acted on for obvious reasons after the world economy essentially collapsed.

Six months later, city officials tried to get it funded through a tax increase, except the cost was now estimated at 25% higher.   My how the more things change....

Another year later, and another year deeper in the Great Depression, the city now in spring of 1931 approves several Public Works Programs, including a now additional 60% costs for the course at Sharp Park.

A year later the course opens with cost overruns of over $100,000, to some total above $300,000.

Still not enough, by 1935 another $250K is sunk into building this facility.

And you say this had nothing to do with substantial government jobs funding and the Great Depression??

[Mike Cirba]

In fact, this type of bloated government spending for public courses after the start of the Great Depression, whether you agree with it or not, is PRECISELY WHY I delineated my statement about Cobb's Creek to say "UNTIL the Depression".  

Things got very cloudy after that, and the sheer volume of government monies pumped into building and renovating public golf courses at that time DWARFED anything that had been done prior.

In NYC, not only was Bethpage created, but Robert Moses had John Van Kleek build new public courses and renovate EVERY OTHER NYC municipal course in all five boroughs.   Sharp Park is almost a prototype for this enhanced type of spending, and the same thing happened in Atlanta and other major cities.

THAT is why I made the distinction I did, which you and Tom simply chose to ignore.

[DMoriarty]

Mike

I think you know that Tom was asking whether it was created as part of a relief project.   You can't just pretend every public works project was a relief program.

As I said the 1935 article sounds like a Depression Era relief program.   As for the rest, you are just making stuff up, and (as usual) twisting to suit your needs. 
-- Nowhere does it say it was funded as a result of the Great Depression.
-- You term it "cost overruns" but that too is your twist.   You've no idea the root of the increased cost projections.   Was the later projection covering the same things exactly as the earlier?   You don't know. 
--  You say that the 1929 plan was not acted on for "obvious reasons" after the world economy essentially collapsed.  There is nothing obvious to me about this, and there is nothing obvous about your conclusion that they didn't act on their plan.     Late 1929 SF approved the plan to build a golf course, Mid-1930 the city agrees on how to fund the project, Spring 1932 the course opens.   Sounds like the timing was about right to me.



It is generally pretty easy to tell what was part of a relief program because it was touted as such, for political reasons.

[Mike Cirba]

David,

Sorry, spin however you like but it's over.

At least something good and useful finally came from this thread.

[DMoriarty]

Huh?

I thought we were talking about whether or not Sharp Park was "initiated and funded to combat the Depression," but obviously you are only interested in propping up a few articles, taking them out of context, and pretending you have scored some sort of imaginary victory.   About what I am not sure? It figures.

It is possible that relief project monies were used at Sharp Park at some point.  The 1935 article could definitely be read to indicate this.   But the course was designed in 1929-1930 and built in 1930-31, and I don't see much to indicate that it was part of any relief program.   I guess it is possible and if true it should be easy enough to figure it out, but so far all we know is that it was funded by the city.   Not really news since it is a municipal course.  

[Mike Cirba]

David,

The course wasn't built in 1930.

Funding wasn't even approved until spring 1931.   The course opened in April 1932 after construction of one year.   Given the additional $250,000 worth of work done after that, it's clear it was a big push rush job at over triple the initial projected expenditures just to get it open.

That same time that funding for Sharp Park construction was approved, even the conservative President Hoover was reaching deep within the government Public Works bag to pull out any jobs he could, as reported in this May 1931.   Amazing this isn't considered the start of the New Deal, and more amazing how the Republicans squealed when Roosevelt did more of the same, only with a formalized name.



And if you think it wasn't affecting the Bay Area at that time, you really haven't studied the period very well.

[DMoriarty]

Mike,

Your statement was that the golf course was "initiated and funded as a result of the great depression."  I see no indication of this.

The 1931 article indicates that the course would be finished, implying that construction had already started.   

Was the course initiated as a result of the great depression?   I see no evidence of it.

Was the course funded as a result of the great depression?   Nothing you have produced thus far indicates that this is the case. 

[Mike Cirba]

David,

Construction began after funding was approved in the spring of 1931.

The course opened a year later.

The 1931 article is from July of that year.

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